Total size of windows 7

[Nothinman]

please, a few hours of installing programs after a clean install isn't going to kill you.
And after you installed all those programs you end up with more functionality.

Not really, depending on the software in question it's more than a few hours, it's definitely a lot more reboots and other hassles and I can name a handful of things off the top of my head that Windows just outright can't do no matter what.

Why exactly do you have to turn EVERY thread that only marginally touches the thematic into a "Linux is so much cooler than Windows" opera? Yeah we all know you like Linux, great, but there's really no reason to derail every thread.

It's not cooler, it's better. And in this particular case, it's because 14G really is a huge amount of disk space for such little functionality and there's always the apologists saying that it's the cost of progress, which obviously isn't the case when other OSes out there do much more with a lot less.

 

[taltamir]

14GB is nothing, and linux is a useful OS with useful application, however, it is not the end all be all of operating systems. It has its flaws and drawbacks. it is good to be excited but this is really derailing the thread.

 

[Voo]

It's not cooler, it's better.

By your subjective standards and that of about 5% of all consumers (see what I did there?), still no reason to derail a thread, just because of your personal agenda.
If you want to talk about Linux vs. Windows I'm sure you can find more than enough forums for exactly that purpose (or slashdot if everything else fails), but there's no reason to turn a thread about how much space you sensibly need for Win7 + WoW + some other apps into a "Which OS should I use?" discussion (considering the amount of work needed to get WoW run under Wine I personally also find it quite amusing that you claim the installation process will be easier)

 

[pjkenned]

By your subjective standards and that of about 5% of all consumers (see what I did there?), still no reason to derail a thread, just because of your personal agenda.

You are, of course, assuming that those 5% of users chose Linux. My guess is that 90% of that 5% are from financial circumstances where Windows is too expensive to obtain. The remaining 10% of the 5% make up the world of CS majors and IT Linux system admins.

considering the amount of work needed to get WoW run under Wine I personally also find it quite amusing that you claim the installation process will be easier)

*Much* harder than a Windows XP system even and that is two versions outdated Windows tech

 

[Diogenes2]

....when other OSes out there do much more with a lot less.

Evidence ?

 

[Makaveli]

Hard drives are the cheapest they ever been since Personal computers came out and you whiners are seriously crying about 14GB's of used space for an OS.

Why are games multi GB's install these days.... I want everything on 1.44 floppies like the good old days damn game developers and their bloat damn them for making progress!

Need a tissue?

 

[bunnyfubbles]

I can get my W7Ult installs down to around 10-12GB for my SSD systems

here's a decent guide: http://blog.corsair.com/?p=3989

I picked through and did the ones I felt I could do without and kept or modified some steps (for instance, I have plenty of RAM, so while I didn't eliminate the page file, I reduced it to 1.2GB to prevent problems should I ever run into an app that needs it)

 

[Voo]

here's a decent guide: http://blog.corsair.com/?p=3989

Well the only thing I see is disable paging and hibernation, the rest doesn't influence the size of the install and is arguable.

While it's obvious that those things help, I think most people here won't need a guide for that - more interesting are things like removing unnecessary drivers and apps: that'll help and should reduce the size quite a bit and has some other advantages as well.

 

[StinkyPinky]

Let me see, just the install of only windows 7 weighs in at 14 GB.

Yet for me and my wife, the total install of win XP plus all the apps we run, weighs in at less than 8 GB.

Is win 7 the future of computers, to have ever more bloated OS'S.

I for one say no, yeech yuck, lets have a leaner Os's that do more with less instead.

Yeah and Windows 95 takes up 150mb. What's your point?

 

[taltamir]

Yeah and Windows 95 takes up 150mb. What's your point?

[sarcasm]obviously smaller is better, windows 95 is thus superior to win98, which is superior to win2k & me, which are superior to XP, which is superior to vista, which is superior to win7...
because taking up more space on the hard drive makes it vastly inferior bloatware.[/sarcasm]

Seriously, this is a total non argument, I have yet to see a single performance review that did not show win7 totally demolishing winXP in actual quantifiable tests.

 

[pjkenned]

[sarcasm]obviously smaller is better, windows 95 is thus superior to win98, which is superior to win2k & me, which are superior to XP, which is superior to vista, which is superior to win7...
because taking up more space on the hard drive makes it vastly inferior bloatware.[/sarcasm]

Seriously, this is a total non argument, I have yet to see a single performance review that did not show win7 totally demolishing winXP in actual quantifiable tests.

Using that logic MS-DOS is basically like Linux (CLI interface) except better because you can play Oregon Trail DELUXE on MS DOS and you can run it off a 1.4MB floppy. Linux is clearly all bloatware beyond 1.4MB.

 

[StinkyPinky]

DOS?! That's just bloatware man. Just hard core bloatware. That shit takes up like 0.01% of your 500GB hard drive.

You should just be running OS/360. 1960's styles. Takes up about 1kb.

