Upgrading Rig for Crysis 3

[amenx]

AMD CPUs do much better in Crysis 3 vs other games. But I think Intel CPUs allow better scaling for multi-GPU setups.

 

[3DVagabond]

What percentage of the world do you think would benefit more from an AMD "8 core" vs an Intel quad? My guess is this numer is in the single digits judging by the small amount of programs that benefit combined with the smaller number of people who use said programs. So you made a recommendation based on a fringe case. Extremely fringe at that.

I'm not the one talking in absolutes here, you are. You're the one who's implying there's no benefit, and likely none in the foreseeable future. Then you simply dismiss that there are people who would benefit from 8 cores. You are ignoring the fact that games made for the PS4 will be made to run on an 8 core processor. I'm sure they'll run fine on i7's too. It's not that far off, you know.

 

[Jacky60]

Not for games

Yes for games. Many games stream data from HD and if it's slow the game will struggle. Arma 2 is a case in point, having the game on an SSD makes a huge difference.

 

[wand3r3r]

@OP if you haven't already bought the parts (or even if you have) download MSI Afterburner, and look at the GPU usage after playing for a few minutes.

If you are well below 100% you are probably CPU limited (There will be GPU1 and GPU2 usage separately).

Then again you should have the latest beta drivers as Notty pointed out, there was some major bugfixes for Crysis3. It's actually almost pointless to play without them, they claim to increase performance 40% in crossfire.

 

[Tinsley847]

I can't imagine upgrading hardware before, you get the correct driver for a new game. AMD simply has not released a whql driver with Crysis 3 inclusive yet.

I need to buy the parts either way for my 2nd rig. But if I do this all at once. I can upgrade my 1st rig and push its parts to the 2nd one.

So if you put drivers aside , I still needed to spend money.

As far as Intel vs AMD CPU, I have a few days to decide if necessary. You have me listening, because Crysis 3 is not my bread & butter when it comes to hours logged. I also play the ones listed below...

Battlefield 3
Borderlands 2
Starcraft 2
Dead Island
Skyrim
Sniper V2

To be honest, I had no real reason to pick the 8350 other than my last CPU was AMD as well.

Take into consideration that I don't plan on overclocking for the sake of doing it. If I have to in the future, that's one thing. But I want the best stock CPU for now. Not the best one once you buy a 3rd party heat sink and teach yourself about overclocking.


AMD 8350 - $200

Intel i7-3770K - $330
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116501

Intel i7-3970x Extreme - $1049 OMG Gross http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116877&Tpk=3970

So is the i7-3770k what you recommend? At this point I am trusting my wallet to you guys. If the extra money is worth it, ill go for it.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Battlefield 3
Borderlands 2
Starcraft 2
Dead Island
Skyrim
Sniper V2

BF3 = Tie

Borderlands 2 = i5

Starcraft 2 = i5

Dead Island = i5

Skyrim = i5

Sniper V2 = Tie



What's your budget, what kind of GPU are you going with (you may have already said)?

i5 > i7 in gaming (virtually the same performance in all but a select few titles where the i7 is ever so slightly faster) for the same reason i5 > 8350 - is your main purpose gaming?

Do you have a micro center nearby?

 

[Durvelle27]

Battlefield 3

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/fx-8350-vishera-review,3328-13.html



Borderlands 2

http://www.legitreviews.com/article/2055/6/


Starcraft 2 & Skyrim

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6396/the-vishera-review-amd-fx8350-fx8320-fx6300-and-fx4300-tested/5

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Battlefield 3

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/fx-8350-vishera-review,3328-13.html



Borderlands 2

http://www.legitreviews.com/article/2055/6/


Starcraft 2 & Skyrim

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6396/the-vishera-review-amd-fx8350-fx8320-fx6300-and-fx4300-tested/5

Those results seem strangely high for all chips.

Was the testing method to avoid AI/Players and look at the sky the entire time?

 

[Face2Face]

I am going to agree with Balla. The 3570K is currently a better gaming CPU than the 8350 - Most people know this and have known this. Who knows what the future will bring? If games start to utilize more cores like Crysis 3, then AMD FX owners should benefit. The IPC differences between a IVY and a Vishera is still pretty huge though.



Tinsley847 - Sorry I didn't know you were going to buy something either way. I think we wanted you to see if you could get better performance from Crysis 3 with a simple driver upgrade rather then spending money.

 

[Tinsley847]

I am going to agree with Balla. The 3570K is currently a better gaming CPU than the 8350 - Most people know this and have known this. Who knows what the future will bring? If games start to utilize more cores like Crysis 3, then AMD FX owners should benefit. The IPC differences between a IVY and a Vishera is still pretty huge though.



Tinsley847 - Sorry I didn't know you were going to buy something either way. I think we wanted you to see if you could get better performance from Crysis 3 with a simple driver upgrade rather then spending money.

