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Ugh. Article: does crime in an online game = crime in real life.

Let's say you have the hobby of building model ships. You invested a lot of time and effort and the detail of the ships is intricate. If you wanted to, you could probably sell your model ship for a hefty sum at hobby shops or craft fairs.

Most people would want to prosecute if someone stoll their model ships. Sure, they're just model ships. It was only a hobby you did on nights and weekends, not your livlihood. But you invested a lot of your time and effort. You also lost the money you could have made since the ships had value within a market, however small.

Now what's the difference between the model ship builder and online gamers who invest time and effort building game characters and artefacts that are worth money on a small market? Shouldn't the theives be prosecuted even though the theft was an intangible item?

Seems to me they should.
 
Yes. Afterall we had almost no crime until these games came along and since then worldwide crime rates have quadrupled.
 
Originally posted by: Stratum9
Let's say you have the hobby of building model ships. You invested a lot of time and effort and the detail of the ships is intricate. If you wanted to, you could probably sell your model ship for a hefty sum at hobby shops or craft fairs.

Most people would want to prosecute if someone stoll their model ships. Sure, they're just model ships. It was only a hobby you did on nights and weekends, not your livlihood. But you invested a lot of your time and effort. You also lost the money you could have made since the ships had value within a market, however small.

Now what's the difference between the model ship builder and online gamers who invest time and effort building game characters and artefacts that are worth money on a small market? Shouldn't the theives be prosecuted even though the theft was an intangible item?

Seems to me they should.
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umm. the ship is real. dumbass the game is not.
 
Originally posted by: Stratum9
Let's say you have the hobby of building model ships. You invested a lot of time and effort and the detail of the ships is intricate. If you wanted to, you could probably sell your model ship for a hefty sum at hobby shops or craft fairs.

Most people would want to prosecute if someone stoll their model ships. Sure, they're just model ships. It was only a hobby you did on nights and weekends, not your livlihood. But you invested a lot of your time and effort. You also lost the money you could have made since the ships were had value within a market, however small.

Now what's the difference between the model ship builder and online gamers who invest time and effort building game characters and artefacts that are worth money on a small market? Should the theives be prosecuted?

Seems to me they should.
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Apples and oranges. If someone breaks into my house and steals anything they are breaking a whole host of established law. I am willing to bet that if you actually read and parse the TOS for any MMPORG they can basically turn the servers off and owe you nothing more than the balance of your months service payment. Sorry but all that so called work on your character was the point and the reward is supposed to be the fun you had doing it period.
 
ok, I stole stuff in Morrowwind from the cpu players, does that mean they should arrest me? In the game, they could have spent years to get that clay pot, we don't know.
 
Definintely not on the same level...

But I've heard stories of people whose entire living is being made off these games. If their livelihood is threatened by a group of online thugs out to steal their stuff and sell it on ebay, how is that any different than doing it in real life?

Although I believe this is something that should be handled by the publishers and developers, not the damn police!
 
Why the fvck would anyone play online games if they were like real life? You're suppsoed to kill and steal and do what you can to get ahead, that's what makes them fun. Any retribution for crimes committed in a game should also be committed in the game. If someone steals from your character, go ahead and throw his character in virtual jail, but the police in the real world should NOT be involved.
 
it's part of the persistent world. If they want to fight virtual crime, they need to do it within that realm, not IRL. I'm amused by the gangs that storm people's houses. heh.
 
Originally posted by: 00Jones
Originally posted by: Stratum9 Let's say you have the hobby of building model ships. You invested a lot of time and effort and the detail of the ships is intricate. If you wanted to, you could probably sell your model ship for a hefty sum at hobby shops or craft fairs. Most people would want to prosecute if someone stoll their model ships. Sure, they're just model ships. It was only a hobby you did on nights and weekends, not your livlihood. But you invested a lot of your time and effort. You also lost the money you could have made since the ships had value within a market, however small. Now what's the difference between the model ship builder and online gamers who invest time and effort building game characters and artefacts that are worth money on a small market? Shouldn't the theives be prosecuted even though the theft was an intangible item? Seems to me they should.
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umm. the ship is real. dumbass the game is not.
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Hmm. Insightful post. What about if someone hacked into your email address, or stole your domain from you, a la sex.com. Is that real?
 
It would be kind of cool to have a judge and stuff in the games. They catch you stealing you get setn ot court, and peopel who own houses and get mail can be called for jury duty, This would be kind of cool.



and during court, you kill the judge and run like hell muahahaha!!!!
 



Wouldn't bother me, domain is for fun, email is for spam



Hmm. Insightful post. What about if someone hacked into your email address, or stole your domain from you, a la sex.com. Is that real?
Click to expand...
 
Originally posted by: BD2003
Definintely not on the same level...

