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UPDATED:Engine oil mysterious disappearing

R

Radiohead

Platinum Member
Seems to be a lot of car experts here so I figure this is worth a shot here.

My friends 97 Prelude SH is losing 2L of oil in a months time.

It has 111 800km & on average she drives in the area of 170km a week

There are no visible oil drips on the floor where she parks, there is no blue/white/visible smoke when starting the car and had a compression test done by the dealership a month back, which checked out fine.

What else could cause this?

She had the dealer check it out again today & they said she needs a new engine and valves?!!? $8G estimated.

I don't agree with that... wouldn't the compression test they did the first time have shown this?


UPDATE:
Well my friend picked up her car & faxed me a copy of the report the dealer gave her.

It says Checked for oil leak; barely any oil in engine block. Added/No visible leads found, vehicle burning oil. Requires complete engine re-built.

Parts + lab = $8000+tax

Parts include
Short block replacement
Head gasket kit
block kit
timing belt
water pump
all fluids
platinum plugs
rotor
timing belt tensioner
and something belt, I can't make it out.

Doesn't really help the initial assessment of the problem, but still an update
 
30 * 30 = 900 km/mo, if she's losing 2L in 900 km then there's something wrong.


and you're looking for blue smoke not white in particular.

check the coolant overflow to see if it's going there.
 
Bad valve seals maybe? My Explorer I had years ago had this problem and also mysteriously ate oil with no obvious indicator of what was going on.

Your dealer is on uber-crack if they're trying to talk you into a new engine that's worth more than the car tho.
 
Hmmmmm....

Well, if it isn't leaking out of the engine, and the engine doesen't appear to be eating it... :Q

Maybe it goes where the dryer socks go.

BTW, burning oil produces a bluish grey smoke, not white.. white can mean that the engine is eating coolant(blown headgasket).
 
Originally posted by: Pepsi90919
30 * 30 = 900 km/mo, if she's losing 2L in 900 km then there's something wrong.


and you're looking for blue smoke not white in particular.

check the coolant overflow to see if it's going there.
Click to expand...

I should clarify, 30km a weekday to and from work... weekends are less.
I've updated my original post to reflect it, but either way, 2L in 900km is not right.

Blue or white, she says there is no visible smoke what so ever upon starting the car.
 
I agree, it could be bad valve seals.. but it doesen't just go nowhere in that case, it still makes it into the combustion chamber.

Maybe you just aren't noticing the smoke. Check the sparkplugs, are they oil fouled, or deposit free and tan?
 
Originally posted by: Eli
I agree, it could be bad valve seals.. but it doesen't just go nowhere in that case, it still makes it into the combustion chamber.

Maybe you just aren't noticing the smoke. Check the sparkplugs, are they oil fouled, or deposit free and tan?
Click to expand...
That's how we made my initial diagnosis. One of the plugs looked like it had been dipped in molassas.

 
Originally posted by: Eli
I agree, it could be bad valve seals.. but it doesen't just go nowhere in that case, it still makes it into the combustion chamber.

Maybe you just aren't noticing the smoke. Check the sparkplugs, are they oil fouled, or deposit free and tan?
Click to expand...

I will check the plugs for her this weekend... I mentioned that to her but she's not mechanically inclined so she can't do it herself.

 
Originally posted by: Radiohead
Originally posted by: Eli
I agree, it could be bad valve seals.. but it doesen't just go nowhere in that case, it still makes it into the combustion chamber.

Maybe you just aren't noticing the smoke. Check the sparkplugs, are they oil fouled, or deposit free and tan?
Click to expand...

It's not my car so I'll have to check it out this weekend myself...
Click to expand...

As Fausto says, make sure to check them all.. It could be just 1 cylinder eating it all.. that would make it even harder to notice the smoke.

BTW, don't touch the dealer that suggested a new engine with a 10 foot pole.
 
Originally posted by: Eli
Originally posted by: Radiohead
Originally posted by: Eli
I agree, it could be bad valve seals.. but it doesen't just go nowhere in that case, it still makes it into the combustion chamber.

Maybe you just aren't noticing the smoke. Check the sparkplugs, are they oil fouled, or deposit free and tan?
Click to expand...

It's not my car so I'll have to check it out this weekend myself...
Click to expand...

As Fausto says, make sure to check them all.. It could be just 1 cylinder eating it all.. that would make it even harder to notice the smoke.

