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Question Upgrade soon, or wait?

Sonikku

Lifer
Jun 23, 2005
15,705
4,378
136
I'm a gamer and while I thought my 9600k was a decent processor, I came to experience first hand the disadvantages in games like far cry that punished systems for only having 6 threads when it and other games seem to want 8. Never the less, upgrading to Ryzen now seemed like a bad idea on account of current motherboards being at the very end of their lifespan and an entirely new generation, requiring a completely new motherboard, is seemingly coming next year. And yet, I was reminded of feeling this same way just a year ago, when I passed on $500 2080ti cards thinking the "smart" money was waiting for a 30 series card. A year later and I'm still on an old 1080ti lamenting my choice despite what appeared to be the safer bet at the time.

And then I see a lot of Ryzen 5000 chips and motherboards are starting to see deep discounts, likely due to their being at the tail end of their generation. And then there's the fact that AMD has limited infrastructure for cranking out hardware at a fast enough clip for demand and demand is sure to be sky high with the dawn of the next generation of motherboards. So the question is, with a semiconductor shortage that's looking to last for years and what appears to be a total breakdown in the supply chain as well as many other economic factors, would it actually make sense to get a new mobo/cpu/ram build now or should I wait for next gen?
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
18,167
7,073
136
AM4 may see more life courtesy of Zen3D. dGPU availability will not improve much until next year, sadly. Probably by May or June, or perhaps a little earlier.
 

SAAA

Senior member
May 14, 2014
527
119
116
Waiting a bit would net you either Alder or Zen 4 with 40% or higher IPC than a 9600k, something considerable once in a while and not the usual 5-10%.
A discounted Zen 3 right now would be optimal if you jump up with the thread count too, maybe a 12 core to keep up for a few years with the increasing requirements.
I mean, after Alder comes Raptor with more small cores, Zen 5 will have big-small too... definitely an up trend as far as threads go and you won't like being at the low end of the curve by 2022-2025.

Personally I would wait as the system you have isn't bad (unless you want ray-tracing or the like) and in a year you'll see Alder, Zen 4 and all the new GPUs (even from Intel that probably will help lowering prices... if they mine decently).
 

DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator and Elite Member
Moderator
Aug 22, 2001
23,253
5,094
146
Why suffer bad performance any longer than you have to? You waited before and got burned, why risk it again? The conventional logic in forums is always wait. I don't care which gen we are in, everyone is always saying wait for this or that. You were correct in your analysis; things have gone to hell, and there is no way of knowing what pricing and availability will look like. AMD 5 series was hard to buy at MSRP for a good while. Demand for Intel 12th gen may do the same thing. Or the pricing may suck, or both.

I would maximize bang for buck. I see 9900 series on Ebay for $300 or so. Buy a cooler that can handle it, and get to 32GB of ram if you are not already there. Then settle in. It will still be a long time before a 9900+1080ti is on the struggle bus for gaming. Sell the 9600K to finance the cooler and ram, and you are all set for around $300. Then you can hold out until the GPU market settles down. Some say next year, but several prominent industry leaders have speculated this could go on until 2023. Regardless, that 1080ti will be fine until then.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
52,241
7,058
126
I might personally say "don't wait", and look for used Zen2 3900X / 3950X CPUs, from those whom have upgraded to 5000-series Ryzen. Get a modern mobo that can take both Zen2 / Zen3 and the upcoming Zen3D chips. Get 32GB (min) DDR4-3200/3600. Wait it out on the GPU front.
 
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nosurprises

Member
Jan 4, 2021
75
39
51
I'm not sure if you'll gain a lot seeing this video:

The 9900K is about the same gaming performance as the AMD 5800x. I don't think it's worth the money to upgrade everything at this point. If I were you, I would upgrade to 9900K if that difference in framerate bothers me. 16GB should be enough if you're just playing games, but if multitask while playing games, then you need more. Check RAM and pagefile usage while playing games; upgrade if it's not enough.
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
18,167
7,073
136
So 16gb of ram isn't enough any more?
32GB is pretty cheap now.

16GB should be enough if you're just playing games, but if multitask while playing games, then you need more. Check RAM and pagefile usage while playing games; upgrade if it's not enough.
There are plenty of games pushing the limits on 16GB systems now. My 16GB is starting to be an issue (it causes problems in Cold War, which admittedly is a mess).
 

DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator and Elite Member
Moderator
Aug 22, 2001
23,253
5,094
146
I'm not sure if you'll gain a lot seeing this video:

The 9900K is about the same gaming performance as the AMD 5800x. I don't think it's worth the money to upgrade everything at this point. If I were you, I would upgrade to 9900K if that difference in framerate bothers me. 16GB should be enough if you're just playing games, but if multitask while playing games, then you need more. Check RAM and pagefile usage while playing games; upgrade if it's not enough.
Those canned benchmarks don't tell the real story though. You can insert the South Park -you're gonna have bad time meme, if you are stuck with 6 threads in some of the more CPU demanding games, both SP and MP. I am not a fan of the AC: Odyssey bench, as it does not reflect the most CPU intensive scenarios the game can offer. I can kneecap a 6 thread CPU in Athens, in a dust up with Mercs and citizens.

The 9700K is a terrible value, unless OP is finding much better prices than I am. Spend the extra $75 or so, and get the 9900 series. 8 threads is the old consoles, 16 threads are current. Like it or not the console effect will influence developer targets. 12 thread is really the minimum I would put money down for. At least for a system intended to play the newest and upcoming, most CPU demanding titles. I know some don't subscribe to the hypothesis above, so fight me. :D

Certainly, the games won't be unplayable, but stuttering, freezing, audio issues, assets not rendering properly or at all, and there being no headroom left for discord or other tasks, are best avoided if you can afford it.
 
