Type 2 diabetes remission program

[igor_kavinski]

NHS Type 2 Diabetes Path to Remission - Momenta Newcastle

Welcome to participants already on the NHS Type 2 Diabetes Path to Remission Please note if you have not started the programme but are interested in finding out more about it please visit our introduction page. The content, links and resources on this page complement your Coaching, Workbooks...

momentanewcastle.com

I read about Newcastle University's "discovery" on how to kick diabetes into remission in 2019 I think. I guess they finally decided to "monetize" their program because it doesn't look very affordable.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Interestingly, found out a few days back that fresh orange juice and grape juice are both rich in chromium which helps to improve insulin sensitivity. I wouldn't recommend more than one glass of either per day. You never know what is too much of a good thing.

 

[Kaido]

I read about Newcastle University's "discovery" on how to kick diabetes into remission in 2019 I think

The basics approaches for non-T1 diabetes management are:

1. Bariatric surgery (if overweight)
2. Ultra-low-calorie diet (800 calories)
3. Low-carb diet
4. Medicine & macros with a target personal carb ceiling

Very Low-Calorie Ketogenic Diet (VLCKD) as Pre-Operative First-Line Dietary Therapy in Patients with Obesity Who Are Candidates for Bariatric Surgery

They primary issue with T2 diabetes management is sustainability. People in general don't know macros & have a hard time being consistent in their macros intake. The most effective diet-only method I've seen is the Word WOE method, which is highly restrictive, but also highly effective:

Way of Reversing Diabetes - WORD | Facebook

WORD Way of Reversing Diabetes - Type 2 We are a group that emphasizes Lifestyle Change over medication and surgery. We advocate for eating real, whole,...

www.facebook.com

Food is so, so important:

Dr. Sarah Hallberg on Carb Restriction as a Sustainable Diabetes Treatment

www.crossfit.com

Dr Hallberg is not the only person to have made this discovery, and perhaps the best book on the subject is Dr David Cavan’s 2014 book Reverse Your Diabetes, which shows how low-carbohydrate diets can indeed reverse your diabetes. But though Sarah Hallberg is not alone, she may be the best advocate for the new story. She’s a great communicator.

Unexpectedly, we now have not one but two competing techniques for reversing type 2 diabetes, Sarah Hallberg’s low-carbohydrate diet and Roy Taylor’s low-calorie diet: Dr Taylor has shown that the insulin-secreting cells of the pancreas are disabled by abdominal fat, and when he puts his patients on diets of only 800 or so calories a day, they eventually lose enough abdominal fat to rescue their insulin secretion.

Interestingly, Roy Taylor’s clinical findings are similar to Sarah Hallberg’s, in that he can reverse diabetes in about two thirds of patients, with the best results being found amongst the more recently-diagnosed folk. Future research will probably integrate Hallberg’s and Taylor’s work into one combined pathophysiological narrative, but for now let us rejoice that, in a single decade, at least two separate approaches have confounded the depressing fatalism that ruled the field as recently as 2009.

Bariatric weight reduction carries a risk of solving the weight problem, but not the craving problem. GLP-1's are a miracle drug for turning off the "food noise". Also, with medication, the latest diabetes research is advocating a moderate-carb diet (starting at 75g carbs per day) & steady eating throughout the day, where each meal contains all of the macros, plus fiber, which is a departure from the previous-touted low-carb-only diet.

Generally, drinking a glass of fresh orange juice and grape juice when diabetic is a very bad idea, especially on an empty stomach, because it can be 25 to 35 grams of simple carbs, which can raise blood sugar levels in less than 20 minutes & cause a spike instead of a smooth, rolling hill. I have a good intro post on T2 reversal & remission here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/diabetes_t2/comments/1impcta/comment/mc4yp3s/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

The biggest key for non-T1 diabetic management (which requires insulin) is diet, followed by exercise. The 3 primary barriers are:

1. People don't want to buy into carb restriction (either low without medicine or moderate with medicine)
2. People get tired & don't do it
3. People feel like it's too hard & much of a chore to engage in daily & sustain (cooking is work & we all want to eat what we want to eat!)

