Two Core i7-860 builds with very high CPU temps...

Discussion in 'CPUs and Overclocking' started by Brunnis, Nov 3, 2009.

  1. Brunnis

    Brunnis Senior member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Messages:
    480
    Likes Received:
    38
    I'd like your input on an issue that me and a friend have with our recently built Core i7 860 based machines. The issue is that we're seeing very high CPU temperatures on both our builds, whether we're using the stock cooler or Scythe Ninja 2/Thermalright Ultra-120 Extreme. We use Prime95 to generate full load on all cores and with the stock cooler and at stock frequency (2.93GHz - Turbo Mode on), we both get temps of ~85C. I have the Ultra-120 Extreme and when I switch to that, the temp drops to around 62C. The fan I'm using spins at 1050RPM. My friend has a Ninja 2 and a fan running on a similar speed and he gets around 65C. We've used a few different programs for measuring the temps, but they seem to give similar readings. Right now, we're using Everest.

    Now, although these temperatures still seem a little high considering the good coolers, they would be okay for stock operation. However, both me and my friend are overclockers and this is where things start getting nasty. The temperature rises rapidly when we start upping the frequency. For example, at 3.5GHz and 1.24V, my CPU full loads at ~81C. I've tried connecting a slightly faster fan (1550RPM), but it had only negligible impact on the temperature (maybe 2C). We have both checked the contact to the heatspreader and our coolers do seem to make good contact.

    Interestingly, the coolers do not get as hot as they should be if the CPU really output enough heat to reach 80+C (and assuming good contact). After one hour of Prime95, the base of my cooler was hot, but not that hot. If I kept my finger on it for a little while, it started to hurt a little, but it was nowhere near as hot as I'd expect with a CPU running at over 80C. My friend has noticed the exact same thing on his Ninja.

    The only reasons for this that we can think of is that the CPU die has bad contact with the heatspreader, or that the temperature sensors don't really work as intended. We've read around on the net and there seem to be a few people with similar temps, but there also seem to be a lot of people that can reach 4GHz on air. I definitely wouldn't dare going over 3.6GHz on this setup... So, my question is if you've seen any similar behavior or heard anything along these lines before?

    Perhaps I should e-mail Intel directly about this issue, but I don't give much for consumer tech support from big companies. Plus, they're probably not that eager to help when they hear that the CPU actually does work as intended. I guess I could claim that the CPU actually gets 10-15C hotter than the maximum allowed temp (which is ~73C according to Intel), but they'd probably just say that it's fine as long as it works...

    EDIT: See sig for full system info.
     
    #1 Brunnis, Nov 3, 2009
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2009
  2. Loading...

    Similar Threads - Core builds high Forum Date
    AMD 2990WX 32 core 64 thread Builders thread Pics starting build ! CPUs and Overclocking Aug 6, 2018
    What platform would you use for a Budget build Core i5/i7 PC? CPUs and Overclocking Dec 26, 2016
    fx6300 or core i3 3240 for budget gaming build? CPUs and Overclocking Jul 30, 2013
    Need Help on build : Core i5 3350P VS AMD FX8120 CPUs and Overclocking Dec 12, 2012
    Undervolting Questions for New Build w/Core i3 2120T CPUs and Overclocking Jun 27, 2012

  3. latch

    latch Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2007
    Messages:
    66
    Likes Received:
    0
    It does seem like something is odd, are you sure the heatsinks are securely installed. I have mine at 3.5ghz stock running at 61C under load.
     
  4. Markfw

    Markfw CPU Moderator VC&G Moderator Elite Member
    Super Moderator

    Joined:
    May 16, 2002
    Messages:
    16,664
    Likes Received:
    3,757
    62c on a 120 util does not seem that high for full load. Is that@3.5 like in your sig ?
     
  5. Hyperlite

    Hyperlite Diamond Member

    Joined:
    May 25, 2004
    Messages:
    5,667
    Likes Received:
    1
    Brunnis, are you saying that @ 3.5 with no vCore boost you're running ~80C load with the 120? That's definitely high, just a freq bump shouldn't cause that much temp rise...
     
  6. GLeeM

    GLeeM Elite Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2004
    Messages:
    7,184
    Likes Received:
    127
    Are the high temps with the side of the case on or off?
     
  7. Brunnis

    Brunnis Senior member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Messages:
    480
    Likes Received:
    38
    Yep, the heatsink is definitely on tight. Kind of hard to fail mounting the TRUE correctly as well. What program are you using to generate full load on the CPU?

