U.S. Interceptor Downs Missile in Test Over Pacific

[Polish3d]

Originally posted by: Acanthus
Lets not even discuss the logstics of the EMP that would be caused by intercepting a nuke and having it go off miles over the US.

(you are talking a massive EMP that would wipe out electricity for 1/4 of the US if it was destroyed over the continental US.)

Edit: typo

Are you sure about that? How would blowing up the nuclear weapon before it actually goes nuclear cause an EMP?

 

[theeedude]

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: Paddington
The interceptors are cheaper to build than the nukes, which take nuclear materials. There's no reason the U.S. couldn't eventually have 1-1 interceptors for all the nukes China and Russia have, as well as additional ones that North Korea, etc. have.

Russian ICMB's break up into several missles and they can easily come up with decoy ICMB's designed to overwhelm the system.

pure fantasy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIRV
It's called MIRV, and it's been around for a while now, both US and USSR have them in both land based and sub based configurations (Minuteman, SS-18, etc)
They tried to ban them with START 2 treaty, but when US withdrew from ABM treaty, Russia withdrew from START 2.

 

[CaptnKirk]

Will a 'rouge' attacker have the sophistication to acheive an ICBM type deployment trajectory ? Doubtful.

In order to reach 'the other side of the world' the boost phase and positioning phases of the flight have to reach up to
an altitude between 500 for close proximity (under 3,000 miles) or nearly 750 miles for extended proximity.
Any direction that you take from the launch point you can strike the most remote target with only 6,000 miles of flight.

ICBM reach their target acquisition point, turn, align, and deploy - with impact at Ground Zero to occur
within 25 minutes of launch - gravity brings it in at over 15,000 MPH closing velocity.

Now heres where it gets complicated . . . multiple warheads delpoyed for re-entry out in space within a 500 to 750 high zone,
and 'nestling cones' - warhead simulators, dummys, or more acturately 'chaffe' - a cloud of chaffe that may consist of several hundred decoys
and it will be now be on the target in less than 15 more minutes.

The MX bus could deploy 8 or 10 functional warheads, along with nearly 100 decoys - just pick out what's real and nail it.
You've got a little over 700 seconds to evaluate which of 100+ space objects is a threat, and which are only a menace.
6 correct out of 109 potential objects still lets 3 or 4 through, which ain't real good.

Clue: background Radiation - space is 3*K background radiation temperature . . .
warhead (mass) is hotter and
illuminates brightly in the IR spectrum, as do the decoys . . but the decoys cool faster leaving the actual weapon system
glowing like a beacon in the sky . . . going over 10,000 MPH now and closing fast.
You are down to under 200 seconds to make the vehicle kill.

Feel lucky, punk ?

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: Frackal

Originally posted by: Acanthus
Lets not even discuss the logstics of the EMP that would be caused by intercepting a nuke and having it go off miles over the US.

(you are talking a massive EMP that would wipe out electricity for 1/4 of the US if it was destroyed over the continental US.)

Edit: typo

Are you sure about that? How would blowing up the nuclear weapon before it actually goes nuclear cause an EMP?

You didnt read the posts following it.

 

[CaptnKirk]

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: Frackal

Originally posted by: Acanthus
Lets not even discuss the logstics of the EMP that would be caused by intercepting a nuke and having it go off miles over the US.

(you are talking a massive EMP that would wipe out electricity for 1/4 of the US if it was destroyed over the continental US.)

Edit: typo

Are you sure about that? How would blowing up the nuclear weapon before it actually goes nuclear cause an EMP?

You didnt read the posts following it.

QUESTION

Why didn't the Hiroshima and Nagasaki detonations not drop the aircraft that delivered them out of the sky.
Come on, an EMP Event is an EMP Event, and these planes couldn't have outrun the pulse could they?
EMP might be a bit exagerated, might it not?

 

[Aisengard]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: Frackal

Originally posted by: Acanthus
Lets not even discuss the logstics of the EMP that would be caused by intercepting a nuke and having it go off miles over the US.

(you are talking a massive EMP that would wipe out electricity for 1/4 of the US if it was destroyed over the continental US.)

Edit: typo

Are you sure about that? How would blowing up the nuclear weapon before it actually goes nuclear cause an EMP?

You didnt read the posts following it.

