U.S. seeks expanded power to seize firms

[mooseracing]

Originally posted by: her209

Originally posted by: mooseracing
Government needs to stay the fuck out of businesses. This is just another step towards the USSA.

If the biz is failing, they need to fail.

What about the other way around?

I don't vote for the big hitters that are fed by business's. I know 99% of politicians have their pockets filled by them. I know also there are a shitload of Lobbyist now on Obama's staff. Not to mention Mr. Treasury that can't run his own finacials but can handle the U.S.'s? Thats a big WTF.

Also when all this backfires, who is going to bailout the Federal Reserve?

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: mooseracing
[
Also when all this backfires, who is going to bailout the Federal Reserve?

The Chinese.

 

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: Socio
U.S. seeks expanded power to seize firms

WASHINGTON - The Obama administration is considering asking Congress to give the Treasury secretary unprecedented powers to initiate the seizure of non-bank financial companies, such as large insurers, investment firms and hedge funds, whose collapse would damage the broader economy, according to an administration document.

Obama taking que?s from Chavez?

When the Government can come in and seize your company that is scary power!
Not only that, if they keep scaling up this power, how long before they finally just make it eminent power, how long before they start seizing everything?

What is next, the abolishing of term limits for the POTUS?

Ya' mean like creditors in a bankruptcy, now don't cha'?? But before the "management" can loot the company funds with bonus payments??? Real scary, HUH?

 

[Robor]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: TheRedUnderURBed

Originally posted by: Genx87
Get over it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Would be nice if ppl did, instead of the incessant whine since Nov.

yes people should stop whinning over the direction the country is headed. the should just shut up and like it! right?

exactly like all the libs did when Bush was in power. oh, wait........

Bu bu but that was DIFFERENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You're damned right it was. Of course, but you already know that because you righties were right here condemning those policies, decisions, and ignorance that lead us here. Oh wait...

 

[fskimospy]

I'm not sure i understand the complaints here. The government has the ability to seize troubled banks that are about to collapse, this is something that has happened many times, and it's something I don't think many people have a problem with. There are plenty of financial institutions out there however that the government doesn't have this same power over, but whose collapse would cause just as much trouble. If you don't have a problem with regular savings banks, why a problem with these?

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
I'm not sure i understand the complaints here. The government has the ability to seize troubled banks that are about to collapse, this is something that has happened many times, and it's something I don't think many people have a problem with. There are plenty of financial institutions out there however that the government doesn't have this same power over, but whose collapse would cause just as much trouble. If you don't have a problem with regular savings banks, why a problem with these?

If they are allowed to go beyond banks, specifically, then what's to stop them from going after the entire Fortune 50? 100? 500?

It's a slippery slope that we shouldn't even think about approaching... or, after all these years, are you still under the ignorant impression that "Government knows best"?!

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
I'm not sure i understand the complaints here. The government has the ability to seize troubled banks that are about to collapse, this is something that has happened many times, and it's something I don't think many people have a problem with. There are plenty of financial institutions out there however that the government doesn't have this same power over, but whose collapse would cause just as much trouble. If you don't have a problem with regular savings banks, why a problem with these?

There is a problem because people who are against or still upset that Obama won the election are so obsessed with fabricating problems that they are blind to the truth!

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: mooseracing
[
Also when all this backfires, who is going to bailout the Federal Reserve?

The Chinese.

ORLY?
ORLY 2?

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: mooseracing
[
Also when all this backfires, who is going to bailout the Federal Reserve?

The Chinese.

ORLY?
ORLY 2?

Damn, well there's always your grandchildren. At least they'll be good for something.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: retrospooty

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: TheRedUnderURBed

Originally posted by: Genx87
Get over it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Would be nice if ppl did, instead of the incessant whine since Nov.

yes people should stop whinning over the direction the country is headed. the should just shut up and like it! right?

No, but they should stop whinning over things that havent even happened, or things that some website says will happen. IF it ACTUALLY happens, or if Congress, and/or Obama says they are going to make it happen, then by all means, commence whinning.

As of now, you are just whinning in the wind =)

yeah we should wait until it ACTUALLy happens. since then you know then we would have a say...

complain now. its the only chance to get it changed.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: palehorse

Originally posted by: eskimospy
I'm not sure i understand the complaints here. The government has the ability to seize troubled banks that are about to collapse, this is something that has happened many times, and it's something I don't think many people have a problem with. There are plenty of financial institutions out there however that the government doesn't have this same power over, but whose collapse would cause just as much trouble. If you don't have a problem with regular savings banks, why a problem with these?

If they are allowed to go beyond banks, specifically, then what's to stop them from going after the entire Fortune 50? 100? 500?

It's a slippery slope that we shouldn't even think about approaching... or, after all these years, are you still under the ignorant impression that "Government knows best"?!

....? Three questions for you:

1.) Do you know the reasons why the government has the power to seize banks through the FDIC? Do you agree with it, or disagree?

2.) Do you know that these other institutions serve many of the same functions as banks that the FDIC is already able to seize in case of insolvency?