I recommend either a meal-delivery service (if budget allows) or a meal-prepping approach. I cook just one batch a day using appliances to divvy up & freeze. The best combination I've seen overall for sustainability is:

1. Go to bed early
2. Go to bed at a consistent time every day
3. Get 8 hours of sleep
4. Eat 3 meals a day at the same time every day
5. Know your carb ceiling
6. Eat your macros & eat them combined at each meal
7. Meal-prep for convenience so that you can effortlessly hit your numbers every day
8. Wear a CGM
9. Exercise daily
10. Take medicine as necessary

This is an ENORMOUS lifestyle change for most people. But keep in mind that 50% of America is now diabetic & the CDC lists diabetes as a Top 10 killer in America. Macros opens the door to weight management, high physical energy, and sugar management made easy!

 

[PowerEngineer]

Well, I can tell you that becoming diabetic introduces you to a whole new world of opinions about what can and cannot be done to deal with its consequences - and many of them are completely contradictory. One has to be very careful in choosing who you take advice from.

Not surprisingly, Kaido's outline of steps to take is quite good. My quibble would be that bariatric surgery should be a last resort only after other measures to lose weight have failed. IMHO other measures should include semaglutide (Ozempic) and tirzepatide (Mounjaro).

You will find people claiming that diabetes can be reversed or cured, but this really isn't true. What you can hope to do is to lower your blood glucose levels down below the diabetic threshold (140 mg/dL average) and thereby avoid most of the adverse health affects. This is you consciously controlling your blood glucose. What you cannot do is return to a time where you can trust your body to unconsciously control your blood glucose. Once you have it, diabetes is a lifelong companion. At least this is what I think I know...

Lastly, it turns out that what works (and doesn't work) for diabetes is different from individual to individual. That is true for the efficacy of medications, for the glucose impacts of foods, and for meal sizes and numbers, and for impacts of activities on glucose levels. Everyone goes through a period of trial and error to learn what works for them. And as Kaido says, then committing to doing what works for them for a lifetime.

 

[igor_kavinski]

At least this is what I think I know...

I'm in T2D remission since 2020 at least. Managed to make it happen with 15 day rice diet (only 300 to 400g of white rice for dinner with 7 to 8 pieces of chickpeas). Rest of the diet was made up of watermelon/grapefruit juice and sometimes fruit. Went down to 52 kg at the end and lost so much muscle mass that I felt like even the wind could blow me away. Got back to normal eating after that and my appetite became absolutely voracious. Was eating double amount mostly healthy food and still stayed lean. Gained back most of my muscle mass only after I ate two eggs a day for two weeks straight. Now maintaining remission with white kidney bean extract and berberine but take those only with my largest meal (dinner).

You are right though. Diabetes is going to come back if I start being irresponsible again. But thankfully, I don't feel the need to eat yummy fried fast food three times a day which is what caused it in the first place.

 

[PowerEngineer]

I'm in T2D remission since 2020 at least.

I am glad that you are doing well at controlling your glucose levels (as have I since 2015).

I suppose you can call it "remission" if you define it as "the reduction or disappearance of the signs and symptoms of a disease", but it isn't as if your diabetes is gone or cured - just the signs and symptoms are gone (for now). You are doing through weight loss, dietary changes, and (I presume) exercise what I described as taking conscious control over your glucose levels.

Getting back below diabetic glucose levels is a bit like a drowning man getting his head back above water. His first big breath is certainly a great relief, but hardly the end of the ordeal. He needs to keep working to keep his head above water if he wants to keep breathing. Just as we need to keep working to control our glucose levels. It isn't as if we are on shore where breathing (and glucose control) are effortless and can be taken for granted.

