Upgrading old CPU

[VirtualLarry]

I heard from a friend that is a retired HVAC tech, that he was reading that heatpipes can degrade over a longer period of time. If your existing heatsink has heatpipes, then maybe it needs to be replaced?

 

[Thunder 57]

I heard from a friend that is a retired HVAC tech, that he was reading that heatpipes can degrade over a longer period of time. If your existing heatsink has heatpipes, then maybe it needs to be replaced?

What?? Sorry but that doesn't seem to make any sense. The copper becomes less conductive over time?

 

[VirtualLarry]

What?? Sorry but that doesn't seem to make any sense. The copper becomes less conductive over time?

Heatpipes are a lot more than just "copper tubes". There's a vapor inside them, there's wicking along the tube, etc.

 

[Thunder 57]

Heatpipes are a lot more than just "copper tubes". There's a vapor inside them, there's wicking along the tube, etc.

I'll be dammed, I did not realize that. Learn something new every day I suppose?

 

[Leyawiin]

Easy process of elimination for overheating. Blow out the dust, leave the side panel off, point a housefan at it and run it. If the newly seated HSF is actually turning and still overheats its probably the CPU. If it doesn't overheat you've got your answer - its not getting proper cooling either from the fans you have or possibly a constricted area you have the case in (not enough air flow). Also, if you do have a spare HSF try it. 99% of success in fixing a problem is a process of elimination doing the easy and cheap things first. Never understood asking for advice and then arguing about the solutions offered with "Why would it matter?" "Nothing has changed." "It worked fine before" etc...

 

[VirtualLarry]

Also, if you do have a spare HSF try it. 99% of success in fixing a problem is a process of elimination doing the easy and cheap things first. Never understood asking for advice and then arguing about the solutions offered with "Why would it matter?" "Nothing has changed." "It worked fine before" etc...

Some people are just clueless, I guess.

Take one of my friends. I was helping him troubleshoot an internet connection problem. He's a Firefox user. I asked him to try accessing the internet or that site with IE. Instead of just doing it, he argues with me, and launches into a tirade about why IE sucks, and he'll never use IE. Like I was asking him to switch permanently, rather than just for the purpose of tech support. You know, process of elimination.

 

[UsandThem]

Some people are just clueless, I guess.

Take one of my friends. I was helping him troubleshoot an internet connection problem. He's a Firefox user. I asked him to try accessing the internet or that site with IE. Instead of just doing it, he argues with me, and launches into a tirade about why IE sucks, and he'll never use IE. Like I was asking him to switch permanently, rather than just for the purpose of tech support. You know, process of elimination.

But everyone knows every time someone uses IE, Microsoft funds the killing of a baby seal, man.

 

[Craig234]

Some people are just clueless, I guess.

Well, Larry, I'll leave it up to the moderator about your inappropriate comment - not the first - but you are on the ignore list.

 

[Craig234]

Easy process of elimination for overheating. Blow out the dust, leave the side panel off, point a housefan at it and run it. If the newly seated HSF is actually turning and still overheats its probably the CPU. If it doesn't overheat you've got your answer - its not getting proper cooling either from the fans you have or possibly a constricted area you have the case in (not enough air flow). Also, if you do have a spare HSF try it. 99% of success in fixing a problem is a process of elimination doing the easy and cheap things first. Never understood asking for advice and then arguing about the solutions offered with "Why would it matter?" "Nothing has changed." "It worked fine before" etc...

Well, Leyawiin, there are times that things like 'it worked fine before' are relevant to the isolation tests that make sense for a problem. I could write a rather detailed list of reasons why one approach for diagnosing makes sense over another, but it seems it'd waste at least my time and probably both our time.

But a history of something working can rule out or make unlikely some theories that might be more likely without that history.

I will say, your 'easy process' you describe is not easy at all - quite impractical - in this situation, despite your assumption. Your general principle that isolation is important is correct, but not your assertion that every approach to isolation anyone suggests is correct and should be followed blindly. Let's agree to disagree civilly and thanks for the suggestion to help.

 

[UsandThem]

I will say, your 'easy process' you describe is not easy at all - quite impractical - in this situation, despite your assumption. Your general principle that isolation is important is correct, but not your assertion that every approach to isolation anyone suggests is correct and should be followed blindly. Let's agree to disagree civilly and thanks for the suggestion to help.

From what I can tell, and what I have suggested to you for roughly 3-4 months now I believe, is the same thing he recommended for you to do; Clean out the dust to know for sure.

So is that the part you are unable to do for whatever reason? If that's the case, I will just stay out of your threads where you are having issues.

And to be clear, I am not saying that with any kind of malice or as a "threat". However, since I believe your issue is related to that, I don't want to suggest it anymore if you are unable to do that aspect. It would save my time having to suggest it, and your time not having to answer it over and over.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Blow out the dust, leave the side panel off, point a housefan at it

I will say, your 'easy process' you describe is not easy at all - quite impractical - in this situation

Unless you are physically less-abled, and if so, I'm sorry to hear that. But basic dust-cleaning should not be considered an 'impractical' task by an enthusiast. And if it has become that, then proper maintenance has not been followed.

