Two Part Question: Build and Advice (Photo Work)

[mgh-pa]

Ok, I'll get to the build question in a second. First, a simple question (relatively). I'm looking to finally upgrade my PC (have considered this several times as evidence of my prior build help posts on here in the last 1-2 years). I'm going to be using it for photo editing (RAW edits) using CS5 and eventually CS6, Bridge/ACR, and some possible video editing (fun stuff, HD, but fun...not commercial). Absolutely no gaming, no CAD, definitely regular usage though (word processing, excel, internet usage, etc,.).

Obviously this industry is saturated with Apple, and EVERYONE and their brother who does graphic design (will also have Illustrator and InDesign work on this machine as well) swear by Apple products...except those who build their own machines.

I've built several computers in the past (it's been a while), so it doesn't intimidate me, but is there merit in the argument that Apple is in any way shape or form better suited in the long run (stability, reliability, performance vs. time, etc.) than a homebuilt PC? Granted, I know that they are the same component-wise, but I suppose we would be speaking directly to the OS on this question.

I find that Apple products (especially Mac Pros) to just be insanely overpriced for what you're getting. But Apple supporters say the quality you gain over an equivalent PC justifies the price difference. Are you buying it?

Ok, on to the build question (if the answer to the above is to just build vs. buy):

1. What YOUR PC will be used for. That means what types of tasks you'll be performing.

Photo Editing and mild HD video editing. Possibly opening a small side photo retouching business. NO GAMING.

2. What YOUR budget is. A price range is acceptable as long as it's not more than a 20% spread

I would like to keep it around $1200...monitor doesn't need to be included YET (I have a 22" Westinghouse, but it's a 6bit TN, so it needs upgraded). Less would be AWESOME.

3. What country YOU will be buying YOUR parts from.

US

5. IF YOU have a brand preference. That means, are you an Intel-Fanboy, AMD-Fanboy, ATI-Fanboy, nVidia-Fanboy, Seagate-Fanboy, WD-Fanboy, etc.

Don't care. Just want the best performance/price. Don't want to buy anything I don't need for my situation.

6. If YOU intend on using any of YOUR current parts, and if so, what those parts are.

Monitor, keyboard, mouse, and Klipsch 2.1s.

7. IF YOU plan on overclocking or run the system at default speeds.

N/A

8. What resolution, not monitor size, will you be using?

1680x1050 for now

9. WHEN do you plan to build it?

Probably within the month

 

[DSF]

How much are you intending to spend on the monitor eventually? I'm assuming that if you're doing photo work you're looking for something more like a 24"-30" panel that's nicer than a gaming TN. I would take into account the monitor size you intend to use eventually, not just your current one.

That said, since you're not doing any gaming, the exact resolution is probably not a big deal.

 

[snoylekim]

I was in a similar situation - one thing is, for a powerful desktop workstation, build your own beats the heck of the Apple value proposition, especially since Apple has chosen not to upgrade the Pro line significantly in a while .. the best 'photo' machine they offer is the MacBook Pro 15" Retina..and that's north of 2K for the basic model ..
You'll want a solid H77 Board, with an 4 Core 8 thread processor ( I've been recommending a Xeon 1245 v2 or an I7-3770, either flavor ..the K model goes on sale more frequently) . As far as a graphics card , doesn't sound like you need one yet. You can always expand. the HD 4000 integrated are fine for your use case . Add 16 G of Memory, a 80-120 SSD for OS, a DVD read/write , a decent case and you're in business . The other gurus on the forum are good at specific parting/pricing .. but .. You should be budgeting 300+ for the monitor ..Don't skimp here .. a Dell 2312, or 2410 at minimum or an equivalent IPS with a solid color reputation is a requirement for serious or paying photo work .. Plus you'll need to factor in the software license unless you've already got a Win 7 retail license

 

[BrightCandle]

You might want to split the post because the question about apple hardware is going to get in the way of component discussion. You can always see what you would get desktop wise at the price of a potential apple product for comparison.