3.) If this is the case, why would you be okay with the government having the power to seize some, but not others?

I mean, if you think the government shouldn't be able to take over failed banks to begin with and wish to see the FDIC abolished, I would disagree but I would understand your position. To say that because now the FDIC could seize insolvent investment banks along with regular banks that we're on a path to being able to nationalize Microsoft doesn't seem logically supportable.

Oh, and quit it with the 'government knows best' bullshit.

 

[scruffypup]

Originally posted by: senseamp
If a fund or insurer's collapse likely and it presents a systemic risk, hell yeah the government should have power to seize it. Would be nice if they seized AIG and stopped it from doing stupid sh!t before it became a huge burden on the taxpayer.

But who is to determine that??? I mean by the time there is a consensus then it is already too late,.... who here thought AIG would be where they are 2 years ago??? And things would have had to be done before 2 years ago to prevent their issues,...

 

[scruffypup]

Originally posted by: retrospooty

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: TheRedUnderURBed

Originally posted by: Genx87
Get over it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Would be nice if ppl did, instead of the incessant whine since Nov.

yes people should stop whinning over the direction the country is headed. the should just shut up and like it! right?

No, but they should stop whinning over things that havent even happened, or things that some website says will happen. IF it ACTUALLY happens, or if Congress, and/or Obama says they are going to make it happen, then by all means, commence whinning.

As of now, you are just whinning in the wind =)

GREAT IDEA!!! Let's wait until we have problems to do something,... don't be proactive,.... kinda like those who say Hitler could have been prevented from rising to power if people had been proactive,... but we don't need that,... let Hitler rise to power, then complain,... oh yeah and how did that turn out for the complainers????

(and no don't go reading into that making it look like I compared Obama to Hitler - I didn't)

 

[scruffypup]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: mooseracing
[
Also when all this backfires, who is going to bailout the Federal Reserve?

The Chinese.

I don't think so!!! They will be taking their money and going elsewhere to watch us crumble and they become the main power,.... we need them more than they need us anymore

 

[retrospooty]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: retrospooty

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: TheRedUnderURBed

Originally posted by: Genx87
Get over it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Would be nice if ppl did, instead of the incessant whine since Nov.

yes people should stop whinning over the direction the country is headed. the should just shut up and like it! right?

No, but they should stop whinning over things that havent even happened, or things that some website says will happen. IF it ACTUALLY happens, or if Congress, and/or Obama says they are going to make it happen, then by all means, commence whinning.

As of now, you are just whinning in the wind =)

yeah we should wait until it ACTUALLy happens. since then you know then we would have a say...

complain now. its the only chance to get it changed.

You say that as if complaining will change something. If they wanna do some nasty crap, they will do it, whether anonymous people on the internet complain or not.

 

[JSt0rm]

what do all you little cry babies think should be done?

 

[retrospooty]

Originally posted by: scruffypup

Originally posted by: retrospooty

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: TheRedUnderURBed

Originally posted by: Genx87
Get over it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Would be nice if ppl did, instead of the incessant whine since Nov.

yes people should stop whinning over the direction the country is headed. the should just shut up and like it! right?

No, but they should stop whinning over things that havent even happened, or things that some website says will happen. IF it ACTUALLY happens, or if Congress, and/or Obama says they are going to make it happen, then by all means, commence whinning.

As of now, you are just whinning in the wind =)

GREAT IDEA!!! Let's wait until we have problems to do something,... don't be proactive,.... kinda like those who say Hitler could have been prevented from rising to power if people had been proactive,... but we don't need that,... let Hitler rise to power, then complain,... oh yeah and how did that turn out for the complainers????

(and no don't go reading into that making it look like I compared Obama to Hitler - I didn't)

You dont think there were some amount of people in Germany complaining about Hitler as he rose into power? LOL

Anyhow, my point is, you are not complaining about something that happened, or even is on the slate to happen. The article says they are "considering asking" not that they are implementing - and even that info is debatable.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
....? Three questions for you:

1.) Do you know the reasons why the government has the power to seize banks through the FDIC? Do you agree with it, or disagree?

I do agree with the FDIC's ability to seize bank, and only banks.

2.) Do you know that these other institutions serve many of the same functions as banks that the FDIC is already able to seize in case of insolvency?

The issue is that they also serve other functions; so, until you can replace that word with "all," the Feds should not be authorized to seize complete control.

3.) If this is the case, why would you be okay with the government having the power to seize some, but not others?

See the answer to #2. I also do not trust the Government enough to limit their powers of seizure to those companies with some ambiguous relation to banking.

I mean, if you think the government shouldn't be able to take over failed banks to begin with and wish to see the FDIC abolished, I would disagree but I would understand your position. To say that because now the FDIC could seize insolvent investment banks along with regular banks that we're on a path to being able to nationalize Microsoft doesn't seem logically supportable.

Oh, and quit it with the 'government knows best' bullshit.

As far as I can tell, the only determining factor that the Government has identified, thus far, is the ambiguous notion of "too big to fail." With that being their only restriction, the potential seizure of companies like Microsoft doesn't seem so outlandish.

