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TV versus Projector on a limited budget

Fardringle

Fardringle

Diamond Member
My almost 15-year-old 27" 4:3 CRT TV is finally dying enough that it has to be replaced. I don't watch a lot of TV, and frankly the CRT has been adequate for what little I do watch. However, now that it is replacement time, I'd like to have a bit of fun with it. I have some very specific requirements that have to be met, and I'd like your opinions on what options are available (and what would give the best results).

First off, the max budget is $500. Slightly higher is probably OK, but not much more than that. I know that this limits things a lot, but spending more for limited use just isn't worth it to me.

Within that budget, I believe I have two options:

1: A plasma/LCD that is a MAXIMUM of 30 inches wide, including the bezel/frame/etc. So probably something around a 32" wide screen with very narrow bezels. This size limit is due to the space available in the entertainment center/shelving set where the current TV lives. There isn't any other good place to put the TV, and I need the shelves, so the entertainment center stays where it is any my TV choices have to fit in the available space.

2: A projector with a screen that is 6 feet (72 inches) wide. Again, this is due to the entertainment center, but I could hang a screen over the front of the shelves when I want to use it, and the entertainment center just happens to have perfect proportions for a 16:9 screen that is 6 feet wide and 3 feet 7 inches tall. I would most likely make a screen with material like blackout cloth or whatever is the current favorite for a do-it-yourself screen these days.


The obvious first choice would seem to be the projector with a vastly bigger screen. But, with only partially controllable lighting conditions (some light leaks in around the edges of the heavy curtains over a large window in the room), could a sub $500 projector produce an acceptably bright picture for a good viewing experience with a throw distance of around 10 feet (there's a good spot to mount a projector to the ceiling at that distance)? If so, what projector(s) would be the best options?


Seating distance from the screen is about 14 feet, which the "ideal theater" calculators say makes the plasma/LCD way too small, but remember that I have been completely happy with a 27" CRT for many years. I definitely like the idea of a big screen, but if a standard TV would have a significantly better picture, that could matter more than the screen size. What would be the best TVs in this size?
 
I'd stick with LCD. Projectors really go up dramatically in quality in the $1000-3000 range as well as the ability for screen sizes in the 100"+ size. Past that the return on cost gets smaller and smaller.

You'd still have to get a screen too.

I'd check Costco for a TV. You can probably get something pretty decent for that much money. 42" or bigger easily. Not quite as high quality as you can get at a dedicated video store, but good enough, and usually a better value.
 
giantpandaman2 said:
I'd stick with LCD. Projectors really go up dramatically in quality in the $1000-3000 range as well as the ability for screen sizes in the 100"+ size. Past that the return on cost gets smaller and smaller.

You'd still have to get a screen too.

I'd check Costco for a TV. You can probably get something pretty decent for that much money. 42" or bigger easily. Not quite as high quality as you can get at a dedicated video store, but good enough, and usually a better value.
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Thank you for the response. I know a cheap projector wouldn't be great. I'm just looking for options. And sure, a 42" TV could fit in the budget, but NOT in the available space. 32" diagonal (30" horizontal plus bezel) is the absolute maximum possible size I could have for a TV while the projector screen could be 82" diagonal (6 foot horizontal). That's also the maximum possible size, so the ability to have an even larger screen doesn't matter.
 
Do you have a sound system to go with it? a 30" tv is just so small, even a cheap projector will give you a much better experience. But you will need something for the audio
 
No, I don't have (and don't plan to get) a theater sound system. I'll use the same 2 speaker bookshelf system that I have hooked up to my current TV. It doesn't do surround, but I don't really care. It sounds very good for what it does and is good enough for me, and anything I spend on new audio will take away from my available budget for the TV or projector.
 
Most projectors in the $500 range will only be 720p. The color and contrast won't be that good. Depending on how big/small a screen is it'll likely have problems with being bright enough for daylight watching. Beyond that, you'll actually have to pick up a screen that is pretty dark if you plan on watching without good light control. Those tend to be more expensive unless you plan on DIY. Even on the cheap end it's going to be a decent amount of work and you'll have to spend some money to make a decent screen. Sounds like you'll have to hang one so you can't just paint a wall.

Many projectors don't put out sound. I'm not sure about the low end. You might end up with a computer projector. If that's the case, it might put out some sound that you can run to your bookshelves.

Honestly? I'd figure out how to dismantle the entertainment center a bit and just throw a bigger TV in there. Probably the same amount of work as a DIY screen/projector mounting and a lot less hassle for daily TV watching.

