Trump wants to air mass executions on TV.

[eikelbijter]

I have asked you repeatedly to provide even a single shred of evidence for this position and you haven’t.

I provided evidence for my position and honestly the data is obvious. Now it’s your turn. When can we expect it?

I live in the MIDDLE of it! I don't know what you do for a living, but it seems to me you're not very connected to big city life in this country.

Again, I've talked with people who do homeless outreach and services; I've talked to cops, neighbors. I walk miles every day among them. I try to read information, studies, articles from ALL sources. I've seen the families with kids disappear by and large of the street, because they did get housed. You can dismiss empirical evidence all you want, and that's a very Ivory Tower kind of mentality that so many scientists suffer from, but that doesn't mean it's false.

 

[fskimospy]

I live in the MIDDLE of it! I don't know what you do for a living, but it seems to me you're not very connected to big city life in this country.

I live in a larger and far denser city than you do, lol.

As for what I do for a living among other things I do statistical analysis, double lol.

Maybe you should consider the idea that you’re out of your depth here

Again, I've talked with people who do homeless outreach and services; I've talked to cops, neighbors. I walk miles every day among them. I try to read information, studies, articles from ALL sources. I've seen the families with kids disappear by and large of the street, because they did get housed. You can dismiss empirical evidence all you want, and that's a very Ivory Tower kind of mentality that so many scientists suffer from, but that doesn't mean it's false.

You are describing anecdotal evidence, not empirical evidence. Empirical evidence is what I provided, and you dismissed.

Anyway, thank you for confirming that you have zero evidence and don’t plan on providing any.

 

[eikelbijter]

I live in a larger and far denser city than you do, lol.

As for what I do for a living among other things I do statistical analysis, double lol.

Maybe you should consider the idea that you’re out of your depth here


You are describing anecdotal evidence, not empirical evidence. Empirical evidence is what I provided, and you dismissed.

Anyway, thank you for confirming that you have zero evidence and don’t plan on providing any.

Well, there's only one larger than LA, so NYC it is. Of course it's not a place where many would choose to go if they were intentionally checking out from society; those winters are no joke without heat.

Just for shits and giggles I went back and looked up some of your posts in another thread response to me, and I don't want to change the subject and I won't, but BOY were you SO wrong and STILL calling me names! Your arrogance is something else.

Let's just leave it at that, and hopefully we can all agree that we need FEWER people on the street and more people participating in society.

 

[Vic]

I live in the MIDDLE of it! I don't know what you do for a living, but it seems to me you're not very connected to big city life in this country.

Again, I've talked with people who do homeless outreach and services; I've talked to cops, neighbors. I walk miles every day among them. I try to read information, studies, articles from ALL sources. I've seen the families with kids disappear by and large of the street, because they did get housed. You can dismiss empirical evidence all you want, and that's a very Ivory Tower kind of mentality that so many scientists suffer from, but that doesn't mean it's false.

Just FYI, I live in Portland, the homeless capital of America.

 

[Amused]

Why in the ever loving fuck has my thread been derailed???

 

[eikelbijter]

Just FYI, I live in Portland, the homeless capital of America.

So what are your views on this? Have you seen a change in the type of person that's living on the street? Has property crime gone up?

Portland is one of the few cities we don't often visit on tour, although I have been there a couple of times.

 

[Vic]

And back on topic, the reason why right-wingers believe the solution to crime and homelessness is just to get medieval on it is because they view criminals and the homeless as classes of people without Constitution rights or the protection of the law, and not a description of people who commit crimes or are homeless.

The best analogy I have for this was a real life conversation I had with a consetvatively-mind acquantince back in 2016 when Oregon was in the process of legalizing recreational MJ. They were of course very much opposed. I asked them why, and their answer was that their son had experimented with MJ and it had made them lazy. Ok, I said, and did you make sure he went to jail for it? Of course not! Why not? That's what you want done to everyone else.
Omg you never saw pearls clutched so tightly.

