[tweaktown] AMD cuts 290x by $150

[wand3r3r]

As I mentioned, branding and marketing are just BS for the unaware. Since they are priced about where they lie I think they are close. As long as the 970 is $380 I think AMD isn't far off.

290
+7% 970 / 290x
+ a couple percent high resolution 290x

Given that the 290 is ~7% slower and 10% cheaper (27% cheaper than gouging prices) it's definitely priced well.

The 290x could be close to the 970 and once the price hits $329 it should drop a bit?

Idc, I'm not going to defend anyone's pricing strategy, but imo it's not far off.

 

[tviceman]

To use your usual argument, what games use 11.3? R9 290 and R9 290X will support DirectX 11.2 Tier 2 under Windows 8.1 so it's only 11.3 they might be missing (what uses that?).

DX12. The extra DX11 features are meh. Who cares. But DX12? Yes. Does Hawaii support, in hardware, DX12 features? Or will it be software-based features? Nothing has been announced by AMD, while Nvidia has been talking Maxwell and DX12 side by side. Actually, does GM204 support hardware-based DX12 features? I'm not even sure about that TBH.

Noise is just fud.

Noise is NOT just fud. No way. Never. Maybe you don't care about noise, but I don't like wearing headphones when I have perfectly good speakers and/or surround when my wife is away. Compare reviews where GTX 780 TI's or 780's use the same coolers as r9 290x's or 290's (gigabyte, ASUS, and MSI aftermarket cards) and you'll see that hawaii either runs hotter at the same noise levels, or louder at equal temps, or louder and hotter. It's a matter of fact, it's not fud, and it is a tangible factor.

Heat in a case is suddenly a problem? There were crickets chirping over this heat while the 780 ti/690 etc. were pretty close to the 290/x in power consumption (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/1059?vs=1072). A higher psu is also pretty much a fringe concern. I'll be interested in this statement when the 980 ti comes out at 225w+.

Heat in the case is always a potential problem, but Hawaii is dumping more heat for less performance while being louder. So when a faster, quieter, slightly less power hungry card comes around it's more forgivable.

If the 290 is ~7% slower than a throttling reference 290, then the much better aftermarket cards (who buys 290/x reference nowadays?) are certainly worth 10% less then the 970. Sure the prices are high atm ($370+) but we can compare MSRP $329 / $299 with a 7% performance difference.

I think AMD has a compelling sell with the r9 290 at $299 when factoring in it's game bundle. But, on it's own, no I disagree. The GTX970 is definitely worth the $30-40 price increase for the added performance, quieter operation and/or lower temps, lower power draw, and possible DX12 full compatibility. However, while the 970 is marked up on amazon and newegg during it's initial release and ultra-high demand, r9 290's at $299 are great alternatives for those who want Mantle, the games bundle, or don't mind the external factors.

 

[Termie]

This should have happened weeks ago - AMD would have picked up a huge number of sales. Now it may be too late. The GTX 970 is starting to come back in stock (though $330 for a top model is not going to happen). The 290 Tri-X is a top model, so compare it to the out-of-stock $360 MSI 970 Gaming to make it a fair comparison. It's priced well. The 290X is and always has been overpriced versus the 290.

By the way, the Tri-X is $290AR, not $280 shipped, which is lots of folks above have quoted.

 

[Grooveriding]

Guys DX12 is worthless. The API doesn't even exist and won't until the fall of 2015 when Windows 10 releases....

At that point there will be a lot more DX12 cards and the 980 will be a mid-range card that will quite likely be struggling to run any DX12 games. Given new API adoption I'd guess there will probably only be a small handful of DX12 games around by then anyways; Battlefield 5 and a few others.

Maybe stick to performance and price. A few here on the forum like to argue over 50W, but most video card buyers aren't here arguing over an extra 50 cents a month on the power bill, they just care about price/perf.

 

[96Firebird]

Guys DX12 is worthless...

...and the 980 will be a mid-range card that will quite likely be struggling to run any DX12 games...

Where do you come up with this nonsense? I hope no one reads your posts and actually believes it, instead laughs at it like I did.

 

[wand3r3r]

DX12. The extra DX11 features are meh. Who cares. But DX12? Yes. Does Hawaii support, in hardware, DX12 features? Or will it be software-based features? Nothing has been announced by AMD, while Nvidia has been talking Maxwell and DX12 side by side. Actually, does GM204 support hardware-based DX12 features? I'm not even sure about that TBH.


Noise is NOT just fud. No way. Never. Maybe you don't care about noise, but I don't like wearing headphones when I have perfectly good speakers and/or surround when my wife is away. Compare reviews where GTX 780 TI's or 780's use the same coolers as r9 290x's or 290's (gigabyte, ASUS, and MSI aftermarket cards) and you'll see that hawaii either runs hotter at the same noise levels, or louder at equal temps, or louder and hotter. It's a matter of fact, it's not fud, and it is a tangible factor.


Heat in the case is always a potential problem, but Hawaii is dumping more heat for less performance while being louder. So when a faster, quieter, slightly less power hungry card comes around it's more forgivable.



