[tt] gtx660

[toyota]

Like it has to be 1.5GB if it's 192bit MC? I'd give NV more credit than that.

Further more 3DCenter is saying GTX 660 is GK-106. But they also report ~240mm2 which imho sounds a bit fishy.

lol, somehow I figured you make a comment like that. with nvidia's architecture there will be 24 rops with a 192 bit bus.

 

[f1sherman]

cuda cores
1536/960 = 1.6

mm2
290/240 = 1.2

lol, somehow I figured you make a comment like that. with nvidia's architecture that there will be 24 rops with a 192 bit bus.

Well I can't argue against FACTS, can I? New chip all together and it has to be 24 ROPs... okie

 

[SlowSpyder]

More like... Lack of it

2 months ago 7870 was $349, and no one called it crap. Not even close.
Now we get same perf. for $249, and it's OMG another NV fail.
(it will proly be few % behind it though, so maybe $229 MSRP?)

Calling the GPU a fail, overpriced, too-little-too-late, etc, and than 2 days later, that same overpriced failed GPU crushes whole AMD pricing scheme...??

Out of touch much?

RussianSensation how long you plan to hold the grudge against NV, for being 6-7 monts late?
Time and again this generation, it was NV who brought value to AMD 28nm colonial pricing.

But it's not like NV or AMD are posting record profits. That would be TSMC. Blame them and the physics.
It's pretty obvious that NV is still heavily 28nm constrained. Only 2 chips so far, focus on GK104 and on mobile, 10% less shipped desktop GPUs in the last quarter pretty much proves it.



7970 level of performance was available from GTX 580 OC 2 years before Tahiti came out. RS seriously... Don't you remember that HD7000 brought NOTHING in price/perf when it launched??
Actually several SKUs launched with worse perf/$ than old arch...remember?

A lot of people said the 7870 was crap at $349 and have for a long time, not sure how you missed that in all honesty. It seems like forever people ignored the 7870 and 7950, just recently have they picked up some popularity with their better pricing. And lots of posters here have complained about the 28nm GPU's being too much money for the performance in general.

My guess is that AMD always planned on selling their cards at the prices you see today (or maybe even less, but it seems neither AMD or Nvidia really want to engage in an all out price war), but they were just taking advantage of a lack of competition to make more while they could.

 

[VirtualLarry]

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-660-oem

 

[toyota]

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-660-oem

why are you linking to that card?

 

[jacktesterson]

why are you linking to that card?

 

[Keysplayr]

PhysX, 3D Vision, TXAA, AO in the drivers. Also, NVidia quality components > AMD quality components since AMD is 2nd tier budget brand. 7 months late doesn't count since NV > AMD. Why buy an HD7850 for $250 and enjoy it for 7 months when it was a budget brand? Why wait another 6-7 months for the much faster HD8000 series now that GTX660 is available? Not waiting for AMD's budget HD8000 series, sorry.



Yes, that's underwhelming. This level of performance was available from an HD7850 OC for 7 months now at $250. Imagine if HD8750/8770 launches 7 months after GTX760, are you serious? If NV wants to make a real difference for gamers, they should drop 660Ti to $249, 670 to $349 and GTX680 to $419. Right now their entire line-up is overpriced.

BTW, 3DCenter already reports 660 as slower than the 7870. Their performance comparisons for all the other cards line-up nicely with TechPowerUP, Computerbase, Xbitlabs, KitGuru, etc. Their chart foreshadows that 660 will lose to a 7870 with MSAA.

Nvidia already made a difference forcing AMD to extreme price cuts and that is no small deal.

 

[3DVagabond]

Now where do I hear that before?

Oh that's right - when 660 Ti launched, people were saying the same thing:
"Meh... but I guess it would be an aight card if the price was $200.

But then AMD prices went tumbling down for the third time in a row,
and everyone was like : "NO-OOOOO! AMD WHAT ARE YOU DOING SWEETIE, IT'S NV WHO NEEDS TO LOWER PRICES "

I mean you guys are following the industry. How can you be that much out of touch?

LOL Who said anything like that? I think everybody was happy to see prices drop. If they drop again, great!