QUESTION

Why didn't the Hiroshima and Nagasaki detonations not drop the aircraft that delivered them out of the sky.
Come on, an EMP Event is an EMP Event, and these planes couldn't have outrun the pulse could they?
EMP might be a bit exagerated, might it not?

Err, those planes were miles high. Nothing would have reached them.

 

[Aegeon]

Originally posted by: Acanthus
Yeah, i retract my earlier statement, i honestly though our silos had been upgraded since the 1970s.

You still seem to be missing an extremely important point. Its basically impossible to setup a silo launch system that can survive a direct nuclear hit like the US's ICBM arsenal is now capable of. Nukes can simply do too much damage when they can hit within 120 meters of their target.

Now it is true if you stick your nukes literally under a mountain they can probably survive the US strikes. However the US can collapse any entrances to the weapons complex with their nuclear attacks, keep in mind the entrances will have to be relatively large in the first place so that ICBMs could get out of the complex. It would take a considerable amount of time to open up the collapsed entrances (which would also be radiactively contaminated) and the US would have a whole bunch of time to do all sorts of things including simply taking steps to collapse those entrances again before the other country could get those nukes out of the complex. Basically the US can either destroy all of its opponent's nukes capable of reaching the US or prevent them from being usable for long that the do the other country no good for the current conflict.

What it comes down to is if land based nukes could survive nuclear strikes from ICBMs, the USSR and US would have not bothered with comparatively more expensive dedicated SLBM "boomer" subs in the first place and would have simply stuck with comparatively cheaper properly fortified land based silos where they also wouldn't have had to worry about the prospect of an enemy sub sinking the "boomer" submarine prior to it sucessfuly launching its nukes.

 

[Aegeon]

Originally posted by: Acanthus
You didnt read the posts following it.

You've never explained this point other than some incoherent claim about how the nukes would go off first before they were hit, and you've yet to explain how this would work given the problems I pointed out with the idea.

 

[CaptnKirk]

Originally posted by: Aisengard

Err, those planes were miles high. Nothing would have reached them.

Think about it for a second.

EMP Electro Magnetic Pulse = a discharge of electrical and magnetic energy, that covers all wavelengths of the EM spectrum simultaneously,
radiating from the point of origin, equally distributed in all directions, weakened only by the spherical distribution of the advance of the wavefront,
uniformially in all directions, inversely proportional to the square root of the energy carried forward by the distance traveled by the wave front.

How 'bright' does the candle appear to be at what relative distance ?

It doesn't matter whether the planes were 5 miles in the air or 5 miles away on the ground when a waveform
of EMP energy traveling 186,000 MPS swept past the planes.
If the EMP was to effect the engines and electrical systems of a machine, whether it's in the air or on the ground is moot.

EMP doesn't kill it forever, it overwhe;ms it for a few milliseconds, then energy level returns to an ambient level and you continue.
Some specifice systems may have to be shut down and restarted, some may have been broken by the power surge,
most will continue to perform as a normal system.
It doesn't take a Faraday Cage to save the day.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: Frackal

Originally posted by: Acanthus
Lets not even discuss the logstics of the EMP that would be caused by intercepting a nuke and having it go off miles over the US.

(you are talking a massive EMP that would wipe out electricity for 1/4 of the US if it was destroyed over the continental US.)

Edit: typo

Are you sure about that? How would blowing up the nuclear weapon before it actually goes nuclear cause an EMP?

You didnt read the posts following it.

QUESTION

Why didn't the Hiroshima and Nagasaki detonations not drop the aircraft that delivered them out of the sky.
Come on, an EMP Event is an EMP Event, and these planes couldn't have outrun the pulse could they?
EMP might be a bit exagerated, might it not?

Because you only get the powerful EMP effects if the blast is at a high altitude.

 

[WiseOldDude]

Even a blind squirrel finds an acorn now and then. What does this bring their accuracy up to now 1% or 2%? for how many BILLIONS?

 

[DickFnTracy]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk

Originally posted by: Aisengard

Err, those planes were miles high. Nothing would have reached them.

Think about it for a second.

EMP Electro Magnetic Pulse = a discharge of electrical and magnetic energy, that covers all wavelengths of the EM spectrum simultaneously,
radiating from the point of origin, equally distributed in all directions, weakened only by the spherical distribution of the advance of the wavefront,
uniformially in all directions, inversely proportional to the square root of the energy carried forward by the distance traveled by the wave front.