I think AMD has a compelling sell with the r9 290 at $299 when factoring in it's game bundle. But, on it's own, no I disagree. The GTX970 is definitely worth the $30-40 price increase for the added performance, quieter operation and/or lower temps, lower power draw, and possible DX12 full compatibility. However, while the 970 is marked up on amazon and newegg during it's initial release and ultra-high demand, r9 290's at $299 are great alternatives for those who want Mantle, the games bundle, or don't mind the external factors.

DX12 is huge, if that's what 11.3 means then it's a big deal. (Groove has a point though, this will be mid range by then)

From what I recall the tri-x is one of the quieter cards out there. I'd have to scour some reviews to see exactly where it lies, but the aftermarket 290/x's aren't loud. It might be hotter (82 vs. 94), but who cares if it's running in spec?

Your other points, I can see the point and agree, it's just how much do you value them? That's the difference in our opinion, I don't think they are very bad.

If the 970 wasn't voltage neutered, I think it would have everything it needs to make it an extremely great card. It has all the ingredients for a phenomenal overclocker with low heat/tdp and plenty of core headroom.

The Radeon R9 290 has dropped from its $399 price to $299, while its more powerful brother, the R9 290X drops from $549 to $399, a drop of $150. The R9 285 has also dropped to $229 or so, while the 280X is down to around $269. The new price cuts are effective immediately, with Newegg and Amazon prices being adjusted already.

They revised the article.

 

[Paul98]

Guys DX12 is worthless. The API doesn't even exist and won't until the fall of 2015 when Windows 10 releases....

At that point there will be a lot more DX12 cards and the 980 will be a mid-range card that will quite likely be struggling to run any DX12 games. Given new API adoption I'd guess there will probably only be a small handful of DX12 games around by then anyways; Battlefield 5 and a few others.

Maybe stick to performance and price. A few here on the forum like to argue over 50W, but most video card buyers aren't here arguing over an extra 50 cents a month on the power bill, they just care about price/perf.

I do agree that it doesn't matter right now since DX12 isn't out, and wont be out till next year when AMD will have it's new cards out.

The API does exist, and DX12 already has an implementation in UE4. Which alone should give a good number of DX12 games on release.

If anything DX12 will give better frame rates on what we have now.

 

[wand3r3r]

Guys DX12 is worthless. The API doesn't even exist and won't until the fall of 2015 when Windows 10 releases....

At that point there will be a lot more DX12 cards and the 980 will be a mid-range card that will quite likely be struggling to run any DX12 games. Given new API adoption I'd guess there will probably only be a small handful of DX12 games around by then anyways; Battlefield 5 and a few others.

Maybe stick to performance and price. A few here on the forum like to argue over 50W, but most video card buyers aren't here arguing over an extra 50 cents a month on the power bill, they just care about price/perf.

I semi-agree, it's merely being "pushed" since the favorite brand has it. Look at the proponents posts when talking about kepler 11.0 vs. hawaii 11.2 etc. the goalpost has clearly been shifted.

On the other hand, when making a purchase now, I do want to have the option to keep it and it's longevity is an important factor for me (even if I do upgrade sooner). You're right that we will have new cards on the market to support dx12 and these will likely be mid-range cards by then. Future proofing is hard, but when comparing two alternatives I would like the "more" future proofed card, as long as you don't have to compromise.

 

[Techhog]

To everyone saying they need to drop further, I highly doubt that they can. They're going to need to ride it out until Spring, for better or worse. No point in selling it at a loss. If the rumors about the 380X beating the 980 end up being true though, that will be an exciting time.

 

[zlatan]

It lacks DX11.2, 11.3, PhysX, DSR, VXGI and so on on the other front.

It already support DX11.2, and it can support DX11.3.
PhysX is like Mantle. Both can be supported by every IHV, but they don't want it.
DSR is a software feature, doesn't require special hardware.
VXGI is an effect. If you mean VM, than the GCN already have an OpenGL extension with the same core functionality. GL_AMD_vertex_shader_viewport_index

 

[Paul98]

To everyone saying they need to drop further, I highly doubt that they can. They're going to need to ride it out until Spring, for better or worse. No point in selling it at a loss. If the rumors about the 380X beating the 980 end up being true though, that will be an exciting time.

If we see the 380x new arch, on 20nm, and with HBM, the 980 won't stand much of a chance.

 

[Greenlepricon]

Considering that so many 780's are selling in the $400 range, I don't think AMD needs to drop more. There is always a discrepancy between last gen and current gen prices. In many people's eyes, they are still competing. For instance, one of my less tech-savvy friends wants a Titan Black. It has zero benefit for him over even a 780 or 290 as all he does is game, and he doesn't stay up to date enough to realize new cards came out. It's just how some people think, and if they're in the AMD crowd, that may be their choice.

 

[cytg111]

Are you going to keep it real? Or are you going to quote prices that aren't currently realistic? We see what the prices are and it isn't 329 at the moment. It's less than what they can be had for. So don't roll your eyes at me if the number one vendor we all use is the vendor we choose to look at.