    62C is full load (Prime95, 8 threads) on stock 2.93GHz (using turbo mode). At 3.5GHz it's 81C. Disabling HT lowers the temp by around 10C.

    I have bumped the voltage by a small amount, to 1.24V. Still looks like a large temp rise, though.

    They're with the side on. I believe I get very similar temps with it off, but I'll check to make sure.
     
  8. Dudael

    Dudael Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2009
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi,

    I have the same problem :S. Yesterday I bought an Asus P7P55D, 4x2GB OCZ Gold 1600-CL8 and the i7-860.
    I've a custom made watercooling system (quite similar to old kits sold by asestek) and once I was able to reinstall everything... I was shocked when I saw 40-45C at idle and more than 85-95C under load (which I stopped quickly to avoid any hardware failure).

    The funny thing is that I touched the CPU block and it was almost cold, and the GPU which is connected to the same cooling system reported a temp. of only 40-44C and from my experience, if the CPU is heating up, the water also and the GPU although idle, raise its temp a few degrees (is a common sense act/react).

    Of course, I have double and triple checked that the contact between the CPU and the water block is fine (I used Artic Silver too) but I will try it again once I arrive at home.

    For the time being, I have been reading forums and it seems this is a very common problem but in all reviews I have read, any word about it O_O.

    The thing Im going to check is also this BIOS setting:

    DIMM 1/2 & 3/4 DQ vref

    That should be on 0.0V.

    Other thing to try is... just unplug 2 DIMMs and left the machine with 4GB and 2 DIMMs installed and check how it works. Otherwise, Im completely messed up so I will read this thread to see if we are able to sort out this issue.

    In addition, Im also an overclocker but... with this system there is no way at all! I can not even play any games because 90C is too much for the CPU.

    See you later
     
  9. Hyperlite

    Hyperlite Diamond Member

    Joined:
    May 25, 2004
    Messages:
    5,667
    Likes Received:
    1
    You guys both have P7P55Ds....
     
  10. aigomorla

    aigomorla Cases and Cooling Mod PC Gaming Mod Elite Member
    Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2005
    Messages:
    16,953
    Likes Received:
    462
    take your side pannel off.

    Then load your computer with the side panel open.

    So your computer can get fresh air.

    See if your temps get drastically lower.
    If thats the case, you need to head over to my section and learn how to cable manage.
     
  11. ekoostik

    ekoostik Senior member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2009
    Messages:
    202
    Likes Received:
    0
    What is your ambient temp? 85C seems high. When I loaded up my 860 on Prime95 8 threads for over two hours I run at temps ~74C (max hit was ~77C) while ambient temps were ~21-22C. I confirmed with 3 different programs, SpeedFan initially report 15C too LOW so I had to add an offset. Also used HWMonitor and RealTemp.


    The 73C thermal specification is the maximum CPU temperature (aka Tcase). Are you reporting the core temperatures (Tjunction)? Core temperatures are usually ~5C higher, so max core temperature is really around 78C.
     
  12. Brunnis

    Brunnis Senior member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Messages:
    480
    Likes Received:
    38
    Temps dropped from ~81C to around ~72C, so that's a pretty decent drop. The cables are nice and tidy already, but I'm only using two 120mm fans at 1000-1500RPM. I've tried with much higher speed fans and the CPU temp drops to around 77C with the case closed. The Lian-Li PC-A10A that I'm using is hardly superb when it comes to cooling design, so that may have a thing or two to do with all of this. It has a top 120mm fan and one at the back, but the problem is that I can't use the top one with my P7P55D. The fan would block the 4-pin 12V-connector...

    Anyway, right now I'm running with the case open at 3.6GHz and 1.25V and the temp on the hottest core is 75-76C while running Prime95.

    I don't think that's the issue here. The core temperature values read by a program such as RealTemp is, to the best of my knowledge, not tampered with by the motherboard.

    My ambient is 21-22C. As said above, max temp with side door off is 75-76C. Keep in mind that this is with a rather low speed (1050RPM) fan on the CPU.

    Yep, got that explained to me on another forum. Don't know why I didn't catch that myself, since it's something that I've known before. I haven't had to worry about temps for a long time, though, so I guess it slipped my mind. Anyway, I was told by the author of RealTemp that the core temperature usually is as much as 20-25C higher than Tcase. This would explain why Intel allows the CPU to ship with a stock cooler that lets it go beyond 80C core temp, since it would still be lower than the max Tcase. All temps I've reported are for the core.

    So, since the thermal throttling kicks in at 100C core, anything up to 99C is actually considered good enough. Keeping the core at 85C worst case (and Prime95 using 8 threads is probably pretty much worse case) should without doubt be perfectly fine.
     
