Trump vs Maduro

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amenx

Diamond Member
Dec 17, 2004
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Trump says he is going after the drug cartels and that Maduro is a major facilitator for them. The US has moved 3 destroyers near Venezuelan waters and recently doubled the reward for his capture to $50 million. Seems they want him pretty bad. Could Trump be wanting to pull off another Noriega type mission?

US deploys warships near Venezuela to combat drug threats

Venezuela mobilizes its militia after US says it’s deploying military forces to waters around Latin America


Screenshot 2025-08-20 220442.png
 
ivwshane

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
33,407
16,797
136
Jaskalas said:
Only a matter of time until modern tech reaches the people we piss off, and drones become a force equalizer. Our fleets are still pretending they are immune to consequences. Big mistake.
Click to expand...
Yeah but our billion dollar jets can easily handle drones!




/s
 
F

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,759
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Jaskalas said:
Only a matter of time until modern tech reaches the people we piss off, and drones become a force equalizer. Our fleets are still pretending they are immune to consequences. Big mistake.
Click to expand...
I remember you said this earlier and it seemed to be based on a pretty basic lack of knowledge as to how fleet defense works. Again, the reason why phalanx isn’t a good solution in Ukraine is it’s too short range. It could easily shred huge numbers of drones so long as it’s configured for that threat profile. That is unless there’s some new drone that can handle 75 high explosive rounds a second from a fully automated targeting system.

Maybe someday they are able to make super long range drones that can operate en masse in the air and in such quantities that CIWS cannot destroy enough or submersible drones that can operate independently for hundreds of miles either in mass or without detection but I’ve seen little evidence of that so far.
 
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Jaskalas

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
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@fskimospy I do indeed remember previous posts on the subject.
However, I also remember the United States being forced to flee the Red Sea by Yemen.

Our Navy has already lost a contest against Drones. Because it does not matter if you can intercept dozens or hundreds of them. Hundreds, thousands more will follow.
At some point you miss one, or run out of ammo, or expend the service life of your phalanx. If nothing else, supply lines and maintenance will catch up to us when faced with a sustained engagement.

Having to flee YEMEN of all countries, suggests our policy is... behind the curve of modern warfare. I posit that parking our fleet in hostile waters is no longer as safe as it used to be.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,759
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Jaskalas said:
@fskimospy I do indeed remember previous posts on the subject.
However, I also remember the United States being forced to flee the Red Sea by Yemen.

Our Navy has already lost a contest against Drones. Because it does not matter if you can intercept dozens or hundreds of them. Hundreds, thousands more will follow.
At some point you miss one, or run out of ammo, or expend the service life of your phalanx. If nothing else, supply lines and maintenance will catch up to us when faced with a sustained engagement.

Having to flee YEMEN of all countries, suggests our policy is... behind the curve of modern warfare. I posit that parking our fleet in hostile waters is no longer as safe as it used to be.
Click to expand...
We did not flee Yemen because of drones, Yemen was firing anti-ship missiles at us and not a single one hit its target. That missile technology has been widely available for a long time.

So no, this is just misinformation.
 
Jaskalas

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
35,541
9,761
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fskimospy said:
We did not flee Yemen because of drones, Yemen was firing anti-ship missiles at us and not a single one hit its target. That missile technology has been widely available for a long time.

So no, this is just misinformation.
Click to expand...
Yemen was using missiles AND drones both.

If you want to attribute our retreat due to missiles, then sure. Does not change that both are an active threat to our navy. That we had to flee from Yemen, and I suspect Venezuela has something similar to offer. My message is that it is a stupid risk to our Navy to deploy it in this fashion.
 
B

brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
29,618
30,144
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Jaskalas said:
Yemen was using missiles AND drones both.

If you want to attribute our retreat due to missiles, then sure. Does not change that both are an active threat to our navy. That we had to flee from Yemen, and I suspect Venezuela has something similar to offer. My message is that it is a stupid risk to our Navy to deploy it in this fashion.
Click to expand...
Yes the waters around Venezuela are well known as a choke point…..
 
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ivwshane

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
33,407
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fskimospy said:
I remember you said this earlier and it seemed to be based on a pretty basic lack of knowledge as to how fleet defense works. Again, the reason why phalanx isn’t a good solution in Ukraine is it’s too short range. It could easily shred huge numbers of drones so long as it’s configured for that threat profile. That is unless there’s some new drone that can handle 75 high explosive rounds a second from a fully automated targeting system.

Maybe someday they are able to make super long range drones that can operate en masse in the air and in such quantities that CIWS cannot destroy enough or submersible drones that can operate independently for hundreds of miles either in mass or without detection but I’ve seen little evidence of that so far.
Click to expand...

I don’t think you are being creative enough. Imagine the chaos and the ease of causing death and destruction in an urban setting from one drone with an ied attached to it. Honestly I’m surprised this type of attack hasn’t already been happening.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,759
54,781
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Jaskalas said:
Yemen was using missiles AND drones both.

If you want to attribute our retreat due to missiles, then sure. Does not change that both are an active threat to our navy. That we had to flee from Yemen, and I suspect Venezuela has something similar to offer. My message is that it is a stupid risk to our Navy to deploy it in this fashion.
Click to expand...
Missiles are always an active threat to our navy and always have been. It doesn’t change the fact that we didn’t actually need to flee and their attacks had a success rate of 0%.

A 0% success rate does not strike me as a dire threat.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,759
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ivwshane said:
I don’t think you are being creative enough. Imagine the chaos and the ease of causing death and destruction in an urban setting from one drone with an ied attached to it. Honestly I’m surprised this type of attack hasn’t already been happening.
Click to expand...
What does that have to do with our navy?
 
ivwshane

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
33,407
16,797
136
fskimospy said:
What does that have to do with our navy?
Click to expand...

Why do you think his original comment only applied to attacks on our military?

**Nevermind, I see why you would think that. I think worrying about the consequences to our navy is missing the bigger picture though.
 
cytg111

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
25,856
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ivwshane said:
I don’t think you are being creative enough. Imagine the chaos and the ease of causing death and destruction in an urban setting from one drone with an ied attached to it. Honestly I’m surprised this type of attack hasn’t already been happening.
Click to expand...
Yep, it doesnt even have to be much, just weekly random drops... The terror would be massive.
 
GodisanAtheist

GodisanAtheist

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2006
8,194
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fskimospy said:
Missiles are always an active threat to our navy and always have been. It doesn’t change the fact that we didn’t actually need to flee and their attacks had a success rate of 0%.

A 0% success rate does not strike me as a dire threat.
Click to expand...

-Didn't 3x F-18 super hornets end up at the bottom of the red sea because of evasive manuvers as a result of these attacks?

You're right, but war is changing rapidly and while we were all worried about nuclear proliferation something else happened while we weren't looking that is going to make future engagements messy.

Not Venezuela though and fuck Maduro, don't need to be pro-maduro just cause I think Trump is a clown.
 
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