As a reference, I have a 1080p projector, but I only us it at night. I use a 50" Panasonic Plasma for my daytime television.
 
giantpandaman2 said:
Most projectors in the $500 range will only be 720p.
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Not a problem. None of the source material will be higher than 720p, and most of it won't even be that high.

The color and contrast won't be that good. Depending on how big/small a screen is it'll likely have problems with being bright enough for daylight watching.
Valid potential issues, and part of why I want opinions. (And thank you for yours!)

Beyond that, you'll actually have to pick up a screen that is pretty dark if you plan on watching without good light control.
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I have some control over the lighting. I just can't make it perfectly dark like a controlled theater. During the day I can get it as dim as maybe the lighting equivalent of a moonlit night at a half (official termed "quarter") moon. So fairly dim, but not totally dark.

Those tend to be more expensive unless you plan on DIY. Even on the cheap end it's going to be a decent amount of work and you'll have to spend some money to make a decent screen. Sounds like you'll have to hang one so you can't just paint a wall.
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I have no intention of buying a commercial screen unless I can find one used/very cheap. Basic white blackout curtain cloth will work fine for me (unless there is a better cheap cloth option).

Many projectors don't put out sound. I'm not sure about the low end. You might end up with a computer projector. If that's the case, it might put out some sound that you can run to your bookshelves.
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Also not a problem. The sound will just go straight from the source to the stereo the same way it does now. (I will not be using HDMI since I don't have anything that uses it.)

Honestly? I'd figure out how to dismantle the entertainment center a bit and just throw a bigger TV in there. Probably the same amount of work as a DIY screen/projector mounting and a lot less hassle for daily TV watching.
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This is a good suggestion and was actually my first option. Unfortunately the design of the entertainment center makes it pretty much impossible. The vertical boards immediately left and right of the current TV opening are the primary load bearers for the whole thing and if I cut away any portion of them to make room for a bigger TV, I might as well cut off the entire top half of the entire entertainment center since it would all become useless. And if I'm going to do that I might as well just get rid of the whole entertainment center and all of the movie collection and books that live on the shelves and just put a TV on a basic stand with no storage space at all. (which I don't want to do)
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I don't know what else to tell you. Get a cheap extendable wall mount and just stretch it away from the back of your entertainment center? Monoprice is a good place to get them. It will probably be pretty ugly but still look better than a cheap projector with a not so good screen.

Depends on how deep your entertainment center is. Honestly, it sounds ancient. Might be a good time to get rid of it anyway. Making wall shelves and buying a table from Ikea or Craigslist are pretty cheap. Then you can just use a TV.

PS-A 720p 6ft diagonal screen is going to look blocky as heck. Just sayin'
 
Personally I am a fan of projectors, so I'm going to recommend a projector. My current recommendation is the Optoma ML750. It's tiny, 720p, has an LED bulb (13-year life @ 4 hours of usage per day), and is currently under $550: (it's usually around $520)

http://www.amazon.com/Optoma-ML750-L...dp/B00GGGQHG8/

The catch with a projector is that your blacks are only as dark as the ambient light level; projectors are just fancy flashlights, so if you can't control your lighting, you're just not going to get a very good picture. Target sells some inexpensive blackout shades by Eclipse.

I have both - a television for daytime watching and a projector in the basement for movies at night. The projector is way more fun because you get a huge screen and it feels more cinematic. But it's also nice to have the TV if I want to pop on a cartoon for the kiddo while we eat lunch in the middle of the day with the sun shining in.

I like LED projectors because they're small & low maintenance. You don't have a $300 bulb to replace. It doesn't heat up the room like mad. They turn on instantly. The 720p resolution is nice if you want non-HD content such as DVD movies, Youtube videos, and SD TV shows - I have Netflix & there's a lot of content that I like that just isn't available in Full HD, so 720p gives a nice mix of high definition for Bluray & HD streamed movies without stretching older shows too much (only to 1280 instead of 1920). I have the older version of the ML750 at home - mine is three times as large (still reasonably small though) and 200 lumens less bright, but still does a good job. I have the ML750 at work for a travel projector & it's pretty awesome.

