Upgrade dilemma

[SlackCollective]

Any kit bought locally (South Africa) costs around double (or more) the NewEgg prices. So with relatives visiting in a month's time, I'm itching to take advantage of the "free shipping" they would offer! But I can't commit to using more of the potential in my socket 939 system or going the Core2 Duo route, and am looking for any sage words from fellow enthusiasts...

Current system:
MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum
Athlon64 3000+ (happily running at 2250 with my crap value RAM)
2 x 512 Twinmos DDR400
Antec TruePower 550
Radeon 9800 Pro

The board will take dual-core A64's, as well as some of the Opteron's (165 and 175 look most tempting in terms of value for money). If I stay with AMD, I'm thinking Opteron 165, a Radeon X850 (AGP), and maybe 2 gigs of quality RAM. But with RAM prices where they are, it seems potentially silly to spend money on DDR, rather that DDR2. And will this upgrade deliver enough extra performance to be worth spending +-$400 on?

Spending roughly double the money will get me a Core2 Duo 6400, Gigabyte 965 DS3, a 7600GT PCI-E video card, and 2 gigs of Corsair XMS DDR2-800.

I'm gaming less than I used to, but would like to be able to play new games at decent framerates and quality at 1200x1024. Mostly, the machine is used for light Photo-shopping, office apps and web development.

Any suggestions or ideas gratefully received!

 

[dBTelos]

Take the C2D route, but with only 1GB of RAM. Then add another gig later. With the money you save with only 1GB of RAM, you can up the 7600GT to a 7900GT.

 

[jelifah]

First off, you are not alone SlackCollective! In fact your system and decisions are identical to mine. Ever since the price cut on X2's I've been debating whether to upgrade to an X2 or, after the C2D release, I wonder if I should just move to a full Core2Duo system.

After a LOT of research and thread posts, I suggest you just get an Opteron and sit tight for a year. You'll have a dual core processor and a decent video card. The opportunity to upgrade mobo/proc/vid/RAM will always be out there. The point, when you're on a budget, is to maximize the value of the system you have now. With Quad Core and socket changes already on the horizon perhaps you can avoid the AM2/C2D generation, and maybe DDR2, altogether.

The hardest part for you, and I, is the change from AGP to PCI-E AND the change from DDR to DDR2. It sucks when your RAM and your Video Card can't move with a socket change (note: you could buy a special AGP and PCI-E combo board, anand reviewed this one recently)

If you look at the recent Quad Core comparison on Anand he actually shows you the performance gains between an X2-3800 and the C2D which gives you an idea on performance value for your money. In the end, after looking at the performance increase in the article I mentioned and looking at the increased cost, I'm just going to buy an X2 after Turkey Day. If I buy it before than it would just sit and collect dust anyway, family before computers I always say.

If you do end up going C2D, and money is tight, just get 1 stick of RAM now.

No matter what you purchase, remember it's not a lost investment. You can always go to the FS/FT forum on anandtech to sell your old equipment. Hope that helps

p.s. Can someone tell me if a 7600GT is that much better than an X800 AGP or a 9800 Pro?

 

[SlackCollective]

Originally posted by: jelifah
The opportunity to upgrade mobo/proc/vid/RAM will always be out there. The point, when you're on a budget, is to maximize the value of the system you have now.

p.s. Can someone tell me if a 7600GT is that much better than an X800 AGP or a 9800 Pro?

Funny, that: I intentionally bought a decent S939 board so that I would have a decent upgrade path, and now that the time has come, I'm having cold feet about staying on that path! But yes, the problem is indeed new mobo/memory/pci-e card, etc. And even though the s939/AGP line has died, we'll still get some good service from these rigs for at least another year - although it really is difficult spending money on old tech. Resale, as per your suggestion, is more difficult for me here - most PC users in South Africa are happy to buy something prefab off the shelf rather than build, so it's difficult to get good value selling old components. Regarding 7600GT vs 9800Pro, most of what I've read says we should notice a significant difference between the cards.