Laws for thee and not for me is the very essence of conservatism. It's literally what defines them. So when Trump talks about executing criminals and his supporters cheer, it's not actual criminals and drug users they intend to have executed. God knows their hearts bleed profusely for their own who are opiate addicts. Oh no! Their agenda is to find a means to use the govt to murder the people they don't like.

 

[Amused]

And back on topic, the reason why right-wingers believe the solution to crime and homelessness is just to get medieval on it is because they view criminals and the homeless as classes of people without Constitution rights or the protection of the law, and not a description of people who commit crimes or are homeless.

The best analogy I have for this was a real life conversation I had with a consetvatively-mind acquantince back in 2016 when Oregon was in the process of legalizing recreational MJ. They were of course very much opposed. I asked them why, and their answer was that their son had experimented with MJ and it had made them lazy. Ok, I said, and did you make sure he went to jail for it? Of course not! Why not? That's what you want done to everyone else.
Omg you never saw pearls clutched so tightly.

Laws for thee and not for me is the very essence of conservatism. It's literally what defines them. So when Trump talks about executing criminals and his supporters cheer, it's not actual criminals and drug users they intend to have executed. God knows their hearts bleed profusely for their own who are opiate addicts. Oh no! Their agenda is to find a means to use the govt to murder the people they don't like.

This is the only logical end result of dehumanizing/demonizing propaganda that leads GQPers to view "others" (people of color, LGTBQ, atheists, immigrants, 'libtards,' Democrats and 'RINOs') as less than human or literally demonized.

Look at all the GQPers calling for anyone who is not in their Qult to be "gitmoed." Look at all of them saying the "millitary is the only way" and calling for "tribunals."

They have gone full fucking Nazi.

 

[Jaskalas]

They have gone full fucking Nazi.

And to think, we had the warning signs in 2016.
This is ultimately what "fake news" becomes. An alt reality that necessitates the use of force because whackados decided elections are fake.
Needless to say, my estimation for humanity dropped like a rock in the aftermath of 2020. Hasn't risen since. The more I see, the more horrific human behavior becomes.
Sanity? A fleeting pursuit I am afraid.

I'll be pleasantly surprised anytime I meet someone who does NOT want to murder others for being different.

 

[fskimospy]

Well, there's only one larger than LA, so NYC it is. Of course it's not a place where many would choose to go if they were intentionally checking out from society; those winters are no joke without heat.

I like how you initially try to dismiss my opinion based on the idea that I don’t understand big cities and when it turns out I live in a much bigger and denser city than you, you invent a new reason.

Funny how experience in big cities matters until it works against you. This is a sign of a person who is more interested in winning an argument than learning something.

Just for shits and giggles I went back and looked up some of your posts in another thread response to me, and I don't want to change the subject and I won't, but BOY were you SO wrong and STILL calling me names! Your arrogance is something else.

Let's just leave it at that, and hopefully we can all agree that we need FEWER people on the street and more people participating in society.

I suspect this is as close as you’re going to get to admitting you’re wrong so ok.

 

[Vic]

So what are your views on this? Have you seen a change in the type of person that's living on the street? Has property crime gone up?

Portland is one of the few cities we don't often visit on tour, although I have been there a couple of times.

I'm 100% with fskimospy on this. We need to relax zoning regulations and build more and denser housing. And not this "affordable housing" BS which is just affluent liberal codespeak for a tiered system that protects their appreciating home values while relieving their consciences of the homeless problem caused by their greed, but housing for everyone and lots of it.
Doing this will both reduce housing costs by increasing supply while also creating countless jobs.

 

[Pohemi]

You're doing EXACTLY what you're accusing me of doing. I didn't call the homeless "parasites", and I certainly would never consider myself the only knowledgeable one.

Really? Such a short memory, apparently...

... It's a parisitic species if you will; they are living of whatever they can beg for or steal...

Okay, then.

I live in the MIDDLE of it! I don't know what you do for a living, but it seems to me you're not very connected to big city life in this country.

'I am the only knowledgeable one on this topic because you don't live in my house.'

So you didn't call them parasites, and you don't act like you're the only one who can talk on the subject? Could have fooled me, the way you're posting.