As far as the screen goes, I have an electric screen and do not recommend one. I just leave it down all the time because it's annoying to have to wait for it to come down. Originally I bought it because I was using the TV & projector in the same room in my last apartment, but now I have them in separate rooms, so it's kind of useless. If I were to go with a "disappearing screen", I would just get a manual pull-down model because you can instantly pull it up or down and also easily adjust the screen size. However, you can just use a white wall, or if you want to go more of the DIY route, there are plenty of roll-your-own screen mixes available online:

http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/diy-screens/24286-diy-screens-index-sticky.html

I like Silver Fire v2.5 by MississippiMan myself:

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/110-diy-screen-section/1311989-official-silver-fire-v-2-thread.html
 
Fardringle said:
So you'd prefer a 32" TV over an 82(ish) inch projector screen? I'll add your opinion to my informal 'poll'. Thanks. 🙂


Already addressed in my long post just above yours.
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if i was stuck in your situation, yes i'd prefer a 32" tv over a projector.

and this is coming from someone who has a 120" screen with his projector heh. $500 simply won't get you anything worth a damn in your setup. the contrast on lower end projectors are already pretty poor, and add that to your room that you said doesn't get really dark and you are going to be watching one washed out picture. it's just not worth it imo.
 
purbeast0 said:
if i was stuck in your situation, yes i'd prefer a 32" tv over a projector.

and this is coming from someone who has a 120" screen with his projector heh. $500 simply won't get you anything worth a damn in your setup. the contrast on lower end projectors are already pretty poor, and add that to your room that you said doesn't get really dark and you are going to be watching one washed out picture. it's just not worth it imo.
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I have a Benq w1070 (I think you can find them for around $700) and it has been outstanding in the opinion of my wife, myself, and my best friend who insists we have to watch the World Cup on my TV...lol

I will also add that I haven't even got a screen for it, I'm just using my beige wall and it still looks great at 150" from about 12 feet away.
 
Kaido said:
Personally I am a fan of projectors, so I'm going to recommend a projector. My current recommendation is the Optoma ML750. It's tiny, 720p, has an LED bulb (13-year life @ 4 hours of usage per day), and is currently under $550: (it's usually around $520)

http://www.amazon.com/Optoma-ML750-L...dp/B00GGGQHG8/
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I missed this bit earlier but I think it deserves a response. I definitely agree with the positives of an LED projector. Less heat, less noise, less maintenance cost, and the light weight and small size would make it a lot easier to mount the projector in the spot I have in mind.

However, wouldn't the significantly lower brightness (lumens) be an issue, particularly when my room can't be perfectly dark except at night? I don't mind dealing with imperfect contrast since my budget is limited, but if the picture isn't bright enough to see clearly in a dimly lit room that would definitely be a problem..
 
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Pr0d1gy said:
I have a Benq w1070 (I think you can find them for around $700) and it has been outstanding in the opinion of my wife, myself, and my best friend who insists we have to watch the World Cup on my TV...lol

I will also add that I haven't even got a screen for it, I'm just using my beige wall and it still looks great at 150" from about 12 feet away.
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i thought mine looked great on my wall too of about the same color until i got a screen and painted my basement darker colors. then i realized how washed out the pic looked before.
 
purbeast0 said:
not true at all. i have a 10ft screen and watch a lot of sports and play many games in 720p and it looks fantastic from 13-14 feet away.
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I have a 9ft screen and 720p from my Xbox360 looks pretty bad in my opinion. Even 1080p is a tiny bit lacking. (Yes, I'm salivating for cheaper 4k projectors, but we all know that's at least 3 years off.)
 
giantpandaman2 said:
I have a 9ft screen and 720p from my Xbox360 looks pretty bad in my opinion. Even 1080p is a tiny bit lacking. (Yes, I'm salivating for cheaper 4k projectors, but we all know that's at least 3 years off.)
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sounds like you have a crappy projector. 1080p blurays look freaking fantastic. killer instinct and ryse look ridiculous on my setup as well and they are 720p.
 
You have speakers, decent light control, and otherwise you will be stuck with a 32" tv. Unless you will be sitting very close to it, going with a projector is by far the best choice. You can get perfectly good 720p projectors in that price range. If you decide to save up couple hundred more you can go with 1080p. But at the size you are looking at 720p should be just fine unless you are sitting real close.
 
Fardringle said:
I missed this bit earlier but I think it deserves a response. I definitely agree with the positives of an LED projector. Less heat, less noise, less maintenance cost, and the light weight and small size would make it a lot easier to mount the projector in the spot I have in mind.

