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U.S. unemployment numbers in Q4 '07 vs Q4 '09, broken down by income range

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MJinZ said:
Actually the basic difference is that for the most part, Liberals are have-nots and the Conservatives are the haves.
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Which explains the prevalence of the GOP in southern trailer parks. That's the American dream baby.
 
The problem as I see it (in the Republic of BooBoo) ...

Let's break it down like this ....

unemploy2a.jpg


( Of course, I made the percentages up 😱 but you can get my point )

Let's say 'full employment' in the US is 170 million jobs (with '4%' being the typical baseline of hardcore unemployed).

I can't imagine how the US will create the tens of millions of jobs necessary to return to the status quo on the wide side of that 'inverse pyramid'. Bummer, huh?

The situation is further exacerbated by the need to create 130k jobs/month just to keep up.

So the typical baseline of hardcore unemployed is going to rise --- most likely in a substantial fashion.




--
 
Atreus21 said:
How many people in the US have zero income and zero money? Unemployed doesn't mean utterly destitute.
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Haven't been around many major highway access road intersections lately have yah? There are plenty of people with zero income, or zero funds available to spend as they have just enough for food, water, and shelter and they are lucky if they can afford electricity. I'm not saying that is everyone in the US. I am saying don't be blind to what is out there.

Then, no disrespect, I think your fighting a losing battle. I think at every turn the government will be frustrated by the sheer elusiveness of some of our country's more crafty entrepreneurs. Taxes can be loopholed if they get too heavy. I think if the government ever achieved such a level of enforcement, you would not see employers quietly comply, but rather throw up their hands and quit in exasperation, or move their business (and with it their resources) elsewhere, assuming they were allowed to do so.
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Not really. There is a reason there are so many wealthy businesses here in the US and why so many foreign companies flock here as well. It's the lack of government restraint and enforcement and the plethora of loopholes that allow people to do what they want to make cash. This by no means is my endorsement for our government to go willy nilly with regulations and enforcement. But some more stringent and evolving policies need to be done. As times change, technologies change, and the crafty get craftier, the government needs to evolve with it.
 
Yeah, not all that surprising, but still interesting and shows how bad it has gotten in two years.

I seen a similar trend on unemployment figures by education level. I forgot the exact numbers, but those with college degrees were significantly under the national average unemployment rate, meaning those without must have very high unemployment.
 
This seems entirely intuitive to me. I.e., obvious and to be expected.

As business declines and you lay people off, you aren't going to layoff the one CEO, CFO, CTO, or head of legal, HR etc, it's the workers who making the product (for which there is now no demand) or performing the service (again, less demand) who are first to go along with (now) unneeded support staff etc.

Fern
 
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HumblePie said:
Not really. There is a reason there are so many wealthy businesses here in the US and why so many foreign companies flock here as well. It's the lack of government restraint and enforcement and the plethora of loopholes that allow people to do what they want to make cash.
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I'd actually argue the opposite - it's primarily the West's market transparency and history of proper regulation that has business flocking to it rather than staying at home. Of course, there's always room for improvement.

duragezic said:
Yeah, not all that surprising, but still interesting and shows how bad it has gotten in two years.

I seen a similar trend on unemployment figures by education level. I forgot the exact numbers, but those with college degrees were significantly under the national average unemployment rate, meaning those without must have very high unemployment.
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I assume that education correlates well to income. What sort of unemployment fighting strategies are underway down there? Here in the province of Ontario we've got something called the Second Career program, which "provides laid-off workers with A) skills training to help them find jobs in high-demand occupations in Ontario, and B) financial support."

It's actually been a colossal disaster in implementation, but the idea is a good one: Fill underserved labour markets with those willing to undergo new education and make a change.
 
Jaskalas said:
:\ Ever step outside a major city?
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Nope... :hmm:

Still, I would like to see some numbers if people are contending that there are significant numbers of poor conservatives. It doesn't make sense, conservatives want to... conserve, not change, at its core (whatever you want to take that to mean). I don't know anyone who wants to maintain their own status quo as dirt poor.
 