Am tempted to economise, and counter-tempted by dBTelos's suggestion (thanks) - but I suppose this is always the case when buying PC hardware. Almost makes one want to be a Mac user! Maybe there will be some interesting price movement in the next 2 weeks (I'll need to order before the 21st or so) to help me decide.

 

[jelifah]

Originally posted by: SlackCollective
Funny, that: I intentionally bought a decent S939 board so that I would have a decent upgrade path, and now that the time has come, I'm having cold feet about staying on that path!

Ha, like I said before, identical situation. Two years ago I bought my system from NewEgg as a Socket 754. After some soul searching I called NewEgg, 2 hours after the original order, and changed the system to a Socket 939! Of course all this was done specifically so I could have the X2 upgrade opportunity. Now 2 years later I'm having trouble bringing myself to actually follow the path!

You mentioned how this system should last for at least another year. Now imagine the changes we'll see in a year. Vista will be 1 year old and you'll have a better picture of needed system specs, perhaps RAM prices come back down, 2nd gen Direct X10 cards should be out, perhaps the 4MB Cache C2D's will creep in to the $200 range, and I think new sockets will be out for both AMD and Intel. Of course by that time you'll be hearing the murmur of ATI Graphics Chips on the AMD 4x4 board. And, if you just spend $200 to upgrade the processor, you'll have that extra $400 - $600 to actually move into THOSE type of systems.

 

[SlackCollective]

You evil person. Over dinner I had pretty much decided to go the C2D route, and now I'm freshly conflicted...

 

[jelifah]

You'll like this even better, because of you I finally broke, AND BEFORE TURKEY DAY!

Just placed an order for an Opteron 170 at Newegg. Total price was $189.

If I wanted I could have saved $29 and gone with the Opteron 165 for $159.99

The reason I jumped up to the 170 is because my current processor is 2.0GHz. So I liked the flow of 2 Years ago paying $207 for a 3200+, and today spending $18 less for a Dual Core same speed processor

See you again in a year, hopefully two, when I need to worry about DDR2, PCI-E, DX10, and any other fancy candy.

 

[Ayah]

I'd vote for the an Opteron 165/170 and overclock eet.

 

[Duvie]

If you get the opteron 165 or 170 definitely get the better ram...doesn't have to be uber expensive to get some stuff that can run with the ample dividers of the Neo2...main thing is keep it as close to 400ddr as possible and cas2....

 

[A5]

Originally posted by: Ayah
I'd vote for the an Opteron 165/170 and overclock eet.

Yeah - <$200 vs. $700+ for a new system is a fairly easy choice for me.

 

[bamacre]

I'd say stick with 939, but that would mean sticking with AGP. Correct?

If so, I'd get a C2D E6300, 2GB of value ram, and spend the rest on video. Definitely get X1950 Pro at mininum.

Just remember gaming performance is going to come from your video card, much more so than your system cpu and memory.

 

[SlackCollective]

That's part of the problem, yes - sticking with AGP I mean. I'd surely have to upgrade that too (from 9800Pro), which means it's a contest between $300 (CPU + VPU), or $400 if I buy better RAM, and $650 (MB + VPU + CPU + RAM). And seeing as I'd want better RAM to max the potential of the Opteron, $400 is a more difficult choice than A5's $200 vs $700. But it's still difficult as hell. Sorry for all this thinking aloud!

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: SlackCollective
That's part of the problem, yes - sticking with AGP I mean. I'd surely have to upgrade that too (from 9800Pro), which means it's a contest between $300 (CPU + VPU), or $400 if I buy better RAM, and $650 (MB + VPU + CPU + RAM). And seeing as I'd want better RAM to max the potential of the Opteron, $400 is a more difficult choice than A5's $200 vs $700. But it's still difficult as hell. Sorry for all this thinking aloud!

Just consider it's only going to get more difficult selling off agp cards and ddr memory as time goes by. Buying a new agp card and new ddr memory now is a bad idea.