However, wouldn't the significantly lower brightness (lumens) be an issue, particularly when my room can't be perfectly dark except at night? I don't mind dealing with imperfect contrast since my budget is limited, but if the picture isn't bright enough to see clearly in a dimly lit room that would definitely be a problem..
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Yes and no. For starters, LED projectors are supposedly brighter per-lumen than bulb-based projectors. I can tell you that my 500-lumen is barely bright enough for my tastes in a darkened room; the 700-lumen model is far better. I mean, I'm very picky about image quality; check out this video for an example of the 500-lumen model in a lit room - it's not terrible, it's just not as high-quality as in a darkened room: (he turns off the lights at 2:35 into the clip, which gives you a better idea of how it looks in the dark)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ix232GiaHf8#t=91

Second, LED projectors have crazy-high contrast (the ML750 is 10,000:1). I did a shootout next to a couple higher-end projectors and the picture quality was spot on (PT-AE7000 etc.). I have run it in partially-lit rooms with decent results, but again, keep in mind how projectors work - even if you had a 4,000-lumen projector, black is only going to be as black as the ambient light in the room. But that contrast is what makes it amazing - super-great colors & picture detail. Again, it's only 720p instead of 1080p, but I don't notice much of a difference & it works better for SD/DVD/Youtube content than 1080p does.
 
giantpandaman2 said:
I have a 9ft screen and 720p from my Xbox360 looks pretty bad in my opinion. Even 1080p is a tiny bit lacking. (Yes, I'm salivating for cheaper 4k projectors, but we all know that's at least 3 years off.)
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Really? What kind of projector do you have? Mine looks awesome:

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/68-di...ic-pled-w500-led-1280x800-9.html#post22291424

Also to the OP, one of the big things I like about LED projectors is the enhanced contrast. For example, actors with darker skintones show up a lot better than on most televisions sets where they can get washed out or monotone: (photo taken on my cell phone, so it's not the best, but you get the idea)

http://www.avsforum.com/photopost/data/2103891/4/4c/4cbd0205_c70Vi.jpeg

Plus it makes movies look very cinematic & filmic since it's not a bright, glossy cartoony look, especially with skintones:

http://www.avsforum.com/photopost/data/2103891/f/f0/f0f9f1b6_VOTn6.jpeg
 
I'm still holding out on a projector these days myself, spent enough on a new monitor 7 months ago and still have an 747i Olevia that looks good.

I'll get one down the road someday, I even have the room and the sound system for it all ready set up, but when I do it will be something relatively high end.

IMHO you'd want a decent LCD or there are some reasonably priced Plasmas around still.

437256


http://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...icial-olevia-747i-742i-owners-thread-169.html
 
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Here is a all in one, with ever output know to man in the back, with a built in dvd player, speakers should you like to use them, 2500 lumens thats more then bright enough on a sunny day, and will look outstanding at night. Yes its not 1080P, but people dont really understand that with a projector if you sit more then 14 feet away, your eyes cannot tell the diff between 720 or 1080P, the only way you will notice a diff is if you get closer. But anyway, I was in your position about 9 years ago and it really changed the way I like to watch tv or movies, or even games for that matter. Also yes what I linked you to is a refurb, BUT, its a manufacture refurb and has the same warranty as used.

http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/jsp/Product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=yes&sku=V11H335120-N#2

Its $50 more then your budget, but damn man, look at what you will be getting 😉

I forgot to mention its a short throw projector, so it can do the size you want and not need to be on the other side of the room to make that size, or even 100 inches for that matter.
 
Kaido said:
Yes and no. For starters, LED projectors are supposedly brighter per-lumen than bulb-based projectors. I can tell you that my 500-lumen is barely bright enough for my tastes in a darkened room; the 700-lumen model is far better. I mean, I'm very picky about image quality; check out this video for an example of the 500-lumen model in a lit room - it's not terrible, it's just not as high-quality as in a darkened room: (he turns off the lights at 2:35 into the clip, which gives you a better idea of how it looks in the dark)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ix232GiaHf8#t=91

Second, LED projectors have crazy-high contrast (the ML750 is 10,000:1). I did a shootout next to a couple higher-end projectors and the picture quality was spot on (PT-AE7000 etc.). I have run it in partially-lit rooms with decent results, but again, keep in mind how projectors work - even if you had a 4,000-lumen projector, black is only going to be as black as the ambient light in the room. But that contrast is what makes it amazing - super-great colors & picture detail. Again, it's only 720p instead of 1080p, but I don't notice much of a difference & it works better for SD/DVD/Youtube content than 1080p does.
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That video looks great, even considering the lighting and the fact that it was probably recorded on a cell phone. I could definitely be happy with those results! I did some research on the ML750 and am seriously tempted. However, as far as I can tell the only input options are HDMI and USB/SD Card. Are there any projectors that are roughly equivalent in price and features that allow Component or even Composite inputs? I don't have anything that uses HDMI. 🙁

I did notice that the ML1000P has a Composite input, but it's a bit over the budget that I was hoping for...
 
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