We are all the definition of brainwashed, so give an example of how you aren't. The burden of proof is on those who claim objectivity.
No, it is yours and Moonbeams contention that all Americans are brainwashed. Nice rhetoric, now prove it.
I repeat.
Give us your definition of brainwashed as you are using it in this thread and an example of how I might be brainwashed. Let?s deal with some specifics.
Do you believe that Israel had anything to do with the incidents on 9/11? Are the people that still believe that lie brainwashed? Who brainwashed them and why?
I repeat.
Give us your definition of brainwashed as you are using it in this thread and an example of how I might be brainwashed. Let?s deal with some specifics.
Do you believe that Israel had anything to do with the incidents on 9/11? Are the people that still believe that lie brainwashed? Who brainwashed them and why?
No, that is your contention.
If you were brainwashed would you know it, would anything anyone else says prove it to you? You don't seem to appreciate how deep self-deception runs in all of us...but then I guess that explains itself.
If you were brainwashed would you know it, would anything anyone else says prove it to you? You don't seem to appreciate how deep self-deception runs in all of us...but then I guess that explains itself.
When listening to the news you should always ONLY look for the Facts of the story and always disreguard the opinions. PERIOD
I agree completely. There is no way to know that you are brainwashed. I will even take into account that maybe I am perhaps brainwashed. But that is why I look for as many sources as possible to move myself towards the unattainable truth. I just want to get as close as possible, which I think a lot of people on here do not, but yet point at others and preach. Can we both agree with that?
Originally posted by: Evadman
Originally posted by: Peetoeng
Are you being sarcastic, or should I whisper 'GERALDO'!
Don't you be dissin my Geraldo! He rules!
Of couse I was being sarcastic
Why?
Their slogan is "Fair and Balanced."
It MUST be true!!!
I think self-examination is the best way to find truth.
Getting back down to earth, as far as sources go, we all gravitate towards those that tells us what we want to hear (which in itself is something we don't want to hear). Media, in the US at least, takes itself too seriously. Corporate ownership and sponsorship plays too big a roll in what gets aired and what doesn't. Political/corporate ties make it even more suspect.
Getting back down to earth, as far as sources go, we all gravitate towards those that tells us what we want to hear (which in itself is something we don't want to hear). Media, in the US at least, takes itself too seriously. Corporate ownership and sponsorship plays too big a roll in what gets aired and what doesn't. Political/corporate ties make it even more suspect.
Hayabusa Rider
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sandorski
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BS! I'm not going bald! My stomach does not jutt out!! The mirror(likely made in Communist China) is lying to me!!!
You are correct, we all deceive ourselves. Our society(ies) would likely collapse if we saw everything as it is. If I look back to my childhood I see a person who accepted and believed in principles such as fairness, justice, and honesty. As I have aged, me and everyone else my age have given into the harshness of reality. If I went back in time and told my childhood self all that I have learned, I(Child) would look at me(Now) with shock, horror, and disbelief. Self-deception keeps me and, I suspect, my peers from going mad.
Everyone is biased, even when they try not to be. Even the great BBC is not as unbiased as some of you might think. But as long as they report the truth, if you are smart enough to look at the facts and ignore the words used to present it.
hmm, just wanted to add my two cents about brainwashing. You can't be brainwashed over a brief period of time or intermittently. For a successful brainwashing, the information you want the person to believe has got to be repeated frequently for a long duration. Very few people have the money, power, or intelligence to conduct a successful brainwashing. Especially one that involves more than a few people.
However, the modern mass media are in the perfect position to conduct this type of brainwashing. Put out a message; millions will hear it. Millions more will hear it second-hand. Repeat it, and get other outlets to say the same thing. Discussions will occur; people will again hear the same "facts", "opinions", and other information. Allow for some dissent, and even create some; you don't want to let the people *know* that they're being brainwashed by providing exactly the same message all of the time. Above all, appeal to people's emotions and basic human feelings. The feeling of righteousness; the feeling of justice; the feeling of truth. It all becomes one self-perpetuating cycle. The serpent that's eating its own tail.
Do I think that the media are biased? Yes. Do I think that this is necessarily the result of collusion, or evil desires on the part of those in the media? No. As I said, there's a sort of a feedback loop. One media outlet becomes popular because it happens to say something in such a way that a lot of people agree with it; other outlets move in that same direction; opinions change; at one point something gives way, and everything sways the other direction (maybe a catastrophe, an election, a war). The media tell the people what they want to hear, and in doing so they create new things that more people then want to hear. It ends up that the members of the media are biased, but they cannot see their bias. It's simple human nature. Do the US Media have a pro-Israel bias? Yes, I think so. However, do the American people as a whole have a pro-Israel bias? Again, Yes, I think so. So then, we come to the question.... which came first, the chicken or the egg?
Now to return to brainwashing. By the very nature of brainwashing, it's a lot easier for me to believe that the vast majority of people are brainwashed and that a few are not. Too many independent minds makes for a dangerous situation for Society and Civilization. Due to nature, there must be about a 20-to-1 ratio between followers and leaders. Are the leaders better than the followers? No, and both are just as necessary. Too many leaders, and nothing gets done. Too many followers, and nothing gets done. There's a natural balance among people (although I doubt that it's completely inborn; it's largely due to circumstances, and a person who's a follower in one context could be a fine leader in another). We fetishize the leaders, but without the followers the leaders would be nothing. In general I think that the followers (the many) are more susceptible to brainwashing than the leaders (the few).