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VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
52,241
7,058
126
32GB is pretty cheap now.
Neo Forza 32GB kit of DDR4-3600 is $89.99 right now @ Newegg. Seems "cheap enough" to me.

I've had 32GB for a number of years now, and I'm actually thinking of making my next box 64GB.

DDR5 also comes in larger DIMMs than DDR4 has traditionally come in. So 32GB/64GB rigs will be mainstream in DDR5 land, with 128GB for power-users.
 
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Harry_Wild

Senior member
Dec 14, 2012
555
59
91
Intel’s 12th Gen “Alder Lake” desktop processors will be announced October 27th and released November 7th. Desktop machine will be released shortly afterwards. I plan on buying one for myself with Windows 11 Pro already installed. Yes, it will be pricey! Maybe $2K for a desktop tower, no video card(use my 1050 TI 4GB) and only a 1TB SSD and 64GB RAM, i5 12500, middle of the road Intel 12th gen. CPU. Just impatient waiting for price drop in a year from now!
 
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Markfw

CPU Moderator, VC&G Moderator, Elite Member
Super Moderator
May 16, 2002
21,780
10,029
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Intel’s 12th Gen “Alder Lake” desktop processors will be announced October 27th and released November 7th. Desktop machine will be released shortly afterwards. I plan on buying one for myself with Windows 11 Pro already installed. Yes, it will be pricey! Maybe $2K for a desktop tower, no video card and only a 1TB SSD and 64GB RAM, i5 12500, middle if the road Intel 12th gen. CPU. Just impatient waiting for price drop in a year from now!
Why would he buy a chip that is not even benchmarked yet or reviewed ?
 

epsilon84

Golden Member
Aug 29, 2010
1,016
743
136
Why would he buy a chip that is not even benchmarked yet or reviewed ?
True, though there are plenty of leaked benches (albeit not that many for gaming) and single thread performance is off the charts (20% better than current gen) which usually bodes well for gaming. The rumoured pricing of the i5 ADLs also seem quite reasonable at this stage, $200 - $300 depending on the SKU.

That being said, I agree that we should wait for reviews first. Those high ST scores might not always directly translate to gaming performance, as there are other factors at play such as memory latency etc.

To the OP, unless you can get a used 9900K for a decent price and sell your 9600K to offset the cost a bit, I'll just hold out a couple of weeks and see what AlderLake has to offer before deciding on your options.
 

ondma

Platinum Member
Mar 18, 2018
2,362
998
106
I might personally say "don't wait", and look for used Zen2 3900X / 3950X CPUs, from those whom have upgraded to 5000-series Ryzen. Get a modern mobo that can take both Zen2 / Zen3 and the upcoming Zen3D chips. Get 32GB (min) DDR4-3200/3600. Wait it out on the GPU front.
Zen 3, would be a nice upgrade, but I wouldnt recommend Zen 2 for gaming, since it is already slower than Zen 3, slower than intel in a lot of cases, and a new Intel platform is coming out soon, as well as Zen 3D.
 

DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator and Elite Member
Moderator
Aug 22, 2001
23,253
5,094
146
It only a month away now and then a lot of comparison shopping!
My advice is stay away from the big OEM pre-builts Harry. Smaller S.I.s with decent reputations, that use off the shelf parts, is a better path.

Not certain why you are not rolling your own?
 

Harry_Wild

Senior member
Dec 14, 2012
555
59
91
My advice is stay away from the big OEM pre-builts Harry. Smaller S.I.s with decent reputations, that use off the shelf parts, is a better path.

Not certain why you are not rolling your own?
Since I was in business, I alway purchased the IBM now Lenovo corporate brand ThinkCentre->ThinkStation PCs. They have a 3yr. on-site warranty and never after the 3 years had any trouble with these PCs. Still receiving updates to bios and firmware on my P300 and it is 2014 era PC. The on-site warranty service is next day and the component that is bad is shipped overnight to the service technician. I have no complaints! It pretty much a luxury item for me as an individual since I probably buy the same specs PC at 1/3 the price. But you could say that about the iPhone too! LOL!

I am looking at doing a direct replacement of the P300's motherboard, heat sink, fan, Gen 5 M2 SSD, DDR5, and a LGA 1700 CPU as soon as they are release! The P300 motherboard is a 9.6" X 9.6" micro ATX! Not sure the screws are in the same location but I do not move my PC, so not a problem to me. Depends on the cost of the LGA 1700 vs. a LGA 1200 system vs. buying a 12th Gen. Alder Lake ThinkStation. Probably will buy the pre-built Lenovo....again!
 
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Furious_Styles

Senior member
Jan 17, 2019
408
138
86
I would be surprised to see any kind of availability for Alder Lake on release given the current market situation we're in. Keep that in mind for your future purchase decision.

Hopefully it won't be just a scalpfest but that's what I expect now sadly.
 

Harry_Wild

Senior member
Dec 14, 2012
555
59
91
I would be surprised to see any kind of availability for Alder Lake on release given the current market situation we're in. Keep that in mind for your future purchase decision.

Hopefully it won't be just a scalpfest but that's what I expect now sadly.
More incentive for me to keep buying pre-built Lenovo thinkstations..."I think?". LOL!
 

Harry_Wild

Senior member
Dec 14, 2012
555
59
91
No, no, no, buy from big OEMs! /s
All the above are the consumer budget type desktop which I agree are plain trash and will breakdown after the short warranty is expired and if it does break, might have to send the desktop to a service center out of state to service. Just plain junk, even new! They used the lowest costing parts like power supplies, thin motherboards, slowest memory. The budget OEM desktops try to sucker the buyer by having a very attractive looking case! LOL!
 

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