To part 1. Apple products usually contain good hardware, often cutting edge and near top of the range. Their laptops come with truly excellent mouse pads and the screens are right now exceptionally good. I think Apple produces excellent machines for the most part, they do no low end junk at all.

I have issues with their choices of course, the ssds aren't usually the best and there is too little ram and the GPU isn't quite where I would want it but I have thought long and hard about my next work laptop being a retina pro as it pretty much out does anything else at that price range. I think the products tend to be slightly marked up, its possible to find similar hardware at a lower price, sometimes much lower, but it always comes in an exceptionally well made chassis.

The major issue I have is the peripherals. They use a lot of custom ports and adapters which have ludicrous prices for what they are, but in terms of the final machine cost its a drop in the ocean.

For a desktop I would build and upgrade, but for laptops there is little to no upgrade anyway.

 

[Essence_of_War]

If you really like OS X and associated software, and you're willing to do a little bit of work on your own, I think you could put together a pretty sick mac mini for your budget.

From Apple w/ only the processor upgrade you can get a 2.3 GHz i7 mac mini for $799 or a 2.6 GHz i7 for $899. It comes with 1 TB HDD, and 4GB ram.

For ~$120 you can get 2x8GB RAM from OWC or your favorite supplier, the RAM installation is really easy to do on your own.

If you also wanted to put in an SSD for your applications/systems you could pick up an SSD for about $1/GB from any reputable supplier, put it into the 2nd empty drive bay yourself with a little bit of work, and then either roll your own fusion drive or work with an SSD for applications/OS and an HDD for all those pictures/movies you're editing.

That'd come in around ~1160-1260 (800 or 900 mac mini + 120 ram + 240 SSD). On the high end of the budget, but it's an option.

 

[Charlie98]

I find that Apple products (especially Mac Pros) to just be insanely overpriced for what you're getting. But Apple supporters say the quality you gain over an equivalent PC justifies the price difference. Are you buying it?

That may be true of a store-bought prebuilt, or even ordering a built PC from Dell or someone, I don't think that is the case when you build your own PC for a specific purpose (as you are suggesting) using the proper parts.

...build your own for the win!

 

[snoylekim]

I didn't mention the Mac Mini in my post .. they are nice machines ..BUT .. you'll get a mobile versus Desktop processor ..they're getting closer, but .. Installing an aftermarket SSD can be done, but that's not for Mac Mini beginners ..the OWC video makes it look easier than it actually is. Once you're done ..you've spent 1200 or so for a machine that still is under the capacity of a desktop you can build , and you've maxed out the expansion .

 

[Essence_of_War]

Heh, heh.

Yeah the OWC does make it look pretty easy. A friend and I did the SSD upgrade on his mini, and while it worked out fine in the end, we were a little harrowed in the middle.

 

[TapWater]

Wow I just typed an awesome long response then windows 7 decided to update about 4 words before I finished. ####!~!

Anyway, the condensed version..

Im impartial to brand names and picket lines.. I just like stuff thats good.

Apple is good for you because:

you are in business, and have an image to uphold as a creative person. A big tower with flashing lights might not look as professional compared with the sleekness of an iMac. I guess it doesnt really matter if you work strictly from home and clients wont ever see it.

For about $1299 you can get the 21.5 inch model.. it will do everything you require and then some. That includes a monitor.

For $1799 ($500 more), you can get a better processor, video card, and most importantly for you - the 27 inch model with its brighter and higher contrasting screen. To anyone else I wouldnt bother going on about the screen - but if you are in business and for photos - I cant see how you would want a nice screen.

I have a 2010 model and TBH with you, I just finished playing Battlefield 3, a heavy 3D game, playing on ultra gfx and 1600x900 resolution. Its not the best, but for a 3 year old+ computer its pretty good, and has never had an issue.