Thanks. You want to win, or be the reasonable one in an argument, you have to keep things real.

Shintai will back _any_ argument as long as it is some level of anti-amd. I just ignore it.

Infraction issued for member callout.
-- stahlhart

 

[Grooveriding]

Where do you come up with this nonsense? I hope no one reads your posts and actually believes it, instead laughs at it like I did.

Just because you get frustrated and have trouble understanding that the new maxwell cards are for the most part price/perf improvements, not absolute performance improvements(980=780ti+8% - 970=780+5%), meaning we will see a huge absolute performance jump in gm200 making gm204 mid-range on the performance scale. That is no reason to make a weak comment that adds nothing and you have to laugh at yourself.

My guess is the reality of your hope is that you're mostly alone in it...

I do agree that it doesn't matter right now since DX12 isn't out, and wont be out till next year when AMD will have it's new cards out.

The API does exist, and DX12 already has an implementation in UE4. Which alone should give a good number of DX12 games on release.

If anything DX12 will give better frame rates on what we have now.

Yeah the developers have it but there is no consumer availability till late next year. A year changes everything GPU wise.

I don't have high expectations for UE4 after learning it doesn't support multi GPU, what a blunder.

 

[Keysplayr]

Yeah the developers have it but there is no consumer availability till late next year. A year changes everything GPU wise.

I don't have high expectations for UE4 after learning it doesn't support multi GPU, what a blunder.

Well it's a good thing that it appears GPUs cycle every two plus years then. When did Kepler and Tahiti launch? A long while ago.

 

[Sohaltang]

I want to see some real world performance. Everyone keeps posting benchmarks comparing the 900 series to old reference 780's and 290's. I know valley is not the end all be all of performance but the valley bench thread is light with 900 series results and the ones that are there are getting killed by last gen cards. Even the 970 SLI is just a few percent faster than a 7970 cf.

 

[dn7309]

I'll wait until the 290x drops to 200$ then I'll crossfire

 

[Grooveriding]

I want to see some real world performance. Everyone keeps posting benchmarks comparing the 900 series to old reference 780's and 290's. I know valley is not the end all be all of performance but the valley bench thread is light with 900 series results and the ones that are there are getting killed by last gen cards. Even the 970 SLI is just a few percent faster than a 7970 cf.

The 900 cards are bad at Valley but do well otherwise. They actually do really well in Firestrike compared to other cards, they do better there in performance improvement than they do in actual game performance.

 

[Subyman]

I want to see some real world performance. Everyone keeps posting benchmarks comparing the 900 series to old reference 780's and 290's. I know valley is not the end all be all of performance but the valley bench thread is light with 900 series results and the ones that are there are getting killed by last gen cards. Even the 970 SLI is just a few percent faster than a 7970 cf.

Uhm, where are you seeing that a 7970 CF is just a few percentage points away from the 970 SLI? Guru3d shows 970 on par with Titan-Z and the 295X. The 7990 is about 30-35% slower.

 

[Paul98]

Yeah the developers have it but there is no consumer availability till late next year. A year changes everything GPU wise.

I don't have high expectations for UE4 after learning it doesn't support multi GPU, what a blunder.

Yet... It's still in early stages with huge improvements every month. They are still doing lots of work on the renderer, and there are more pressing additions that are being added that will benefit everyone. Rather than multi GPU support, which will most likely would have to be rewritten after many of these other updates are added. I expect they will add it in the future I would guess next year some time.

That being said anyone who want's it in their game now could add it themselves.

Edit: But none of that really changes that lots of games will be coming out using UE4 and DX12.

 

[Lyfer]

Once 970 stock replenishes, AMD will need to drop further.

The fat lady has sung. The 290's are good cards but a lot of the people I know play blizzard games and they just run faster on the green camp. Also not having to spend $$$ for a more powerful PsU and cooling is worth it to go with a stock gtx 970.

 

[x3sphere]

These price drops are still not low enough, R9 290 should be $200 and 290X $250.

Will be interesting to see how the 960 stacks up against the R9 290.

 

[ShintaiDK]

To use your usual argument, what games use 11.3? R9 290 and R9 290X will support DirectX 11.2 Tier 2 under Windows 8.1 so it's only 11.3 they might be missing (what uses that?).

Did AMD release new drivers with feature level 11.2 under 8.1? Else its still 11.1 only and some promise people have been waiting for for a long time.

 

[ShintaiDK]

It already support DX11.2, and it can support DX11.3.
PhysX is like Mantle. Both can be supported by every IHV, but they don't want it.
DSR is a software feature, doesn't require special hardware.
VXGI is an effect. If you mean VM, than the GCN already have an OpenGL extension with the same core functionality. GL_AMD_vertex_shader_viewport_index

First of all I would like you to show me the DX11.2 part. After that you can document the 11.3 part.

 

[ShintaiDK]

DX12 is huge, if that's what 11.3 means then it's a big deal.

DX11.3 is featurewise the same as DX12.

DX12 is for the AAA companies, abit like Mantle.

DX11.3 is for the 99% developer crowd that cant afford DX12/Mantle style development.