 

[3DVagabond]

While I wouldn't trust TT in any predictions, it will be probably priced the same as the other crap, the AMD one, in it's performance department.

While I'm not a fan of their benchmark suite, or their SPL measuring technique, they have been spot on with their pre-release nVidia reviews.

 

[Silverforce11]

If only TT would bench new games... their entire list is sad-panda.

These guys are in taiwan where most AIBs are, as well as TSMC so they get their hands on samples early.. but they go and ruin their reviews with terrible benches.

So comparing 660 vs 78xx, what do we have? Card that's as fast or faster than 7870 without AA, weaker (going by 3dcenter's chart) with AA, on par with 7850 (without the massive OC potential). I think its going to use more power as well..

Going to be a weird one.

 

[3DVagabond]

More like... Lack of it

2 months ago 7870 was $349, and no one called it crap. Not even close.
Now we get same perf. for $249, and it's OMG another NV fail.
(it will proly be few % behind it though, so maybe $229 MSRP?)

Calling the GPU a fail, overpriced, too-little-too-late, etc, and than 2 days later, that same overpriced failed GPU crushes whole AMD pricing scheme...??

Out of touch much?

RussianSensation how long you plan to hold the grudge against NV, for being 6-7 monts late?
Time and again this generation, it was NV who brought value to AMD 28nm colonial pricing.

But it's not like NV or AMD are posting record profits. That would be TSMC. Blame them and the physics.
It's pretty obvious that NV is still heavily 28nm constrained. Only 2 chips so far, focus on GK104 and on mobile, 10% less shipped desktop GPUs in the last quarter pretty much proves it.



7970 level of performance was available from GTX 580 OC 2 years before Tahiti came out. RS seriously... Don't you remember that HD7000 brought NOTHING in price/perf when it launched??
Actually several SKUs launched with worse perf/$ than old arch...remember?

I'm not sure what you consider special and impressive. You want a mid-range card to perform like a high-end for that money? And again I don't understand why people compare this card to the 7870. I thought the 660Ti was up against that card while delivering performance close to the 7950. This is a card competing with the 7850.

May I remind you that when the 680 was launched it was against the top AMD card, 7970. When the 670 was launched it was up against the 7950 while delivering performance close to the 7970. These two cards made AMD drop prices TO REMAIN COMPETITIVE. Apparently those first price drops were not enough as seen here:

Discrete Q2-2012:
AMD 14,000 units, 42.9% share, -2.1% from Q1, -2.5% from Q2-2011
nvidia 18,600 untis, 57.1% share, +2.1% from Q1, +2.5% from Q2-2011

http://investorvillage.com/smbd.asp?mb=476&mn=244502&pt=msg&mid=12013727

So we have another price drop from AMD and why is that? Because nobody is impressed with what NV is offering? The 600 series brought better performance than the 7000 series. That is why AMD CANNOT SELL a 7970 at 500$, a 7950 at 400$ and a 7870 at 300$. When NV will drop the prices for all their cards then it will be because THE MARKET decides that those cards are no longer worth the initial price.

You guys need to get with the times. It's Sept. quit acting like it's January - March and nVidia is right there offering us all this bang/$. Yields are improving, 28nm is maturing, manufacturing is cheaper. You can't compare prices now with then. For how many months was the 7850 the best perf/$ card? I suppose you expected AMD to drop prices when all nVidia had to offer was last generation cards for the same price, or more?

No competition does this. It's why Intel doesn't have to offer more performance or cheaper prices with a node shrink. They have no competition!

 

[jacktesterson]

You guys need to get with the times. It's august quit acting like it's January - March and nVidia is right there offering us all this bang/$. Yields are improving, 28nm is maturing, manufacturing is cheaper. You can't compare prices now with then. For how many months was the 7850 the best perf/$ card? I suppose you expected AMD to drop prices when all nVidia had to offer was last generation cards for the same price, or more?

No competition does this. It's why Intel doesn't have to offer more performance or cheaper prices with a node shrink. They have no competition!

its august ?

 

[3DVagabond]

its august ?

LOL. Thanks, mate. We're actually a day ahead here too.

