Sapphire makes an X1600 pro for AGP now! Pretty competative price for around $130. Currently I have a 9800 PRO with R360 core flashed to a 9800 XT. Thinking of buying the x1600 Pro, but try as I might, I can't find too many benchmarks with the x1600PRO. Also heard some moaning about the X1600 pro's "fake" pixel shaders. Anyone with some experience or insight? Thanks!
Trade in 9800 PRO/XT for X1600pro? (AGP)
- Thread starter Scrooge2
- Start date
It's very hard to find X1600Pro benchmarks when you need em. All the major review sites get the XT to review instead.
But as memory serves, it's pretty comprable to a 6600GT in new pixel shader heavy games, and loses a bit in older games. Overall it'll fit between your 9800XT and a 6600GT performance wise, closer to the 6600GT.
Whether a 5-10% increase in frame rates (1, 2fps most of the time) is worth $130 is entirely up to you. The Pro, which is the only availabe AGP model won't have the GPU oomph or memory bandwidth to do much in the way of FSAA or higher res than you play on your 9800.
Oh, and the pixel shaders are 'real', it's the 12 pipes that are 'fake.' The X1600 only has 4 texture processors, which makes it effectively the world's fastest 4 pipe card. The Pro is also hamstrung by only having 12Gb/sec or so memory bandwidth.
But as memory serves, it's pretty comprable to a 6600GT in new pixel shader heavy games, and loses a bit in older games. Overall it'll fit between your 9800XT and a 6600GT performance wise, closer to the 6600GT.
Whether a 5-10% increase in frame rates (1, 2fps most of the time) is worth $130 is entirely up to you. The Pro, which is the only availabe AGP model won't have the GPU oomph or memory bandwidth to do much in the way of FSAA or higher res than you play on your 9800.
Oh, and the pixel shaders are 'real', it's the 12 pipes that are 'fake.' The X1600 only has 4 texture processors, which makes it effectively the world's fastest 4 pipe card. The Pro is also hamstrung by only having 12Gb/sec or so memory bandwidth.
A friend of mine online, plays DoD:s with a X1600pro 512mb at 12x10. That's why I picked it up. Should be here within a couple hours 
So am right in saying i'm comparing 8 pipes to 4 pipes? Someone explain this fake pipe thing to me please!
Originally posted by: PC Surgeon
A friend of mine online, plays DoD:s with a X1600pro 512mb at 12x10. That's why I picked it up. Should be here within a couple hours
wow you spent all that time asking about cards....checkin specs...and you got a x1600pro...wut a waste
A waste? That would be personal perspective not absolute truth. I have it up and running now. No problem running this card. It does everything I have asked it to do thus far. A few hours of gaming and even put up some FPS scores in another thread regarding this card. A waste? HELL NO!
Nothing wrong with learning about Graphics cards. Thats what I was doing, educating myself. I dont see the harm in that. I like to talk about video cards because thats what interests me, not because I want a particular one. I'm happy with my choice.
Nothing wrong with learning about Graphics cards. Thats what I was doing, educating myself. I dont see the harm in that. I like to talk about video cards because thats what interests me, not because I want a particular one. I'm happy with my choice.
For 30-40 dollars more you could have bought a used 6800GT or 6800GS that would mop the floor with a x1600pro
Bad decision ay? Months of research yeilds me 'only' this performance ay? May I remind you, that I am the only one out of the two of you that ACTUALLY OWNS the card in question? And as stated before, opinion is subject to the person's perspective. I am completly satisfied with it. You on the other hand may not. But no need to try to downgrade MY DECISION and say "This is what you get with months of research". That sir was uncalled for. Shows no respect to my intelligence. So let's try to express a little respect for each other and build up this forum, not downgrade it with comments as above.
For my months of research, I learned alot of things, and I weighed the importance of features for the money. To me higher resolution was more important than AA or AF. But come to find out, this card actually plays DoD:s at playable framerates with 2xAA and 16xAF. That was unexpected but welcomed.
To the OP, take your time in deciding they arent going anywhere. Find out what you most like in gaming and head towards that. Good luck
For my months of research, I learned alot of things, and I weighed the importance of features for the money. To me higher resolution was more important than AA or AF. But come to find out, this card actually plays DoD:s at playable framerates with 2xAA and 16xAF. That was unexpected but welcomed.