BTW, don't touch the dealer that suggested a new engine with a 10 foot pole.
Click to expand...
Actually, go ahead and touch him with that pole. Swing it as hard as you can, in fact. 😀

 
Originally posted by: Eli
Originally posted by: Radiohead
Originally posted by: Eli
I agree, it could be bad valve seals.. but it doesen't just go nowhere in that case, it still makes it into the combustion chamber.

Maybe you just aren't noticing the smoke. Check the sparkplugs, are they oil fouled, or deposit free and tan?
Click to expand...

It's not my car so I'll have to check it out this weekend myself...
Click to expand...

As Fausto says, make sure to check them all.. It could be just 1 cylinder eating it all.. that would make it even harder to notice the smoke.

BTW, don't touch the dealer that suggested a new engine with a 10 foot pole.
Click to expand...

Will do...
 
Originally posted by: Fausto1
Originally posted by: Eli
Originally posted by: Radiohead
Originally posted by: Eli
I agree, it could be bad valve seals.. but it doesen't just go nowhere in that case, it still makes it into the combustion chamber.

Maybe you just aren't noticing the smoke. Check the sparkplugs, are they oil fouled, or deposit free and tan?
Click to expand...

It's not my car so I'll have to check it out this weekend myself...
Click to expand...

As Fausto says, make sure to check them all.. It could be just 1 cylinder eating it all.. that would make it even harder to notice the smoke.

BTW, don't touch the dealer that suggested a new engine with a 10 foot pole.
Click to expand...
Actually, go ahead and touch him with that pole. Swing it as hard as you can, in fact. 😀
Click to expand...

LOL!!!😀
 
Originally posted by: Radiohead
Originally posted by: Pepsi90919
30 * 30 = 900 km/mo, if she's losing 2L in 900 km then there's something wrong.


and you're looking for blue smoke not white in particular.

check the coolant overflow to see if it's going there.
Click to expand...

I should clarify, 30km a weekday to and from work... weekends are less.
I've updated my original post to reflect it, but either way, 2L in 900km is not right.

Blue or white, she says there is no visible smoke what so ever upon starting the car.
Click to expand...

well, then, that's worse 🙂
 
Sounds like worn valve guides, which can burn oil at highways speeds and not produce a visible smoke. Worn valve guide seals or piston rings will show visible smoke because the oil will leak pass them when the engine sits or is at low rpm. At High rpms the vacuum created by the intake charge with opening and closing of the intake valve can pull in oil from a worn guide.

BTW, a compression test doesn't always show worn piston rings; only a leakdown test can do this.
 
Originally posted by: Quixfire
Sounds like worn valve guides, which can burn oil at highways speeds and not produce a visible smoke. Worn valve guide seals or piston rings will show visible smoke because the oil will leak pass them when the engine sits or is at low rpm. At High rpms the vacuum created by the intake charge with opening and closing of the intake valve can pull in oil from a worn guide.

BTW, a compression test doesn't always show worn piston rings; only a leakdown test can do this.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info, this might be it.

The report she received from the dealership says the car is burning oil & her valves need to be rebuilt.

 
If it's not leaking out of the engine through gaskets or burning up through the rings/valve stem seals, then it could be leaking INTO the coolant.

Maybe it's burning up during acceleration. You said there's no blue smoke on startup, what about during acceleration? The valve stem seals could be bad.. and $8k is a rip.
 
Originally posted by: Pepsei
Try using valvoline maxlife oil. It fixes tiny leaks if you have them.
Click to expand...

I don't know where you heard that, but that certainly isn't the case..

Using a thicker oil will only slow the leak, not fix it completely..

 
Originally posted by: Eli
Originally posted by: Pepsei
Try using valvoline maxlife oil. It fixes tiny leaks if you have them.
Click to expand...
I don't know where you heard that, but that certainly isn't the case..

Using a thicker oil will only slow the leak, not fix it completely..
Click to expand...
Thicker oil will also reduce oil temps a little. (Mainly only noticeable in air-cooled engines.)

ZV
 
Originally posted by: Eli
Originally posted by: Pepsei
Try using valvoline maxlife oil. It fixes tiny leaks if you have them.
Click to expand...

I don't know where you heard that, but that certainly isn't the case..

Using a thicker oil will only slow the leak, not fix it completely..
Click to expand...

I guess I used the wrong word....

I have a buddy that works at Ethyl that tests motor oils everyday. And this one time he tested the oil from his jeep, found traces of gasoline. So he started to use Maxlife, and after awhile, no more gasoline leakage.

he told me it "helps condition seals and prevent leaks", which is different from "fixing leaks"

 
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