No apologies needed. I should have clarified that up front.

@ Balla My main & only purpose is gaming. Also the only piece to the puzzle I already bought is the GPU, HD Radeon 6990.

So, if I'm reading correctly. The actual intel chip you are endorsing is i5-3570K Ivy Bridge 3.4GHz (3.8GHz Turbo) As opposed to the i7-3770k I was looking at on those performence charts.

My main question about that chip. Is will it still be an upgrade for me if I don't plan on overclocking it?

Just as a reminder, I'm currently using the AMD Phenom II X4 965 Processor 3.41 GHz.

As a uninformed gamer, I would assume that since im going from a 3.4 to a 3.4 I'm not really upgrading. But i'm sure i am wrong.

Thanks again to everyone for being so helpful.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Yes about 30-35% more IPC + clock speed boost.

Are you in a hurry? If you don't plan to overclock maybe you should wait another month to see what happens with Haswell.

 

[Termie]

No apologies needed. I should have clarified that up front.

So, if I'm reading correctly. The actual intel chip you are endorsing is i5-3570K Ivy Bridge 3.4GHz (3.8GHz Turbo) As opposed to the i7-3770k I was looking at on those performence charts.

My main question about that chip. Is will it still be an upgrade for me if I don't plan on overclocking it?

Thanks again to everyone for being so helpful.

Yes, the 3570k is the preferred gaming chip based on performance/dollar. It is slightly more expensive than an FX8350, but with both running at stock, the 3570k will beat the 8350 in most games, and also has twice as much overclocking headroom (which isn't important to you). But to make clear - the 3570k is not faster than a 3770k, nor is it the same speed. In every modern game, the 3770k will be slightly faster, but isn't as competitive on the performance/dollar curve.

Also, a stock 3570k will be approximately 50% faster than your CPU. This is not a subtle jump, it's 3 generations-worth of performance. Your CPU was introduced almost four years ago and it wasn't particularly fast then in serious game engines like Far Cry 2: http://www.anandtech.com/show/2819/7

Notice that it was slower than an i7-920 in the original Crysis.

 

[Face2Face]

Also keep in mind if you buy a 3570K and a motherboard with AUTO overclocking it takes all of the guess work out of overclocking. The Asus auto overclocking tool is pretty sweet

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mkGQhE1o2w

You can even do this with the stock fan, factors in thermals as well.

Also - Don't worry about the 3.4Ghz to 3.4Ghz - The gigahertz wars ended long ago - It's mostly about IPC now. The 8350 has about the same IPC as the Phenom II, just with higher clocks and more cores.

 

[crashtech]

I don't think the 3570K will be everyone's darling a year from now. Imo, even those in the Intel camp could recommend a stock E3-1230V2 as a viable choice for the same money as an i5 moving forward for someone who has clearly stated a purpose that will utilize more than 4 threads. Though the 1230's multiplier is locked, it can go 3.5 pretty easily, which makes it a 3770 in all but name. The OP's current rig is not already overclocked, which might give clues. Not everyone wants to go for massive overclocks.

 

[alexruiz]

Late to the party.

OP, with that setup, I would just download and install cat 13.2, download and flash the latest BIOs for the mobo, grab a FX6300, sell the Ph II.

Do the whole MB / CPU upgrade later, the FX6300 with the HD6990 will be good for crysis 3.

 

[Face2Face]

I don't think the 3570K will be everyone's darling a year from now. Imo, even those in the Intel camp could recommend a stock E3-1230V2 as a viable choice for the same money as an i5 moving forward for someone who has clearly stated a purpose that will utilize more than 4 threads. Though the 1230's multiplier is locked, it can go 3.5 pretty easily, which makes it a 3770 in all but name. The OP's current rig is not already overclocked, which might give clues. Not everyone wants to go for massive overclocks.

I think it will be, really depends on how Haswell turns out? Most enthusiast on these forums like to overclock and the E3-1230V2 offers very little in that respect. The extra 2MB of L3 is not enough to sway most enthusiast. OP, won't need to go for massive overclock, but the option will be there 3 years down the road if he wants it. Auto overclocking on boards now is a couple mouse clicks and a 10 minute ordeal. Seems kind of like a no brainer if you ask me.

EDIT:
Opps Just realized that Xeon has Hyper-threading - Then stock for stock the Xeon would be a better buy over the 3570K.

http://ark.intel.com/products/65732/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E3-1230V2-8M-Cache-3_30-GHz

 

[crashtech]

@alexruiz, I made a similar mistake earlier, but it's been shown that his M4A79T Deluxe does not support newer CPUs.

 

[Tinsley847]

You have been such a great help to me. I'm very excited about this project now. Where as before it seemed overwhelming.

Haswell launch from what I read, is set for a June 2nd 2013 release. Even though I'm sure it would be worth it, I don't think I can wait till then to upgrade.