"Ah well, why do I need to blow out the dust? It worked fine when I got the PC..."

Edit: I worked on a friend's mom's PC, that I had built for her, maybe five years or so ago. It was a Core2 E5200-class chip, 4GB RAM, 500GB HDD, DVD... it was a middle-of-the-road rig back in the day, before SSDs were really a thing.

Anyways, it was shutting off on her, under load primarily. I surmised, without having the opportunity to actually look at, and diagnose, the machine, was that the PSU was marginal, and dying of old-age. (The case was a Sentey slimline case, and newegg reviews were not kind regarding the PSU. Plus, it was riveted into the case.)

However, in the end, it turned out that it was shutting off, only because the stock Intel HSF, which was still spinning properly, was caked with dust. Really deep down in, there was a "coating", that prevented the HSF assembly from "breathing".

Cleaned all of the dust off, and it was good as new.

Edit: And, the BIOS "shutdown temp" had been set, probably by me when I set up the rig, to something fairly low, like 60C or 70C. Not quite sure why I did that.

 

[Craig234]

From what I can tell, and what I have suggested to you for roughly 3-4 months now I believe, is the same thing he recommended for you to do; Clean out the dust to know for sure.

So is that the part you are unable to do for whatever reason? If that's the case, I will just stay out of your threads where you are having issues.

And to be clear, I am not saying that with any kind of malice or as a "threat". However, since I believe your issue is related to that, I don't want to suggest it anymore if you are unable to do that aspect. It would save my time having to suggest it, and your time not having to answer it over and over.

I think your time estimate is off, but no, cleaning out the dust isn't the part that's impractical, and thanks for suggesting what you think will help.

 

[UsandThem]

I think your time estimate is off, but no, cleaning out the dust isn't the part that's impractical, and thanks for suggesting what you think will help.

And you could be right. Your CPU at this point can be damaged. However, CPUs along with RAM, tend to out-live other components. As long as they aren't overclocked too much and have sufficient cooling, they will last a long time.

However, from the pictures you shared, your case was loaded with dust. You clearly had significant dust in your heatsink and fan. So really the question is this: Is your CPU overheating from the dust blocking the heat from dissipating, or is the CPU now damaged from that happening?

The 100% sure fire way to know that is either to clean out the dust or replace the CPU. For me, I'd rather blow out the dust before spending money on a new CPU.

 

[Craig234]

And you could be right. Your CPU at this point can be damaged. However, CPUs along with RAM, tend to out-live other components. As long as they aren't overclocked too much and have sufficient cooling, they will last a long time.

However, from the pictures you shared, your case was loaded with dust. You clearly had significant dust in your heatsink and fan. So really the question is this: Is your CPU overheating from the dust blocking the heat from dissipating, or is the CPU now damaged from that happening?

The 100% sure fire way to know that is either to clean out the dust or replace the CPU. For me, I'd rather blow out the dust before spending money on a new CPU.

My sense is that there was a rather Boolean change in condition, suggesting more a part going bad than a gradual issue like dust overheating. It's an 8 year old system, further suggesting both the likelihood of parts going bad and also years of performing under similar conditions without overheating makes the dust the less likely culprit.

It's rather that it just sort of suddenly started overheating with MMO's. I'm no expert on when CPU's go bad by any means, but it seems likely it's a part going bad for that sort of clear change, and thanks to the CPU temperature monitoring that's possible it's known the CPU has been reaching 121c.

I'm only speculating that reaching that temp might have damaged the CPU but it seems plausible, though I've heard something about it trying to prevent damage by shutting off - and while it is shutting off at that temp, that's an awfully high temp for it to get to.

I think you ask the right question in saying that it's whether you would rather test the dust theory more thoroughly or try a new CPU. I did do some dust cleaning with no effect. I could do more, but I'm suspecting it's more likely the CPU has been damaged so that it overheats now when in higher use.

It's a bit interesting that it's such a clear behavior, and that the damage wasn't worse - catastrophic for the CPU - such that it can function fine for browser type use.

It had seemed likely to have been the thermal paste wearing off - which is quite expected sooner than 8 years and fits the symptoms well - but since new paste had no effect, we have to look at the next things.

One other comment - it doesn't have to be one or the other. It's running hotter than apparently people say it should even for light use - so it could be both hotter from dust and damaged as well heating under higher load.

 

[hackdrag0n]

Just get some air in a can and give it a good blast to free up some of the dust between the fins

 

[Puffnstuff]

A can of compressed air from Walmart isn't too expensive and only takes a few seconds to use to blow out the dust bunnies our of your hsf, ps and gpu.