And what's with this website anyway?? Just bloatware man. Shit, i want it back old school with two frames and text. But not any text, just plaintext. No html shit with all the fancy fonts and colors. I only want my memory to be at 0.000001% usage...anymore is just bloat.

Shiiiit

 

[jobz]

Save your breath, Voo. The man just like to bitch.

 

[Tsavo]

I just measured Windows 7 and it's exactly 120mm in diameter.

 

[Nothinman]

14GB is nothing, and linux is a useful OS with useful application, however, it is not the end all be all of operating systems. It has its flaws and drawbacks. it is good to be excited but this is really derailing the thread.

14G is a lot when you're talking about even an 80G SSD.

By your subjective standards and that of about 5% of all consumers (see what I did there?), still no reason to derail a thread, just because of your personal agenda.

If you don't like it, just ignore me, you're exacerbating the issue that you're trying to fix by continuing the conversation.

Evidence ?

Explain to me how to get Windows to boot from a software RAID volume or have decent volume management.

 

[Diogenes2]

Your statement was " ...other OSes out there do much more with a lot less. "

What do you mean by " ... much more " ?

It is up to you to explain, or did you mean something else ?


' Decent ' is subjective ...

 

[Nothinman]

Your statement was " ...other OSes out there do much more with a lot less. "

What do you mean by " ... much more " ?

It is up to you to explain, or did you mean something else ?


' Decent ' is subjective ...

My home Linux installation is ~11G and it has everything I need for home, Win7 doesn't. The numbers don't lie. I could probably take the time to come up with a long, exhaustive list of the things I can do at home out of the box that would require 3rd party software on Windows but you can get a better feel for that yourself by just booting one of the many Linux live CDs.

Yes, words like "good" and "decent" are subjective. However, available functionality is black and white and if you look at what one does out of the box vs the other, Linux comes out on top without any questions. My first reply to your request for evidence was one of the first things that popped into my head that I know is 100% impossible to do in Windows and is simple to do in Linux. The only real advantage that Windows has over Linux is game support and that's a non-issue for me these days.

 

[taltamir]

My home Linux installation is ~11G and it has everything I need for home

but it isn't what everyone needs.

The numbers don't lie.

What numbers? 11GB vs 14GB? so what? we already established that it means nothing, with the dos, win95, win98 etc examples.

I could probably take the time to come up with a long, exhaustive list of the things I can do at home out of the box that would require 3rd party software on Windows

And the fact that windows comes with LESS bundled software makes it bloatware? A huge chunk of those free programs that come preloaded with linux are also available for windows. I use a whole bunch of open source programs in windows, I also use a good amount of closed source programs, and I play games.

but you can get a better feel for that yourself by just booting one of the many Linux live CDs.

Ah, the self superior belief that the only reason someone could EVER disagree with you is because they don't know any better, maybe they are ignorant, or maybe they are stupid...
Well, I got to use ubuntu, mandrake, and redhat linux, as well as solaris, freeBSD, Dos, windows 3.11 through 7, macOS9 and X. Yet somehow I disagree with you despite having actually bothered trying to "boot one of the many linux live CDs"... amazing!

 

[Voo]

My home Linux installation is ~11G and it has everything I need for home

Umn no, the Linux kernel itself surely contains NOT everything you need, Ubuntu or another distribution may do, but as you surely know that's not the OS and contains LOTS of third party apps... and is something you can also create for Windows (see previous link or google around) - which after removing all the stuff you don't need [easily done while adding the extra apps] won't be that much larger (though I'm sure still not as small). Or are you claiming that the linux kernel + system libs provide all that much extra utility from scratch?

You may say that stuff is less popular on windows - true -, but honestly I really doubt you want to start comparing OSes based on popularity.

And you won't claim that installing Windows + WoW is more work than Linux + Wine + Wow for the average user (heck nobody could install it faster on linux since you just've to add several additional steps [note: Nobody is claiming that WoW isn't running perfectly fine under Wine, actually I'm pretty sure it's the most tested game out there for it.. and you'll even end up with a hw cursor under OpenGL with the next addon afaik])


Oh and note that I'm writing this on Debian (ah linux toolchains ftw), while being SSHed into a SLES and having my notebook (win7) with a Ubuntu VM running - does that prove that I know more than just Windows? (Actually never used Mac OS X so if I ever make claims about that one, come back to this post)

 

[Nothinman]

but it isn't what everyone needs.

What numbers? 11GB vs 14GB? so what? we already established that it means nothing, with the dos, win95, win98 etc examples.

And they fail because those smaller OSes have less functionality as well. The numbers are still correct.

And the fact that windows comes with LESS bundled software makes it bloatware? A huge chunk of those free programs that come preloaded with linux are also available for windows. I use a whole bunch of open source programs in windows, I also use a good amount of closed source programs, and I play games.