MJinZ said:
Nope... :hmm:

Still, I would like to see some numbers if people are contending that there are significant numbers of poor conservatives. It doesn't make sense, conservatives want to... conserve, not change, at its core (whatever you want to take that to mean). I don't know anyone who wants to maintain their own status quo as dirt poor.
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Unless they don't see themselves as poor. They believe they are content in their role in life as God has deemed and Repubs have told them 🙂
 
HumblePie said:
Unless they don't see themselves as poor. They believe they are content in their role in life as God has deemed and Repubs have told them 🙂
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Maybe there's a difference between them and Haiti or African third world nation poor. Maybe they'd like to keep it that way. That's the last time I'm taking this OT here.
 
MJinZ said:
There are plenty of very rich Liberals like Warren Buffet and Bill Gates, but you would hard pressed to find many Poor Conservatives.
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Jaskalas said:
:\ Ever step outside a major city?
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MJinZ said:
Nope... :hmm:

Still, I would like to see some numbers if people are contending that there are significant numbers of poor conservatives. It doesn't make sense, conservatives want to... conserve, not change, at its core (whatever you want to take that to mean). I don't know anyone who wants to maintain their own status quo as dirt poor.
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Well MJinZ, how the hell do you reconcile the fact that the poorer Southern states are "red" and the wealthier NE states are "blue"?

Fern
 
HumblePie said:
Haven't been around many major highway access road intersections lately have yah? There are plenty of people with zero income, or zero funds available to spend as they have just enough for food, water, and shelter and they are lucky if they can afford electricity. I'm not saying that is everyone in the US. I am saying don't be blind to what is out there.
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Well, if I were a beggar, and I managed to get a total of $5 by begging, that'd be 5 burgers off the dollar menu (well four if you include tax.). If on the other hand, McDonalds used more expensive labor, I'd only be able to get 3. Prices effect everyone, assuming everyone uses money to get what they need.

Not really. There is a reason there are so many wealthy businesses here in the US and why so many foreign companies flock here as well. It's the lack of government restraint and enforcement and the plethora of loopholes that allow people to do what they want to make cash. This by no means is my endorsement for our government to go willy nilly with regulations and enforcement. But some more stringent and evolving policies need to be done. As times change, technologies change, and the crafty get craftier, the government needs to evolve with it.
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Then speaking for myself, if the government offered me money that I could only use on American labor, I'd do a cost/benefit analysis. I don't demonize any employer that would reject the money on the basis that it would cost them too much long term.
 
spidey07 said:
There's a lot of federal, state and local programs that will give you money, don't need a bank loan/capital.
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*Taps spidey's sarcasm meter a few times*

Yep still broken.

edit, side note: those program monies and grants are harder to get than a loan.
 
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Fern said:
Well MJinZ, how the hell do you reconcile the fact that the poorer Southern states are "red" and the wealthier NE states are "blue"?

Fern
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Well, that one is a bit tricky. Taking a quick look at these information:

1) Median income across states (Wiki)
2) Election maps of Red vs Blue
3) Population cartogram of the same election map

It seems to me that population of the States that voted Blue largely dwarfs Red, and Median Income is roughly $50-80K across all States.

It suggests that:

- Extremely poor individuals voted both Republican and Democrat

- More pockets of very poor ($19k - $35k income) exist in Red States

So... I can't really reconcile them, except maybe to theorize based on population spread, that there are less poor conservatives than there are poor liberals.
 
spidey07 said:
Negative. Needs to be targeted on the producers of jobs, the highly compensated. Then the growth will trickle down.
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rofl....REAGANOMICS CAN STILL WORK, JUST GIVE IT TWENTY MORE YEARS!

you're the type of person that would try to plug holes in a boat with water.
 
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