How 'bright' does the candle appear to be at what relative distance ?

It doesn't matter whether the planes were 5 miles in the air or 5 miles away on the ground when a waveform
of EMP energy traveling 186,000 MPS swept past the planes.
If the EMP was to effect the engines and electrical systems of a machine, whether it's in the air or on the ground is moot.

EMP doesn't kill it forever, it overwhe;ms it for a few milliseconds, then energy level returns to an ambient level and you continue.
Some specifice systems may have to be shut down and restarted, some may have been broken by the power surge,
most will continue to perform as a normal system.
It doesn't take a Faraday Cage to save the day.

Jesus, I don't think there's one true word in your entire post. Here, read this EMP for Dummies . It's Wikipedia which isn't my favorite source for anything but it is accurate and, just as importantly, simply written which will help you and anyone else led astray by what you have written understand how this works.

 

[straightalker]

A huge nuke could be put in any shipping container and shipped over courtesy of Huchison Whampoa (China's PLO Army owned shipping company) to our docks in Long Beach and elsewhere. They could ship 1000 over here. All heavily shielded from remote-sensing scanning devices. Coordinated placement of these nukes by trucks that carry those shipping containers would also be easy. Set it up and throw the red swtch and boom, ...total devastation of the USA and all military and civilian targets.

Money should be spent not on pea-shooters but on energy weapon that shoot down ICBM's at the speed of light.

Other money, a lot of it, ...should go to securing our borders and booting out the foreign Corporations that have any hand on our Nation's infrastructure.

 

[lyssword]

Originally posted by: novasatori

Originally posted by: senseamp
It may be effective against North Korea and such, where you can have dozens of interceptors for every missile they launch, and the locations they launch from is pretty compact. But Russia, and probably China, you can forget it.
They have multiple reentry vehicle capability, plus they have decoys, plus they have maneuverable warheads to evade an intercptor. But even without all those, they have numbers, and they have huge landmass, and mobile launchers from trucks, trains, submarines. So they can easily overwhelm a defense system. Because with the amounts of missiles they have, they only need to be 5% effective, while our interceptors would need to be 100% effective.

russia/china launching a nuclear strike is pretty absurd.

I consider these countries of the sort that wish to continue to exist. nuclear strike versus the US would go against that.

I don't think Russia has any intentions of ever nuking U.S. Like other ppl said, they are one of those countries that wish to exist

 

[CaptnKirk]

Originally posted by: DickFnTracy

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk

Originally posted by: Aisengard

Err, those planes were miles high. Nothing would have reached them.

Think about it for a second.

EMP Electro Magnetic Pulse = a discharge of electrical and magnetic energy, that covers all wavelengths of the EM spectrum simultaneously,
radiating from the point of origin, equally distributed in all directions, weakened only by the spherical distribution of the advance of the wavefront,
uniformially in all directions, inversely proportional to the square root of the energy carried forward by the distance traveled by the wave front.

How 'bright' does the candle appear to be at what relative distance ?

It doesn't matter whether the planes were 5 miles in the air or 5 miles away on the ground when a waveform
of EMP energy traveling 186,000 MPS swept past the planes.
If the EMP was to effect the engines and electrical systems of a machine, whether it's in the air or on the ground is moot.

EMP doesn't kill it forever, it overwhe;ms it for a few milliseconds, then energy level returns to an ambient level and you continue.
Some specifice systems may have to be shut down and restarted, some may have been broken by the power surge,
most will continue to perform as a normal system.
It doesn't take a Faraday Cage to save the day.

Jesus, I don't think there's one true word in your entire post. Here, read this EMP for Dummies . It's Wikipedia which isn't my favorite source for anything but it is accurate and, just as importantly, simply written which will help you and anyone else led astray by what you have written understand how this works.

Having worked on bothe the nuclear deliverysystems, and EMI protection for flight aircraft - that 'public knowledge'
comes down to basically bullshit, even though there's a lot of scientific data stated there, much if it doesn't really translate
considering where we are in our present application of technology.

While your home computer might be affected, every thing in the world doesn't just shrivel up and die.
Basically equipment would only be affected if it's running at thje time, if they're switched off, they're not in play.