You can dismiss empirical evidence all you want, and that's a very Ivory Tower kind of mentality that so many scientists suffer from, but that doesn't mean it's false.

Empirical evidence? LOL.
So you're at the 'making up my own definitions for words' stage. Welcome to pcgeek's world.

Portland is one of the few cities we don't often visit on tour, although I have been there a couple of times.

A bit of off-topic shit-talking now...how are you a musician, and Portland is, "one of the few cities [you] don't visit often"? Portland and Seattle are the music hubs of the PNW.

 

[eikelbijter]

Really? Such a short memory, apparently...

Okay, then.

'I am the only knowledgeable one on this topic because you don't live in my house.'

So you didn't call them parasites, and you don't act like you're the only one who can talk on the subject? Could have fooled me, the way you're posting.

Empirical evidence? LOL.
So you're at the 'making up my own definitions for words' stage. Welcome to pcgeek's world.

A bit of off-topic shit-talking now...how are you a musician, and Portland is, "one of the few cities [you] don't visit often"? Portland and Seattle are the music hubs of the PNW.

Ok, gotta admit that I did call them a parasitic species, although I stand by that characterization. Keep in mind though, that I don't mean that in a derogatory way, which is why I used the species term; I have nothing against any species in particular.

Now for the rest of your idiotic reply: what exactly do you think "empirical evidence" is? Wouldn't you agree a good definition is: " Empirical evidence is any information you can collect through the processes of observation or investigation." Are you suggesting just because I'm not wearing a lab coat, I can't observe? I can't investigate?

Finally, just so you know, I've been a professional musician my entire life, have toured the world, nominated for a Grammy, played on multiple top ten charting songs, in multiple genres. I've played everywhere, from people's back yards to the Hollywood Bowl. The simple (most likely very caucasian) world you seem to live in where Portland and Seattle are essential in determining whether someone is a real musician, is quite sad. As a matter of fact, I've played Seattle every year (except 2020 of course) for at least 4 nights, sometimes as many as 10 per year. Your insult is as ridiculous as they get.

 

[eikelbijter]

I'm 100% with fskimospy on this. We need to relax zoning regulations and build more and denser housing. And not this "affordable housing" BS which is just affluent liberal codespeak for a tiered system that protects their appreciating home values while relieving their consciences of the homeless problem caused by their greed, but housing for everyone and lots of it.
Doing this will both reduce housing costs by increasing supply while also creating countless jobs.

OK, but isn't it true that unemployment is at a 60 year low?

 

[Pohemi]

Ok, gotta admit that I did call them a parasitic species, although I stand by that characterization. Keep in mind though, that I don't mean that in a derogatory way, which is why I used the species term; I have nothing against any species in particular.

Now for the rest of your idiotic reply: what exactly do you think "empirical evidence" is? Wouldn't you agree a good definition is: " Empirical evidence is any information you can collect through the processes of observation or investigation." Are you suggesting just because I'm not wearing a lab coat, I can't observe? I can't investigate?

Finally, just so you know, I've been a professional musician my entire life, have toured the world, nominated for a Grammy, played on multiple top ten charting songs, in multiple genres. I've played everywhere, from people's back yards to the Hollywood Bowl. The simple (most likely very caucasian) world you seem to live in where Portland and Seattle are essential in determining whether someone is a real musician, is quite sad. As a matter of fact, I've played Seattle every year (except 2020 of course) for at least 4 nights, sometimes as many as 10 per year. Your insult is as ridiculous as they get.

Empirical evidence is not your subjective, opinionated anecdotal evidence, any more than my anecdotal evidence is. Except I acknowledge that fact, and you try to use a term that doesn't meet the definition of your attempted usage. It's dishonest. Shocker.

Nothing but more mischaracterization of what I said, but keep on keeping on, I guess. Dickbiter added to the list.

 

[Vic]

OK, but isn't it true that unemployment is at a 60 year low?

Unemployment numbers don't include persons not in the workforce such as (for example) the homeless.