You can install Windows on it also

lastly, Apple, if you have any problems within the time period, they will literally just replace the item on spot. I have done this with other stuff. A button stops working, I walk in, grabs a new one, and boom exchanged for a new one on the spot - 3 years later.

Even better, when you have an issue within 2 weeks - for anything - I mean a dead pixel - change of mind - dont like the screen or mac osx isnt for you etc.. just return it for a full refund.

They are a bit pricey but honestly for what you get, they are not too bad at all. And yes there is probably a reason everyone goes for one.

On the other hand, PC is great and cheaper for similar specs but dont even compare the warranties or design..

For instance the 21.5 inch for $1299 you get:

21.5-inch: 2.7GHz

• 2.7GHz quad-core Intel Core i5
• Turbo Boost up to 3.2GHz
• 8GB (two 4GB) memory
• 1TB hard drive1
• NVIDIA GeForce GT 640M with 512MB
• And the screen of course.

Im not sure what a PC with all the above would cost with a warranty.

Good luck!!

 

[TapWater]

Should also mention, if you know a teacher or student, you can get a solid $200 off! Usually pretty straight forward to organise via online.

 

[biostud]

Put as much money towards the monitor as possible to get a 27" IPS monitor, they're not that expensive anymore, but working at 2560x1440 is really worth it.

 

[Sleepingforest]

The lowest cost model is actually reasonably good value--a comparable panel alone is $700-800 (though Dell will give the same kind of pixel perfect guarantee), which leaves only $500-600 for the actual computer.

That's where the good side of Apple ends though. For example, if you build your own, you typically get warranty for 2-3 years for free on the parts, the only downside being a considerable downtime during the RMA process. Apple also gouges on upgrades and it's hard to replace parts within the computer on your own if you want a cheaper upgrade. You can get a significantly better processor, more RAM, and a graphics card that fits your needs if you build your own, plus you can manage your own HDD/SSD arrangement (put in bulk storage, a scratch disk, and a programs drive, for example, rather than being limited by Apple's 1 drive). You can also pick what it looks like: a sleek aluminum, or maybe a plain matte black, or even a gentle LED glow underneath--there are cases for pretty much every taste.

You also have a better upgrade path, since you can swap parts in and out pretty freely if you build your own.

 

[mgh-pa]

Thanks for the insight. I am in fact a teacher, so I do get a substantial discount on Adobe software, Windows, and of course a small discount on Apple.

Part of me wants to try an Apple product simply for the fact that I've never owned one. It's just a hard pill to swallow with the pricing.

I had considered getting a Macbook, loaded with dual HDs (SSD OS/App, and HDD for files) and 8+GB RAM and just editing on that, and using an external monitor.

If I was going mobile, it would be a much easier decision.

 

[Essence_of_War]

Apple's got a 2-week return or exchange policy.

You could always try something in your budget-range for a week, and then return it if you don't like the hit your wallet has taken vs. the experience of the apple product.

 

[Sleepingforest]

I will say that Apple makes top-notch laptops. The Macbook Pro packs a rare combination of power, battery, and weight, along with a great screen.

If it's going to be mostly a stationary computer though, you might as well go with a higher end desktop--and that's where Apple begins to look less good.

 

[snoylekim]

agree that mobile would be a much easier decision ..I use a MacBook Pro 15" Retina , and , not much touches it unless you get into the laptop/workstation space .. it's perfect for Photo work..except I need at least a 24" calibrated monitor for my primary workflow

 

[mgh-pa]

agree that mobile would be a much easier decision ..I use a MacBook Pro 15" Retina , and , not much touches it unless you get into the laptop/workstation space .. it's perfect for Photo work..except I need at least a 24" calibrated monitor for my primary workflow

What made you decide to go mobile?

 

[snoylekim]

What made you decide to go mobile?

I do both ..sometimes need to carry the work with me ..my primary workstation is a Windows based desktop ... although it's capable of most of the processing I do , the retina is not the primary content producer ..