    #11 Brunnis, Nov 4, 2009
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2009
  13. latch

    latch Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2007
    Messages:
    66
    Likes Received:
    0
    IntelBurnTest 2.3 running at Maximum
     
  14. Dudael

    Dudael Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2009
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi,

    finally after doing several tests, I got it!

    - I removed 2 memory DIMM -> didnt help!

    - reinstall a couple of times more the waterblock over the CPU -> didnt help!

    - manually adjust memory voltage (it was set too high at 1.8v so I lowered it to 1.65) -> didnt help!

    And finally, I decide to upgrade my BIOS (I had a very very old version, in fact it is not listed on the Asus official web: 211 or so, but on the 2 hundred range). The latest one is 7xx so I tried it, using the Asus Flash utility didnt work as it didnt recognize the BIOS room so I use the Asus Update from Windows and voila!

    With the BIOS update these are my temps:

    - without overclock the CPU, Im at 25-30C at idle and 50-53C at full load (using IntelBurnTest).

    - BCLK at 166 with the CPU running at 3.66Ghz, idle 35-40C and load 70-75C at stock voltage.

    Hope this can help you!

    Cheers

    Edit: my ambient temp is a bit high 25-27C.
     
    #13 Dudael, Nov 6, 2009
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2009
  15. Brunnis

    Brunnis Senior member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Messages:
    480
    Likes Received:
    38
    Glad to see that you worked it out! Unfortunately, for me, I'm already using the latest (711) BIOS.
     
  16. Dudael

    Dudael Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2009
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi Brunnis,

    I can see on your signature that you are running your memory at 1T setting... I tried to find that on my BIOS but without luck so would you mind to let me know where did you change that?

    thanks you very much!
    Cheers
     
  17. leatherface7

    leatherface7 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2009
    Messages:
    90
    Likes Received:
    0
    I realize this is an old thread I am reviving, but I am having this same problem so was wondering if a solution was ever found, specifically towards Brunnis?

    In the meantime, I am going to double check some thigns and fiddle with my side panel and computer positioning some more and report back tomorrow.
     
  18. leatherface7

    leatherface7 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2009
    Messages:
    90
    Likes Received:
    0
    So I tested some things out last night.
    My Build:
    ******
    Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit

    G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800)

    Intel Core i7-860 Lynnfield 2.8GHz LGA 1156 95W Quad-Core Processor BX80605I7860

    ASRock P55 DELUXE3 LGA 1156 Intel P55 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard

    CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS

    Antec Nine Hundred Two Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case

    Western Digital Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5"

    1 x HIS H587FN1GD Radeon HD 5870 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 HDCP

    Scythe Mugen Reb b Cooler.
    ******
    ======
    Just built this about a week ago, and my system seems to be idling at 45, hits about 70 with full effects on CoD:MW (Only game I really have right now to test), and when running Prime 95 Small FFT's, will instantly hit 80, and hit 95 after about 30 seconds.

    Ambient Temp of my room is around 26.
    Bios shows VCore to be 1.24, though I noticed while running Prime95 that it only sat around 1.10
    VTT was set at 1.264, but I had reduced this to 1.219
    DRAM is at 1.559
    I had barely OC'ed, just moving the Bclk to 136 as I don't even want to mess with it with my temps being the way they are. I have changed my RAM profile to Profile1 making it run at 1600 as opposed to 1333.
    ======

    Things I have tried:

    Removing side panel - no effect

    moving my case above my desk for better airflow, currently it is in an enclosure just barely bigger than the case (dropped about 2 C)

    Moved Vcore and VTT down even further - no effect ?

    double check heatsink - seemed to be on properly

    I then decided to remount and apply AS5, though I may not have completely cleaned it from the cpu before applying just a pea sized drop this time and letting the heatsink flatten it out. After restarting my idle temp is sitting at about 51 now and loads are 5-6 degress higher as well....

    //////////////
    To monitor temps, I am using real temp, core temp, and the ASUS OC software that came with my mobo. The ASUS OC software shows my cpu temp to idle at about 45, and only hit a max of 75 when running Prime 95 small fft's (and the mobo at about 45) and it takes time to build up that high, while the other 2 applications shows it to immediately jump to 90+ instantly.

    Lastly, I ran the sensor test that real temp provides, and I'm not sure how relevant this is but at the following loads, the temp was x distance to TJMax
    5% 42
    15% 17
    27% 7
    40% 0.9
    //////////////////

    Could realtemp and coretemp just be providing wrong readings? I have tried to provide as much info as I could the first time around, but any questions/comments/answers would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!!!!
     