The fact that it's significantly larger and comes with less functionality makes it bloatware. Sure most of the good OSS apps have Win32 builds, but you have to manually go out and find them, install them and update them all by hand. None of that is required with Linux. The few games I play are either native or run via WINE, but I also know that a lot of games also don't run via WINE which is why I said that's the only real advantage that Windows has over Linux.

Ah, the self superior belief that the only reason someone could EVER disagree with you is because they don't know any better, maybe they are ignorant, or maybe they are stupid...
Well, I got to use ubuntu, mandrake, and redhat linux, as well as solaris, freeBSD, Dos, windows 3.11 through 7, macOS9 and X. Yet somehow I disagree with you despite having actually bothered trying to "boot one of the many linux live CDs"... amazing!

It's a simple comparison, product A does X things out of the box and product B does Y things out of the box. If X is higher than Y then product A does more than product B, it's pretty simple. You may disagree about subjective things like which is better, but you can't deny the functionality deficit in Windows when compared to Linux.

Umn no, the Linux kernel itself surely contains NOT everything you need, Ubuntu or another distribution may do, but as you surely know that's not the OS and contains LOTS of third party apps...

Semantics. If you want me to edit all of my posts to say Debian instead of Linux I will, but the only thing that would accomplish is appeasing you.

You may say that stuff is less popular on windows - true -, but honestly I really doubt you want to start comparing OSes based on popularity.

I said nothing of popularity.

And you won't claim that installing Windows + WoW is more work than Linux + Wine + Wow for the average user (heck nobody could install it faster on linux since you just've to add several additional steps [note: Nobody is claiming that WoW isn't running perfectly fine under Wine, actually I'm pretty sure it's the most tested game out there for it.. and you'll even end up with a hw cursor under OpenGL with the next addon afaik])

I can't comment on the amount of work involved in getting WoW to run via WINE, but since I can install WINE during an install of Debian (happy?) that's not an extra step. It probably is more work, but I already conceded that Windows' 1 advantage of Debian (still happy?) is games.

Oh and note that I'm writing this on Debian (ah linux toolchains ftw), while being SSHed into a SLES and having my notebook (win7) with a Ubuntu VM running - does that prove that I know more than just Windows? (Actually never used Mac OS X so if I ever make claims about that one, come back to this post)

If you really know Linux well then you should be able to come up with your own list of things Linux does that Windows can't and suggests that you're just arguing for the sake of argument.

 

[Voo]

Semantics. If you want me to edit all of my posts to say Debian instead of Linux I will, but the only thing that would accomplish is appeasing you.

No, the point is I can create a Windows "distribution" excluding all unnecessary drivers and apps and including all wanted extra apps just as well. So you'd have to compare against that, but in the end I don't care if installing some apps once every 5 years takes 10 minutes or 30.

If you really know Linux well then you should be able to come up with your own list of things Linux does that Windows can't and suggests that you're just arguing for the sake of argument.

Uh yeah let's see the GNU toolchain, then some VHDL/Verilog simulators where I personally don't like the windows equivalents, oh valgrind obviously and the package manager - all nice things. But there are also enough things I like about windows from small useability stuff (win key + arrows, multimonitor support with ease, backwards compability,..), the fact that there are way more good working drivers (well as good as possible at least) for every kind of HW, the fact that my nb can handle flash perfectly fine under Win, but not in Ubuntu, to lots of software that won't work well or at all under Wine which I do need.
Oh and don't forget such small things like getting Word/Excel documents (yep lots of people do send those around, moaning about that won't change facts) and not having to hope that OO can handle those correctly. And we all know how great DRM content works under Linux


If you think Linux is better in each and every way that's fine, but that's cleary subjective, there are enough people who know Linux quite well and still use Windows or Mac OS X. That's like telling someone who has problems with Linux drivers that he should just use Windows because there he won't run into those, which while mostly true just isn't helping, because he's running Linux and wants help for that

 

[Gillbot]

This is NOT a linux/Win7 debate, keep it ON TRACK please.
AT Mod
Gillbot

 

[StinkyPinky]

What planet is Nothinman on that a miserable 3GB is so important to him? This isn't 1999 anymore. 3 gigs is nothing. If 3 gigs is so important to you then I suggest you purchase a new hard drive that's not from the last century. Seriously.

My steam folder alone is 150GB and that sits on a partition that's not even 50% full.

 

[SickBeast]

3GB is relevant if you only have a 40GB SSD.

3GB is a very conservative estimate as well.

 

[jobz]

Jeez, away 2 days, and the man is still bitching!

You know what's funny, your constant sniping of windows have not made me want to try Linux, but to turn away from it. This is same reason I detest apple products. I have nothing against Linux, whether it is better or worse compared to windows, I don't care. Windows is not perfect, no os is. But I continue to use it because I'm familiar with it, and as I said before, because it supports widest range of hardware and software. I just want it to work.

This argument is becoming irrelevant by the day, because we are supposed to be in the post-PC world.

Right, I'm done. As Gilllbot said, let's get the thread back on track, whatever that was, LOL.