Isnt the Intel® Xeon® Processor E3-1230V2 (8M Cache, 3.30 GHz) a CPU geared for Data Servers? Could it really be better than the 3570k for gaming?

I will start looking at a MB to use with the intel chips. I will post my choices b4 I buy them.

The auto-overclocking MB you mentioned is very intriguing to say the least. I think I will look into that as well.

Thank you again.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

Unless I'm missing something the E3-1230V2 for a non overclocker is a steal.


I have no idea about board compatibility with it though!


I wonder if it will allow 4 additional multipliers like the non k chips... Probably not, but it's basically an i7-3770 non k which is $290 on the egg.

 

[crashtech]

Isnt the Intel® Xeon® Processor E3-1230V2 (8M Cache, 3.30 GHz) a CPU geared for Data Servers? Could it really be better than the 3570k for gaming?

The 1230V2 is essentially an Ivy Bridge i7 with disabled on-board graphics. It's approximately $100 cheaper than a 3770K but you get Hyperthreading, which allows 8 threads to be run. It sure looks like Crysis 3 can use more than 4 threads in many instances. Most 1155 motherboards can utilize the E3 series Xeons just as if they were an i7, but it's always best to seek explicit support from the mobo manufacturer. Lots of them list the E3 Xeon as compatible, it's not a difficult attribute to find.

 

[Gryz]

Imho the i5-3570K has been the cpu of choice for most gamers. With a Z77 motherboard. I bought those (on release day last year). I upgraded from a E8500. I was surprised what an impact it had on some games that I benchmarked before the upgrade (Skyrim and GW2).
Edit: that E3-1230V2 looks good too !

One remark about overclocking. Heat and noise are important to me. I want to overclock, but I don't want more heat and noise. Heat (power) is increased by 2 things: higher frequency and higher voltage. So I wanted to overclock my i5-3570K without changing the voltage. Very easy, you just need to change one setting in your BIOS, the frequency multiplier. I changed it from 34 to 40, without changing the voltage. Running with the stock fan. My machine has been running fine for 6 months now.

I could probably push the multiplier a bit more. By messing with the voltage and other settings, and changing the cpu-cooler. But I don't bother. I don't want the hassle. 4.0 GHz is enough for me.

Now someone will correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the AMD CPUs use a bit more power by default. And overclocking them will make them use even more power. So you'll have to mess more with the settings, and probably have to buy a new cpu-cooler. That was yet another reason for me to pick an Intel cpu over an AMD cpu.

 

[Tinsley847]

Unless I'm missing something the E3-1230V2 for a non overclocker is a steal.


I have no idea about board compatibility with it though!


I wonder if it will allow 4 additional multipliers like the non k chips... Probably not, but it's basically an i7-3770 non k which is $290 on the egg.

So with all that being said. Which of these 2 CPU's would you buy today if you had to choose between them?

I don't know how "non-k" affects me. Also i'm not sure what "disabled on-board graphics" means or how it affects me. The 2 CPU's are essentially the same price, so that's off the table for a deciding factor.

EDIT: I guess keep in mind that MB's with stock OC are still in my realm of possibility. I just don't want to go beyond that atm.

 

[Termie]

So with all that being said. Which of these 2 CPU's would you buy today if you had to choose between them?

I don't know how "non-k" affects me. Also i'm not sure what "disabled on-board graphics" means or how it affects me. The 2 CPU's are essentially the same price, so that's off the table for a deciding factor.

EDIT: I guess keep in mind that MB's with stock OC are still in my realm of possibility. I just don't want to go beyond that atm.

Simply put:

(1) non-k means it is not unlocked for overclocking. The options for overclocking are very limited.
(2) no on-board graphics means the chip does not allow for use of on-board graphics outputs included with the motherboard. For your gaming purposes, the impact is essentially zero.
(3) The E3-1230V2 will be slower than either the 3570k or 3770k in most games, due to its slighly slower clock speed. It may be faster than a 3570k in a few games, particularly the most modern games that use more than four threads.
(4) If you want to consider resale value, I think the 3570k is much more likely to retain a lot of its original value. There's not much of a market for used server chips.

For your purposes, given a budget of ~$230, the 3570k is the much better choice. With a very simple overclock, it will be faster than the 1230V2 in every gaming situation.

 

[Face2Face]

^^ This.

Even in Crysis 3 it's hard to see if the small gains in FPS (3770K vs. 3570K) are attributed to the extra 100Mhz clock speed, 2MB L3 cache or hyper-threading. The difference isn't worth IMO the extra $100.

 

[Tinsley847]

I think I am satisfied with the choice of the 3570k. Now I just need to find a MB with "built in OC". The first one I have found in my search is This.

Any suggestions for someone that knows nothing about OC. I do however know how to work a youtube video &/or tutorial. As long as I understand the terms they use.

EDIT: I just found this one from msi as well...