Or so it seems to me...

 

[Kaido]

And as Kaido says, then committing to doing what works for them for a lifetime.

I got into sugar management for 3 reasons:

1. I have a lot of weird health issues. One of those is reactive hypoglycemia, where my blood sugar will drop up to 40 points within 20 minutes of eating.

2. One of my friends got diagnosed as T2, refused treatment, and died. Another had to have both of his legs amputated.

3. I have a couple of newly-diagnosed family members with various types of diabetes who really struggle with the diet aspect.

imo:

1. Everyone should be assigned a CGM once a year as part of their annual physical

2. Everyone should receive an education on macros & meal-prepping. This should be taught in grade school as part of health (macros) & home economics (cooking)

3. We live under a lobbyist-driven government that has created an ocean of ultra-processed foods. The disconnect in education between food & health in our country is criminal because food-related issues affect so many of the leading causes of death in America.

We have surpassed a 50% diabetic rate in America:

More Than 50% of Americans Now Have Diabetes or Prediabetes – Who is Most at Risk?

diaTribe is a non-profit organization providing free cutting-edge diabetes management tips from diet and exercise, to ways to avoid diabetes complications.

diatribe.org

I grew up as a string bean, married a good cook, got a cubicle job sitting around all day, and eventually blew up to 260 pounds. It was scary because I had never been overweight in my life & had NO IDEA what to do. I started out eating chicken broccoli, and brown rice, lost the weight, but gained it back because it wasn't sustainable. Eventually I learned about macros & meal-prepping. In my view:

1. I don't believe in "food morality"; there are no "good" or "bad" foods. Macros are important & moderation is important. I'm not anti-sugar (it took me a really long time to adopt that LOL).

2. We will all die someday; how good we feel along the way should be the real key focus. Learning how to eat for bodyweight control & high energy can be done using virtually any desired diet when coupled with macros!

3. I've had good results on keto, fruitarian, gluten-free raw vegan, a fast-food & packaged foods diet (done via macros), a liquid diet (Soylent etc.), etc. I currently do moderate-carb, high-protein macros with good results! I'm omnivore at present & have been focusing more on real, whole foods lately.

I truly think that dietary control is the heart of T2 management, but people struggle with low energy, poor habits, and a lack of education & tools when it comes to cooking & eating better. It becomes a war of attrition based on willpower, which erodes over time. Wearing a CGM & meal-prepping your macros is THE single most effective & sustainable way that I've found to combat the common traps that people fall into when managing their sugar levels!

 

[igor_kavinski]

3. I have a couple of newly-diagnosed family members with various types of diabetes who really struggle with the diet aspect.

For these family members specifically, they have an excellent chance to rebound and end their diabetic ordeal. They should try Lysulin. If that fails to bring their hbA1C levels back to normal, they should seriously consider doing the rice diet strictly for three months:

only boiled white rice (300 to 500g per day) and

small amount of boiled chickpeas (100g is enough) and

any amount of fruit they can eat but avoid dates, bananas and avocados.

Non-starchy veggies are also allowed.

They should see their post meal glucose levels dropping on the third day with these diets. I had to only do it for 15 days. Depending on the amount of fat in their bodies, they may have to do it longer. But it works. Fried food is an absolute no-no, especially fries. If they get their diabetes under control, they must never eat fast food carelessly again. Always in moderation and with multiple days in between their indulgences.

EDIT: just noticed various "types" of diabetes. My suggestions will only work for T2D. Type 1 and any other type (not sure if there is. Some say 2.5 is a type) may not see results though Lysulin basically minimizes free floating glucose in the blood so theoretically it should help with managing Type 1 diabetes too.