But I've heard stories of people whose entire living is being made off these games. If their livelihood is threatened by a group of online thugs out to steal their stuff and sell it on ebay, how is that any different than doing it in real life?

Although I believe this is something that should be handled by the publishers and developers, not the damn police!
Click to expand...

Many games state as part of the TOS that this kind of thing is against the user agreement and that any losses will not be reimbursed. People doing this for a living should find a more productive line of work.
 
If the game allows for people to steal from each other, I don't see why it would be considered wrong. How anyone could imagine that actual police should be involved is beyond me. Maybe if people were hacking into the game to get valuable items and then sell them for actual money I could see where a crime may have been committed. But this is just a joke.
 
Originally posted by: CubicZirconia
If the game allows for people to steal from each other, I don't see why it would be considered wrong. How anyone could imagine that actual police should be involved is beyond me. Maybe if people were hacking into the game to get valuable items and then sell them for actual money I could see where a crime may have been committed. But this is just a joke.
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but what if that gang raped you in your house and then stole your stuff!!!!




:Q
 
of course it plays a factor or else the military would not use half-life Q3 and other games to desensitse thier infanty units. (saw this on 60 minutes a few years back). You are what you eat. Same with anything. Hang around profanity you'll use it too enentually. Grow up in a hell hole like south central and you'll have no compunction about killing someone for a dime bag.
 
Originally posted by: Zebo
of course it plays a factor or else the military would not use half-life Q3 and other games to desensitse thier infanty units. (saw this on 60 minutes a few years back). You are what you eat. Same with anything. Hang around profanity you'll use it too enentually. Grow up in a hell hole like south central and you'll have no compunction about killing someone for a dime bag.
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I think he was referring to the specific case brought up in the article he linked to, not the "do video games cause violence" question.
 
Originally posted by: Zebo
of course it plays a factor or else the military would not use half-life Q3 and other games to desensitse thier infanty units. (saw this on 60 minutes a few years back). You are what you eat. Same with anything. Hang around profanity you'll use it too enentually. Grow up in a hell hole like south central and you'll have no compunction about killing someone for a dime bag.
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The games help with reflexes. And probably accuracy. The game isn't going to make them a killing machine.

Anyways, the news would desensitise me. Since the news is real and games are not!
 
Nope. People obviously dont read agreements(EULA).

The owners or the games/servers, have the right to all objects in the game world. People do not own virtual items. Thus they cant be stolen. Selling items in a virtual world is also against the TOS. People have no legal leg to stand on.
 
Originally posted by: digitalsm
Nope. People obviously dont read agreements.

The owners or the games/servers, have the right to all objects in the game world. People do not own virtual items. Thus they cant be stolen.
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Then how can we sell them if we do not own them?
 
Originally posted by: 00Jones
Originally posted by: Zebo
of course it plays a factor or else the military would not use half-life Q3 and other games to desensitse thier infanty units. (saw this on 60 minutes a few years back). You are what you eat. Same with anything. Hang around profanity you'll use it too enentually. Grow up in a hell hole like south central and you'll have no compunction about killing someone for a dime bag.
Click to expand...

The games help with reflexes. And probably accuracy. The game isn't going to make them a killing machine.

Anyways, the news would desensitise me. Since the news is real and games are not!
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I'm very happy you can differentiate. Some can't. that's why I said factor. I've played FPS's since wolf and never killed anyone 99% of us can make the distinctions
 
Originally posted by: 00Jones
Wouldn't bother me, domain is for fun, email is for spam

Hmm. Insightful post. What about if someone hacked into your email address, or stole your domain from you, a la sex.com. Is that real?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Really? It wouldn't bother you?

Let's say you managed to get your hands on a premium domain back when the internet was in its infancy. The revenue gained from type-in hits alone would be enough for you to not have to work again. Ever.

You take time to build a good site. You build in a good ad structure, referral programs, membership program.... the works. You are really starting to make a name for yourself.

Now, some guy calls up your domain registrar, snakes the domain name away from you and points it to his server. He uses your domain and your hits to generate a multi-million dollar fortune. The guy is on top of the world, and you are left with nothing to show for it.

In the end, it's all just 1's and 0's, but there is some real money out there to be made... whether it be domain-based or game-based. It's not all just for "fun" and "spam".
 
According to that article, the game characters and other items are being sold for REAL MONEY to make a REAL PROFIT. So victims are not just losing the valuable game items, they are losing money from their bank accounts. Who cares if the money doesn't represent a tangible item, it's still money.

Anyway, I'm not an online gamer, so I really don't care. But what I got out of that article was that these people are losing real money in the trade of virtual items and I don't see what the big deal is if they want their money back. Not much different than a Yahoo! scam or some other type of online scam.
 
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