 

[toyota]

its been September for at least 2 days no matter where you live...

 

[notty22]

This gpu may have massive o/c potential. That's going to be one of the reveals ,when it gets here. If Nvidia is mentioning comparisons to the 7850, then in a few weeks/month it will probably sell for similar prices. Game bundle/rebate dependent.

 

[3DVagabond]

its been September for at least 2 days no matter where you live...

Really? Where has it been Sept. for only 2 days?

My point is it's even worse for me to make the mistake because it's been Sept. longer here.

 

[Keysplayr]

n/m

 

[SirPauly]

Nvidia already made a difference forcing AMD to extreme price cuts and that is no small deal.

Those nVidia tricksters!

 

[AnandThenMan]

Those nVidia tricksters!

You're going to troll with this comment for the next year, I just know it.

 

[Rezist]

Nvidia needs somrthing to compete against the 7850 imo still is and always was the most compelling 28nm card.

 

[SirPauly]

My point is it's even worse for me to make the mistake because it's been Sept. longer here.

 

[toyota]

Really? Where has it been Sept. for only 2 days?

My point is it's even worse for me to make the mistake because it's been Sept. longer here.

lol, how does "at least" translate to "only" for you?

 

[Phynaz]

7970 level of performance was available from GTX 580 OC 2 years before Tahiti came out. RS seriously... Don't you remember that HD7000 brought NOTHING in price/perf when it launched??
Actually several SKUs launched with worse perf/$ than old arch...remember?

Really? Where?
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/517?vs=508

Oh, I suppose the GTX 580 consumed more power, so I guess if higher numbers are better, then that's a win for the 580.

See where I posted above where I said "however you choose to measure performance"? Performance is more than just FPS.

 

[3DVagabond]

lol, how does "at least" translate to "only" for you?

Because it's been Sept. for at least 3 days everywhere.

 

[RussianSensation]

More like... Lack of it

2 months ago 7870 was $349, and no one called it crap. Not even close.

Ya, we did actually, from day 1. Most of us here recommended HD7850 OC over 7870. Only with recent price drops did the 7870 become attractive, but 7850 OC ~ 660ti for $250 for 7 months now......

Now we get same perf. for $249, and it's OMG another NV fail.

Ya, it's a fail because NV launched 660Ti in August 16th and 660 September 12th (?), meaning there was no 28nm Kepler cards from them for 8 months this year! Milking the consumer with outdated 40nm parts for 3 quarters is a fail in my books. Can't put the blame on AMD here since NV chose to ignore desktop customers in favour of notebook consumers.

Calling the GPU a fail, overpriced, too-little-too-late, etc, and than 2 days later, that same overpriced failed GPU crushes whole AMD pricing scheme...??

What scheme? AMD had no competition. NV had to slot below AMD's parts to even make sense. Otherwise, it would have been embrassing to launch this late and not even offer better price/performance. However, AMD responded already, which meant NV's cards are still overpriced.

RussianSensation how long you plan to hold the grudge against NV, for being 6-7 monts late? Time and again this generation, it was NV who brought value to AMD 28nm colonial pricing.

I don't hold a grudge against NV. I criticize AMD or NV whenever either of them is late and brings little change to price/performance or cannot maintain it for long. It's one thing to launch a card at good price but then if days later your competitor simply readjusts prices to make your new card look outdated already, if you don't do anything about it, then you have an overpriced product. Showing up to the fight isn't enough. At this point, I might as well tell people to wait 6-7 more months for HD8000 series, right?

7970 level of performance was available from GTX 580 OC 2 years before Tahiti came out. RS seriously... Don't you remember that HD7000 brought NOTHING in price/perf when it launched??
Actually several SKUs launched with worse perf/$ than old arch...remember?

Yes, and I criticized 7950/7970 launch prices. That's somewhat irrelevant now since with time those prices have dropped, while NV didn't drop prices at all on 670/680 series since then. MSI TF3 7950 for $500 was overpriced, for $275, it makes GTX660Ti/670 overpriced. I am having a hard time understanding why a $250 660 is a good deal, especially since 660Ti often is only as fast as an HD7870 is with MSAA.