 

[igor_kavinski]

 

[BoomerD]

View attachment 118614

Lysulin, Inc. - 614517 - 09/07/2021

Unapproved New Drugs/Misbranded

www.fda.gov

 

[igor_kavinski]

Lysulin, Inc. - 614517 - 09/07/2021

Unapproved New Drugs/Misbranded

www.fda.gov

Yup, they were warned because FDA doesn't endorse supplements and promoting them as treatments or cure does not sit well with them. The Lysulin website has changed their claims accordingly.

Here are the two clinical studies:

https://www.openaccessjournals.com/articles/lysulin-a-doubleblind-placebo-controlled-pilot-study-of-daily-oral-supplementation-in-people-with-type-2-diabetes.pdf

Effects of the Lysulin™ supplementation on pre-diabetes: A randomized double-blind, placebo-controlled clinical trial - PubMed

Sri Lanka Clinical Trials Registry, identifier: SLCTR/2018/022 (http://slctr.lk/trials/1290). Registered on 13th July 2018; Study protocol version 2.0 (23rd March 2018).

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

And this is what they say on their FAQ page: https://lysulin.com/faq/

Q: Do I need a prescription for Lysulin?​

A: No. As with any vitamin or dietary supplement, you don’t need a prescription. If you have diabetes, you should always consult your healthcare professional before adding a supplement to your care regimen.

The inventor himself said in an interview that it worked for one of his relatives but it didn't work for his niece and he was really saddened by that. Every body is different so what works for one person may have negligible effect on the other due to their genetic differences or other pre-existing health conditions and/or dietary patterns.

From my research, the reason why it should work is because:

Vitamin C neutralizes glucose molecules in the blood.

Lysine is similar to glucose so it ends up taking the place of glucose in several otherwise damaging biochemical reactions thus reducing the damage caused by glucose. (Don't quote me on that though. I read his interview long ago).

Zinc is required by the pancreatic beta cells to work properly.

 

[marees]

Imo, you need to have sufficient intake of protein & salt (& cut down on water)
Else you'll be hankering for unnecessary carbs/fats

& a low carb diet usually implies a diet heavy in saturated fat (eggs, organ meat, & cheese)

Many studies are alarmist about saturated fat but if you control for sugar (hba1c) then saturated fat is not harmful

Cooked & processes carbs are a strict no-no
Also avoid food cooked in polyunsaturated oils. Either cook with cheese or just steam whole vegetables

 

[marees]

Imo, you need to have sufficient intake of protein & salt (& cut down on water)
Else you'll be hankering for unnecessary carbs/fats

& a low carb diet usually implies a diet heavy in saturated fat (eggs, organ meat, & cheese)

Many studies are alarmist about saturated fat but if you control for sugar (hba1c) then saturated fat is not harmful

Cooked & processes carbs are a strict no-no
Also avoid food cooked in polyunsaturated oils. Either cook with cheese or just steam whole vegetables

I don't live in the US, but if I lived there then this is what I would eat:

1. Breakfast — ham sandwich from grocery store
2. Lunch — mexican pizza & crunch veg fajita taco from tacobell
3. Dinner — fish burger from McDonald's/burger king
4. Sides — berries, bulgarian cultured buttermilk, black coffee with minimal diary

Alternatively you can start the day with a English breakfast

1. Scrambled eggs
2. Baked beans (without sauce/ketchup)
3. Fish & meat

Then take it from there

 

[igor_kavinski]

Imo, you need to have sufficient intake of protein & salt (& cut down on water)

"Cut down on water" must be a typo? Without enough water, you get a very bad time trying to digest proteins. The urea created from the processing of amino acids needs water to be flushed out of the body otherwise urine gets really dark which isn't good for the kidneys.

 

[marees]

"Cut down on water" must be a typo? Without enough water, you get a very bad time trying to digest proteins. The urea created from the processing of amino acids needs water to be flushed out of the body otherwise urine gets really dark which isn't good for the kidneys.

What I was trying to say is if you drink excess water then salt gets diluted resulting in increasing hunger pangs

There could be other side effects of cutting down on water tho