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Tupac Shakur died today

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Corporate Thug said:
Because he was an incredible poet and rapper. His enthusiasm, passion, dedication, motivation, and work ethic is unparalleled, IMO.
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I'm sure a lot of drug dealers have all those qualities too. I don't find his rap any better quality than any other typical thug rap you find today. His lyrics are just as awful.
 
Malak said:
I'm sure a lot of drug dealers have all those qualities too. I don't find his rap any better quality than any other typical thug rap you find today. His lyrics are just as awful.
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Changes, Dear Mama, until the end of time, Brenda got a baby are a few that come to mind that aren't the norm by today's standards.
 
Corporate Thug said:
Changes, Dear Mama, until the end of time, Brenda got a baby are a few that come to mind that aren't the norm by today's standards.
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I'm not going to argue that a song like Changes, on its own, stands. But it's buried under a mountain of thug rap, which makes Tupac less than stellar overall. A complaining thug is still a thug. I prefer someone more like THISL who doesn't believe that things will never change, because he got out.
 
I knew he was a thug, but just googling around turned up this incident. Cliffs: altercation after concert, pac pulls his gat, fumble, interception, 6 yr-old takes one in the head. Too bad Tupac didn't get shot 4 years earlier. That kid might still be alive.
 
Corporate Thug said:
The one that died inspired countless more...and did more for the genre that humanely imaginable.
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rap is no more an art form than a monkey throwing his feces at a canvas. even in the context of "artistic license", "freestyle" or other descriptions of non-conventional art, rap is still rubbish.

at its very best, rap is approximately on the level of richard cheese, al yankovic and other so-called joke music. actually, that's not fair to richard cheese and al yankovic.

"ponce de leon
constantly on
the fountain of youth,
not robotron."

...is about as good as it gets.

i'll make the following broad claims about rap in general and let you, my dear readers, disprove them at your leisure:

topics are almost exclusively either preposterous claims about wealth, power and virility or the tremendous burden of being a black man/violent criminal.

lyric structure is very poorly defined, if at all, even within a single "song". lyrics are almost entirely unintelligible, except for the chorus. frequently, the lyrics take on the sound of an animal barking and grunting. grammar is mangled beyond recognition, and words are made up when it is convenient. things like rhyming and timing are for suckers.

the "music" is simple - beyond child-like, more of an animal level. the over-reliance on bass-heavy thump-thump-thump speaks of the time when bone first hit log, somewhere deep in the jungle. to my knowledge, no rapper has ever played a musical instrument. if the music shows any hint of sophistication, you can be sure it was recorded ages ago and has been "sampled". this reached its zenith with the beastie boys' 1989 album paul's boutique. forget "roll over, beethoven", he's on a rotisserie.
 
The Boston Dangler said:
rap is no more an art form than a monkey throwing his feces at a canvas. even in the context of "artistic license", "freestyle" or other descriptions of non-conventional art, rap is still rubbish.

at its very best, rap is approximately on the level of richard cheese, al yankovic and other so-called joke music. actually, that's not fair to richard cheese and al yankovic.

"ponce de leon
constantly on
the fountain of youth,
not robotron."

...is about as good as it gets.

i'll make the following broad claims about rap in general and let you, my dear readers, disprove them at your leisure:

topics are almost exclusively either preposterous claims about wealth, power and virility or the tremendous burden of being a black man/violent criminal.

lyric structure is very poorly defined, if at all, even within a single "song". lyrics are almost entirely unintelligible, except for the chorus. frequently, the lyrics take on the sound of an animal barking and grunting. grammar is mangled beyond recognition, and words are made up when it is convenient. things like rhyming and timing are for suckers.

the "music" is simple - beyond child-like, more of an animal level. the over-reliance on bass-heavy thump-thump-thump speaks of the time when bone first hit log, somewhere deep in the jungle. to my knowledge, no rapper has ever played a musical instrument. if the music shows any hint of sophistication, you can be sure it was recorded ages ago and has been "sampled". this reached its zenith with the beastie boys' 1989 album paul's boutique. forget "roll over, beethoven", he's on a rotisserie.
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Go to sleep old man. Rap is over 30 years old. In another decade they'll be playing NWA on classic stations.
 