To the OP, take your time in deciding they arent going anywhere. Find out what you most like in gaming and head towards that. Good luck
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=31&threadid=1793554&enterthread=y
Pretty much sums it up there, the x1600pro should be on par with the 6600GT, which was also on par with the 9800 pro. You will be getting a SMALL upgrade if you get the x1600pro, making it a incredibly bad decision.
Save up and get a PCI-e card or at least pay the extra $20-40 to get a 6800GT or GS
Pretty much sums it up there, the x1600pro should be on par with the 6600GT, which was also on par with the 9800 pro. You will be getting a SMALL upgrade if you get the x1600pro, making it a incredibly bad decision.
Save up and get a PCI-e card or at least pay the extra $20-40 to get a 6800GT or GS
Originally posted by: PC Surgeon
Bad decision ay? Months of research yeilds me 'only' this performance ay? May I remind you, that I am the only one out of the two of you that ACTUALLY OWNS the card in question? And as stated before, opinion is subject to the person's perspective. I am completly satisfied with it. You on the other hand may not. But no need to try to downgrade MY DECISION and say "This is what you get with months of research". That sir was uncalled for. Shows no respect to my intelligence. So let's try to express a little respect for each other and build up this forum, not downgrade it with comments as above.
For my months of research, I learned alot of things, and I weighed the importance of features for the money. To me higher resolution was more important than AA or AF. But come to find out, this card actually plays DoD:s at playable framerates with 2xAA and 16xAF. That was unexpected but welcomed.
To the OP, take your time in deciding they arent going anywhere. Find out what you most like in gaming and head towards that. Good luck
yer right....u r the only one of us 3 w/ the card....wonder why........
NOT WORTH IT
Originally posted by: BlacKJesuS
Originally posted by: PC Surgeon
Bad decision ay? Months of research yeilds me 'only' this performance ay? May I remind you, that I am the only one out of the two of you that ACTUALLY OWNS the card in question? And as stated before, opinion is subject to the person's perspective. I am completly satisfied with it. You on the other hand may not. But no need to try to downgrade MY DECISION and say "This is what you get with months of research". That sir was uncalled for. Shows no respect to my intelligence. So let's try to express a little respect for each other and build up this forum, not downgrade it with comments as above.
For my months of research, I learned alot of things, and I weighed the importance of features for the money. To me higher resolution was more important than AA or AF. But come to find out, this card actually plays DoD:s at playable framerates with 2xAA and 16xAF. That was unexpected but welcomed.
To the OP, take your time in deciding they arent going anywhere. Find out what you most like in gaming and head towards that. Good luck
yer right....u r the only one of us 3 w/ the card....wonder why........
NOT WORTH IT
Not to you, no. You have again proven my point. Subjective to the person's own perspective on what 'good' is. You say it sucks, well it does ....TO YOU. I say it is great for the money...and yes you guessed it...TO ME!
So now I am less than you because I own a card that you wouldn't have? Hmmm...you must not like a lot of people's choices now do you? Can we now move on to more productive conversation?
RussianSensation
Elite Member
- Sep 5, 2003
- 19,458
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Your best bet is to find a used 6800GT, X800Pro, X800XL, X800XT, X850XT, X850Pro, X850XT PE or 6800Ultra on ebay or in FS section. Currently, you wont find anything worthwhile to upgrade to from 9800XT in AGP for less than $200. The problem is $200 can buy you a motherboard and A64 3200+. So it might be worthwhile to simply ditch AGP altogether and upgrade now since it'll save you $ in the long run.
apoppin
Lifer
i can't vote in your poll as you have NO good alternatives.
the 1600p is NOT a performance upgrade from a 9800xt [despite what PCSurgeon tells you] . . .
i'd WAIT or get an x850xt [i did cause my 9800xt died], a 6800GS or 7800GS
the 1600p is NOT a performance upgrade from a 9800xt [despite what PCSurgeon tells you] . . .
i'd WAIT or get an x850xt [i did cause my 9800xt died], a 6800GS or 7800GS
Did I say it was a performance upgrade? Never did I once say that in this thread! Please read more carefully. These are my opinions (I think i have aluded to this about 3 times now) and what I can do with it.The meaning of the word 'good' is subjective to the person's own perspective on what 'good' is. Can we try to understand this concept please?
For OP, The cards that RussianSensation listed are one's you will experience the most performance jump from. But you must make the decision in the end. Again good luck
Actually, I'd say to try to find a nice, cheap 6800XT, as I believe you can unlock 8 extra pipes in 'em (For a grand total of 16 pipes), for 'bout the same as that X1600PRO. Then just OC the crap out of it, and you've got something far superior to the aforementioned X1600PRO.