However, the modern mass media are in the perfect position to conduct this type of brainwashing. Put out a message; millions will hear it. Millions more will hear it second-hand. Repeat it, and get other outlets to say the same thing. Discussions will occur; people will again hear the same "facts", "opinions", and other information. Allow for some dissent, and even create some; you don't want to let the people *know* that they're being brainwashed by providing exactly the same message all of the time. Above all, appeal to people's emotions and basic human feelings. The feeling of righteousness; the feeling of justice; the feeling of truth. It all becomes one self-perpetuating cycle. The serpent that's eating its own tail.
Do I think that the media are biased? Yes. Do I think that this is necessarily the result of collusion, or evil desires on the part of those in the media? No. As I said, there's a sort of a feedback loop. One media outlet becomes popular because it happens to say something in such a way that a lot of people agree with it; other outlets move in that same direction; opinions change; at one point something gives way, and everything sways the other direction (maybe a catastrophe, an election, a war). The media tell the people what they want to hear, and in doing so they create new things that more people then want to hear. It ends up that the members of the media are biased, but they cannot see their bias. It's simple human nature. Do the US Media have a pro-Israel bias? Yes, I think so. However, do the American people as a whole have a pro-Israel bias? Again, Yes, I think so. So then, we come to the question.... which came first, the chicken or the egg?
Now to return to brainwashing. By the very nature of brainwashing, it's a lot easier for me to believe that the vast majority of people are brainwashed and that a few are not. Too many independent minds makes for a dangerous situation for Society and Civilization. Due to nature, there must be about a 20-to-1 ratio between followers and leaders. Are the leaders better than the followers? No, and both are just as necessary. Too many leaders, and nothing gets done. Too many followers, and nothing gets done. There's a natural balance among people (although I doubt that it's completely inborn; it's largely due to circumstances, and a person who's a follower in one context could be a fine leader in another). We fetishize the leaders, but without the followers the leaders would be nothing. In general I think that the followers (the many) are more susceptible to brainwashing than the leaders (the few).
Obviously I'm not a brainwashing expert or anything.... Then again, I doubt that anybody would admit to being an expert at brainwashing
But, everything that I said about brainwashing, is just common sense. You can't be 'brainwashed' by the guy with the megaphone on the street corner. He simply doesn't have enough access to your brain, even if you walk by every day. Brainwashing -- literally getting a firm grasp on a person's mind and what he's thinking -- cannot come easily. You've got to get at them, day after day after day, reinforcing the ideas at every step. I liken it to the concept of 'face time' that you hear about in the corporate world. You've got to have sufficient 'mind time' to effectively brainwash somebody. edit: oh, and I think that it's probably possible to brainwash oneself.
Holy hell that page is as blatant propaganda as the propaganda it claims to expose!
Oh wait its a viewpoint you agree with so that precludes it from being propaganda and rhetoric.
Sorry carry on.
The thing about brainwashing, bizmark, is that it becomes what we call common sense. Think group think. The way to brainwash yourself is to assume you know something, to become certain.
Frances, that's not blatant propaganda, it's truth. You just need smaller doses. Read just a bit at a time and give yourself the opportunity to digest it. The brain is like a muscle, after extended disuse it weakens. Work up to bigger bites slowly. Just kidding.
Actually, Frances, I think you may have unusual qualities of mind that may protect you from a great deal of propaganda, more so than is typical of people. You are 'slippery', something your dear Moonbeam knows something about. I won't say any more than that since I'm addressing something in you we have in common, but of which you may not be fully conscious. But it may account for why you are attracted to me.
Frances, that's not blatant propaganda, it's truth.
You just need smaller doses. Read just a bit at a time and give yourself the opportunity to digest it. The brain is like a muscle, after extended disuse it weakens. Work up to bigger bites slowly. Just kidding.Actually, Frances, I think you may have unusual qualities of mind that may protect you from a great deal of propaganda, more so than is typical of people. You are 'slippery', something your dear Moonbeam knows something about. I won't say any more than that since I'm addressing something in you we have in common, but of which you may not be fully conscious. But it may account for why you are attracted to me.
I think the real problem is that the Palestinians don't know what the truth is anymore. I watched their spokesperson on a news program state that the murder bombings were a response by Palestine's military to the previous action that Israel had taken in Palestine.
Then about 5 minutes later she stated that the Israelis were occupying Palestine so they were not allowed to have a military.
Confused they heck out of me. Our military responded (it's not terrorism).........wait we have no military).
Then about 5 minutes later she stated that the Israelis were occupying Palestine so they were not allowed to have a military.
Confused they heck out of me. Our military responded (it's not terrorism).........wait we have no military).
if the US would be invaded and had no army it would look at the militia as their army
The real problem is that extremists control the forces of both sides.
But she claimed no militia either. She said that there was no military force in Palestine and that any Israel attack was an attack at innocent civilians. Militia members could not be considered innocent civilians.
I don't think most of the Israelis killed by the bombings would be considered militia.
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