The Boston Dangler said:
care to provide some details? how about some audio/video evidence?
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Nah, I don't really care to waste my time in all honesty. You've made it abundantly clear how much you hate rap. So it would be pointless for me to spend time digging up information to disprove what you said. Which you'd still believe regardless of what links I posted. You made a blanket statement so there's really no need to prove anything to you. Because anyone who would say "all [insert] are [insert]" is a moron. But I'm sure another ATOTer who thinks he can change your mind will post plenty of links that disprove your shit-brained theory though.

Actually I will give you something to chew on, Kid Rock started out rapping and while he doesn't rap as much any more. He was always able to play multiple instruments. I said this so your "there's not a single rapper who can play an instrument" is shot to shit. His 1st album was nothing but rapping FYI. And you yourself mentioned the Beastie Boys, so without me even bringing up Kid Rock you already had contradicted yourself.

Hummm...
 
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Crono said:
Thank you for sharing.
What genre(s) of music do you listen to?
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thanks for asking. a tour thru my cd racks:
predominantly, rock and roll lots of all the following - pre-1990 aerosmith, led zeppelin, the who, pearl jam, black crowes, clapton, hendrix, santana, the police, queen, bob seger, et cetera.

some prog rock, mostly pink floyd

some metal - pre-1990 metallica, tool, 80's ozzy, appetite for destruction (only)

country/folk/bluegrass - lots of grateful dead, kenny rogers, simon & garfunkel, kingston trio

80's and 90's alternative or college radio - the cure, depeche mode, b-52's, old REM, mighty mighty bosstones, tmbg, old rhcp

big band and crooners - glenn miller, sinatra, tony bennett, et cetera

classification unknown - rodrigo y gabriela, dave matthews band, weather report, the beatles, cat stevens

i'm recently getting back into robert johnson, classical, and 80's pop. also, i've always liked female vocalists.
 
The Boston Dangler said:
topics are almost exclusively either preposterous claims about wealth, power and virility or the tremendous burden of being a black man/violent criminal.
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My vast collection of rap does not include anything about being wealthy, powerful, sexual, or racial burdens.

lyric structure is very poorly defined, if at all, even within a single "song". lyrics are almost entirely unintelligible, except for the chorus. frequently, the lyrics take on the sound of an animal barking and grunting. grammar is mangled beyond recognition, and words are made up when it is convenient. things like rhyming and timing are for suckers.
Click to expand...

I can't think of any rappers I listen to that you can't understand. Although a few hook lines actually were difficult because they were slowed down or had some weird affect applied to them, but that is only 2 songs.

the "music" is simple - beyond child-like, more of an animal level. the over-reliance on bass-heavy thump-thump-thump speaks of the time when bone first hit log, somewhere deep in the jungle. to my knowledge, no rapper has ever played a musical instrument. if the music shows any hint of sophistication, you can be sure it was recorded ages ago and has been "sampled". this reached its zenith with the beastie boys' 1989 album paul's boutique. forget "roll over, beethoven", he's on a rotisserie.
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Use of pianos, violins, guitars, etc. is pretty common in rap actually. The qualities of music varies quite a lot between genres, but you can't say one is more sophisticated than another in general. There are just as many crappy musicians in every genre. Unfortunately, rap gets a bad rep because the greater majority of artists you see on TV or hear on the radio are a perfect example of what you don't like. If you want to hear good stuff, you have to dig deeper. Check the charts for artists that don't have parental advisory warnings on their albums.
 
The Boston Dangler said:
:hmm:

i don't like kid rock, but yes he can play an instrument. what instrument does 50 cent play? tupac? ll cool j? snoop doggy? chuck d?
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you said, and I quote to my knowledge, no rapper has ever played a musical instrument. You named a rap GROUP that plays instruments and I named a rapper. Nothing more needs to be said here because your statement was invalidated 4 times. When you say "no rapper..." and 4 have been named I think it's fair to say you were very wrong. And your attempt to save face by naming some other random rappers, I suppose I applaud your tenacity when you know you're clearly wrong. We get it you don't like rap, and you don't even consider it to be music.

With that said we're done here, well you might not be. But I am, there's nothing else for me to say.
 
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