At least, I think that'd be the best idea, but like others have said: DO YOUR RESEARCH.
At least, I think that'd be the best idea, but like others have said: DO YOUR RESEARCH.
The raw numbers favor the X1600 heavily, actually.
http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=32&card2=369
But what the hey, I don't play the fast stuff, and have been getting along with a 9700 Pro on one PC, an FX 5900 on another, and slower yet on the two others! I'll have a 9800XT soon, but only because of Oblivion . .
When comparing cards it's best to go stock for stock - not everyone is interested in or prepared to OC or unlock pipes, etc. Myself included. I just want my hardware to work and do what I need... no interest in tweaking these days.
That said, I too would have a hard time recommending an X1600Pro to anyone when a 6600GT is superior. I also have a hard time recommending someone buy a used card, unless they either know where it's coming from or can test it before buying. Most used stuff is coming off eBay these days and 1) I find that pricing isn't that far off retail and 2) testing isn't 100% (I value my time and don't want to bother messing with faulty cards that weren't tested properly/thoroughly... if at all).
Anyway, i'm happy with the X1600XT (PCI-Express) card in my machine right now. As I mentioned in other threads, it's priced between a 6600GT and 6800GS and that's how it performs. A solid buy IMO. In the US tho... 6800GS is the better buy given the pricing.
That said, I too would have a hard time recommending an X1600Pro to anyone when a 6600GT is superior. I also have a hard time recommending someone buy a used card, unless they either know where it's coming from or can test it before buying. Most used stuff is coming off eBay these days and 1) I find that pricing isn't that far off retail and 2) testing isn't 100% (I value my time and don't want to bother messing with faulty cards that weren't tested properly/thoroughly... if at all).
Anyway, i'm happy with the X1600XT (PCI-Express) card in my machine right now. As I mentioned in other threads, it's priced between a 6600GT and 6800GS and that's how it performs. A solid buy IMO. In the US tho... 6800GS is the better buy given the pricing.
BTW...to discredit pcsurgeon even further....he went from a 9200 to a x1600...so of course it was a big leap..9200 sucked b4 they came out
Yep it was a big leap for me
But are we running for president? Are we here to 'discredit' people or are we here to share experiences and advice? I would hope the latter would be true.
- Mar 20, 2000
- 102,396
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Originally posted by: Kiwi
The raw numbers favor the X1600 heavily, actually.
http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=32&card2=369
But what the hey, I don't play the fast stuff, and have been getting along with a 9700 Pro on one PC, an FX 5900 on another, and slower yet on the two others! I'll have a 9800XT soon, but only because of Oblivion . .
half the memory bandwidth and two thirds the raw fill rate isn't exactly 'raw numbers favoring'
in extremely shader heavy operations the x1600 will win. most other times... it's probably even at best. ati has probably done more revisions to hyper z since the R360, or else the x1600 would not be worth talking about.
unless you're doing video transcoding. might be worth it just for that.
apoppin
Lifer
Originally posted by: PC Surgeon
Did I say it was a performance upgrade? Never did I once say that in this thread! Please read more carefully. These are my opinions (I think i have aluded to this about 3 times now) and what I can do with it.The meaning of the word 'good' is subjective to the person's own perspective on what 'good' is. Can we try to understand this concept please?
For OP, The cards that RussianSensation listed are one's you will experience the most performance jump from. But you must make the decision in the end. Again good luck
Did you notice i stressed "performance upgrade"? And my reference to "good" was in the lack of alternatives at $130.
my warning was a CLARIFICATION to the OP who might have mistaken your extolling your card for suggesting it might be.
an x1600p is clearly, NOT a performance upgrade from a 9800xt even though it is a VERY GOOD card and no doubt perfect for you.
the problem for the OP is that there aren't many good choices at $130 . . . for AGP . . . to "upgrade" from a 9800xt.
choices are the x1600p or the 6600GT . . . a little better would be the 6800std [especially if he is into unlocking]and this one is $139.99 after $20.00 Mail-In Rebate
Apollo 6800 128-RD Geforce 6800 128MB 256-bit DDR AGP 4X/8X Video Card - Retail
OP, maybe save up, sell you current card and get a 6800gs.
Powermoloch
Lifer
- Jul 5, 2005
- 10,084
- 4
- 76
How could this be a bad decision if the card can run better than a 9800pro on newer game titles?
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