  19. leatherface7

    leatherface7 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2009
    Messages:
    90
    Likes Received:
    0
    Someone give me some input! :)

    Perhaps I will try to remount the cooler again, even though its pretty painful :(. Perhaps I will also try to mount the cpu fan differently.
    If those fail I could attempt to mount the stock cooler just to see the results.

    I really don't even have any idea what else I could possibly try.
     
  20. outseeker

    outseeker Junior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2010
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    I found some interesting info here about I7 temperatures http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/267871-28-load

    My I7-860 on a GA-P55A-UD6 motherboard with massive Ultra 120 eXtreme heatsink (one Noctua NF-P12 fan @ full speed) idles in Win7 64-bit @ pretty well dead on 40 degrees celcius.

    I had quite a hard time achieving the 3.5gHz overclock and 2004mHz RAM profile it's running without disabling the temperature throttle type functions (EIST etc.).. But that's another story I suppose!

    Running Prime95 in my current configuration appears to max the CPU temperature out at 85 degrees and no higher. It's still a bit too high really but I could recommend you use some of this thermal paste which improved my earlier temperatures a bit (at least I don't reach 95 degrees lol)
    http://cgi.ebay.com.au/IC-Diamond-7...89166756?pt=AU_Components&hash=item19bfa0c4a4

    I have a couple of useful notes for people doing I7 builds while I'm here. If you are using a non-stock cooler that screws down into the motherboard (such as the the Ultra 120 eXtreme) be aware that overtightening it can cause your RAM to show as 50% in the BIOS and Dual Channel Mode potentially not function. The system (as in my case) can boot fine and run perfectly while only using half RAM. Windows showed 4GB RAM (2GB Usable) by the way.

    The solution is to simply re-adjust the CPU cooler, as it's actually pulling the CPU off angle and causing a disconnection. Just loosen the tightest of the four screws a little and test, or re-mount as flush as possible at any rate.

    In regards to temperature, use as little thermal paste as possible. It begins to insulate if you use too much, which can be why you have a hot CPU and only a moderately hot heatsink. "Peas" come in all sizes- "less is more" I think would be a better rule for applying thermal paste.

    I've also heard of people planing the surface of their heatsink down, as the manufacturers can make them slightly concave or convex which of course that means you end up with less heatsink-to-CPU contact which provides crappy temperature conductivity. I don't know about planing it yourself, but any metal worker can do it easily and well.

    If you have good, flush contact between CPU and a large cooler and your temperatures are high, either it's not as flush as you think or you have simply found the limits of your cooling system. Hope I was of some use to someone.
     
  21. outseeker

    outseeker Junior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2010
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    It probably doesn't help the full load temperature (unless it fluctuates perhaps) but to reduce your idle temperature you can:

    - Ensure the EIST function is Enabled in the BIOS
    - Ensure the C1E function is Enabled in the BIOS
    - Enable other thermal management related functions in this area of your BIOS

    My system idles at its 167mHz BCLK speed x 9.0 multiplier (approx 1.5gHz) which equates to a difference of about 10 degrees in idle temperature! It ramps right up to my 3.5gHz overclock when under load. I don't know why you would disable the thermal management features really unless you turn your PC on, use it, then turn it right off again but my BIOS actually disabled the above thermal management settings as soon as I changed any frequency or multiplier setting! Yours may too.

    If anyone is wondeing if they lose performance by doing as I suggest: my games are running kickass and the Win7 Experience Index reports 7.6 for CPU and 7.8 for the RAM. I have and recommend all thermal management manually Enabled in the BIOS. I don't think I ever maintain 100% load while playing games anyway- these I7 systems are beast! ;)
     
  22. RavenSEAL

    RavenSEAL Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2010
    Messages:
    8,671
    Likes Received:
    1
    Wow, these I7s are getting pretty hot lately...
     
  23. outseeker

    outseeker Junior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2010
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Random spam for the link in your tag or wat?
     
  24. ability

    ability Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2003
    Messages:
    136
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm wanting to get a 870, but after reading this among other threads I'm almost scared to get one. Debating between this and the 760, money isn't an issue vs. the two, only $60 difference. I guess I'll keep up the research.
     
  25. ehume

    ehume Golden Member

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2009
    Messages:
    1,244
    Likes Received:
    29
    Lynnfields do tend to run hot. You have to be careful with all your voltages. You need to use only a tiny bit of TIM (2-3 grains of short rice). You need to use a decent heatsink. But OCing to 4GHz is relatively easy.