IOW, what checks and balances will be in place to prevent the Executive branch from reaching beyond the banking industry itself?

If you haven't noticed, the Government hasn't done much lately to demonstrate their grasp of cause and effect and the laws of unintended consequences. Give them an inch, and...

 

[BMW540I6speed]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: TheRedUnderURBed

Originally posted by: Genx87
Get over it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Would be nice if ppl did, instead of the incessant whine since Nov.

yes people should stop whinning over the direction the country is headed. the should just shut up and like it! right?

exactly like all the libs did when Bush was in power. oh, wait........

Bu bu but that was DIFFERENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It should be emphasized that mere criticism for its own sake is also not a virtue. Those who reflexively and blindly criticize whatever Obama does (based on the immovable, all-consuming conviction that he is intrinsically Evil, Socialist, whatever) are nothing more than the opposite side of the same mindless coin as those who reflexively and blindly praise whatever Obama does (based on the immovable, all-consuming conviction that he is intrinsically Good). Pre-ordained, overarching judgments of Obama that are detached from his actions are irrational in equal measure, whether the judgment is praise or condemnation.

If "conservatives" are comprised of traditional patriarchal authoritarians, survivalist individualists, white tribalists, high-level capitalist machine operators, paid propagandists, and old ladies suspicious of what young people are up to, and "progressives" are comprised of granola opt-out people, peace movement people, the intelligentsia, organized labor, black tribalists, high-level legal regime operators, and young people making their own identities, I have a question:

With so much overlap, how useful is this dichotomy for any type of analysis? Here's my take: We should never, ever, ever, again, allow authoritarians take control of the federal government.

And - why is this country so in love with false dichotomies? divide and rule? makes sense considering the interests of so many "conservatives" are the same as the interests of so many "progressives", and neither's interests are represented by either Party.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: retrospooty
Anyhow, my point is, you are not complaining about something that happened, or even is on the slate to happen. The article says they are "considering asking" not that they are implementing - and even that info is debatable.

Actually, they're talking about this exact issue in Congress today with the Treasury Department in the hotseat. I was just now listening to them on XM 130 debate the exact same slippery slope aspects of these powers that we're debating here in this thread... so I think you should pull your head back out of the sand and try to keep up, k?

 

[retrospooty]

Originally posted by: palehorse

Originally posted by: retrospooty
Anyhow, my point is, you are not complaining about something that happened, or even is on the slate to happen. The article says they are "considering asking" not that they are implementing - and even that info is debatable.

Actually, they're talking about this exact issue in Congress today with the Treasury Department in the hotseat. I was just now listening to them on XM 130 debate the exact same slippery slope aspects of these powers that we're debating here in this thread... so I think you should pull your head back out of the sand and try to keep up, k?

meh... I like my head in the sand... It's funner that way.

Not to point out the obvious, but based on the OP, we have already established that they were "talking" about it. Maybe you should try to keep up, K ? :disgust:

Let me know when/if they decide to put it up for an actual vote.

 

[First]

Originally posted by: palehorse

If you haven't noticed, the Government hasn't done much lately to demonstrate their grasp of cause and effect and the laws of unintended consequences. Give them an inch, and...

Exactly how is that any different than private institutions like AIG, Lehman, Bear Sterns, etc. making far worse financial decisions leading to their complete bankruptcy? I want finance in the hands of private industry too, except they're just as fallible as government. They're all run by human beings.

 

[Modelworks]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: TheRedUnderURBed

Originally posted by: Genx87
Get over it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Would be nice if ppl did, instead of the incessant whine since Nov.

yes people should stop whinning over the direction the country is headed. the should just shut up and like it! right?

YES !
Only a disloyal or traitorous comrade, errr American would complain.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: NeoV
tinfoil hats, 99 cents.....get em' before they are all gone

So this doesn't strike many of you as a new, big expansion of power in a political branch like the POTUS? [raises eyebrows]

I could swear I heard constant complaints about that during the last administartion?

Besides seizing a company outright, the document states, the Treasury Secretary could use a range of tools to prevent its collapse, such as guaranteeing losses, buying assets or taking a partial ownership stake. Such authority also would allow the government to break contracts, such as the agreements to pay $165 million in bonuses to employees of AIG's most troubled unit.

Somebody read the above and then take a shot at explaining why a comparison to Chavez is nutty.

Fern

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: NeoV
tinfoil hats, 99 cents.....get em' before they are all gone

So this doesn't strike many of you as a new, big expansion of power in a political branch like the POTUS? [raises eyebrows]

I could swear I heard constant complaints about that during the last administartion?

Besides seizing a company outright, the document states, the Treasury Secretary could use a range of tools to prevent its collapse, such as guaranteeing losses, buying assets or taking a partial ownership stake. Such authority also would allow the government to break contracts, such as the agreements to pay $165 million in bonuses to employees of AIG's most troubled unit.

Somebody read the above and then take a shot at explaining why a comparison to Chavez is nutty.

Fern

Because the US government has already had this power in relation to other institutions for a long time?