 

[eikelbijter]

Unemployment numbers don't include persons not in the workforce such as (for example) the homeless.

I understand, but I don't know how it is in Portland, but around here many businesses are desperately looking for workers they can't find. The news says the same all the time, and even though I always take it with the appropriate grain of salt, there doesn't seem to be a shortage of jobs, even well paying ones.

Don't you see a change in some part of the homeless population where there is a certain percentage that just seem to not WANT to participate in society anymore?

 

[Fenixgoon]

I understand, but I don't know how it is in Portland, but around here many businesses are desperately looking for workers they can't find. The news says the same all the time, and even though I always take it with the appropriate grain of salt, there doesn't seem to be a shortage of jobs, even well paying ones.

Don't you see a change in some part of the homeless population where there is a certain percentage that just seem to not WANT to participate in society anymore?

to get a job you need a permanent mailing address.
to get a permanent mailing address you need a job.

that's just a little bit of a catch22 for someone coming out of a homeless situation.

also, if employers can't find employees, they need to increase their compensation until they can. it's called supply and demand.

 

[blackangst1]

Ok, gotta admit that I did call them a parasitic species, although I stand by that characterization. Keep in mind though, that I don't mean that in a derogatory way, which is why I used the species term; I have nothing against any species in particular.

Now for the rest of your idiotic reply: what exactly do you think "empirical evidence" is? Wouldn't you agree a good definition is: " Empirical evidence is any information you can collect through the processes of observation or investigation." Are you suggesting just because I'm not wearing a lab coat, I can't observe? I can't investigate?

Finally, just so you know, I've been a professional musician my entire life, have toured the world, nominated for a Grammy, played on multiple top ten charting songs, in multiple genres. I've played everywhere, from people's back yards to the Hollywood Bowl. The simple (most likely very caucasian) world you seem to live in where Portland and Seattle are essential in determining whether someone is a real musician, is quite sad. As a matter of fact, I've played Seattle every year (except 2020 of course) for at least 4 nights, sometimes as many as 10 per year. Your insult is as ridiculous as they get.

Yeah but you dont live in NYC

/ducks

 

[dawp]

deterrence is always quoted as one of the reasons for the death penalty but it never quite works that way.

 

[Pohemi]

deterrence is always quoted as one of the reasons for the death penalty but it never quite works that way.

How about population control? Cleaning the gene pool? /s

 

[Perknose]

Many could be helped with the right combination of social services and counseling - but most do not want to partake. At the time, it did seem like an intractable problem, I don't know if anything has really changed. Well, eliminating the requirement that all shelters be 'dry' helps a bit in the short term.

There is a solution which has been shown to work.

People stabilize faster and better when they have their own shelter. "Getting them housed first, and worrying about all the rest later" has, again, been shown to have a strongly positive effect.

 

[Pohemi]

There is a solution which has been shown to work.

People stabilize faster and better when they have their own shelter. "Getting them housed first, and worrying about all the rest later" has, again, been shown to have a strongly positive effect.

Yes, but don't you realize?
Whatever eikelbijter claims to witness outside his window is stronger "empirical" evidence than your silly studies. These parasites don't want housing!

/s

 

[eikelbijter]

There is a solution which has been shown to work.

People stabilize faster and better when they have their own shelter. "Getting them housed first, and worrying about all the rest later" has, again, been shown to have a strongly positive effect.

Of course! And again, a fair number of the homeless around here who wanted to get off the street have been housed, or are in the process.

But that solution simply doesn't work for those who don't want to play the game anymore. I can't believe you guys can't understand that. Y'all keep wanting to put one nice answer to the whole thing but it doesn't work that way, it never does.

 

[eikelbijter]

How about population control? Cleaning the gene pool? /s

Unfortunately that is what a good part of the population here in LA is ready to effect. They are the ones that simplify the problem the OTHER way, insinuating that ALL homeless are worthless, useless criminals. All I'm saying is, there is a PART of the unhoused that don't want to participate, and choose to live a parasitic lifestyle, and a part that's, at least around here, but from what I've experienced also in other cities, growing.