[Tom's Hardware] Most of Apple's A9/A9X to be manufactured on TSMC's 16 nm FinFET.

[Mondozei]

After some speculation that Samsung would basically win over Apple's orders, it appears that Apple are not quite that trusting of Samsung just yet. Maybe the S6's pre-order records is what has rattled them a little, you just can't quite county Sammy out yet.

So it seems they are now directing their attention towards TSMC instead. The key word is "most" not "all".

So Sammy may still get some, but it won't be the majority after all. I'm personally surprised, but yet pleased. It was common knowledge that Sammy had passed TSMC on the road to sub-20 nm, so it seems TSMC has begun to catch up again. TSMC has also started to get some significant breakthroughs together with ASML lately, so finally good to see their fortunes turn.

 

[witeken]

sub-20 nm

It's not sub-20nm. It's still 20nm. It's "sub"-HKMG.

I'm a bit surprised since TSMC won't start HVM until Q3. It seemed more reasonable to expect both TSMC+SS for A9.

Edit:

"We believe TSMC will earn most of the A9 orders thanks to its superior yield ramp and manufacturing excellence in mass-production. We expect TSMC to earn all of Apple's A9X orders (for the next generation iPad) and most of the A9 (for the next generation of iPhone), aggregating to an allocation of over 70%," said analysts from Daiwa Securities.

Analysts as source?

 

[ShintaiDK]

May be the classic volume as difference. Doesnt help much if Samsung can only manufactor a limited amount of chips on 14nm.

Reality and PR is usually 2 different worlds.

 

[Fjodor2001]

May be the classic volume as difference. Doesnt help much if Samsung can only manufactor a limited amount of chips on 14nm.

Reality and PR is usually 2 different worlds.

Certainly higher volumes than Intel 14 nm though, especially when comparing volumes at launch of Samsung/TSMC 14/16 nm vs Intel 14 nm process...

 

[ShintaiDK]

Certainly higher volumes than Intel 14 nm though, especially when comparing volumes at launch of Samsung/TSMC 14/16 nm vs Intel 14 nm process...

Samsung and TSMC combined is no near Intels wafer output on a leading edge node. Its not even remotely comparable.

 

[Fjodor2001]

Samsung and TSMC combined is no near Intels wafer output on a leading edge node. Its not even remotely comparable.

How many 14 nm chips do you think Intel sold at launch in 2014Q4? And how many chips do you think Samsung will sell at launch in 2015Q2.

I can tell you the Samsung volumes will blow the Intel volumes out of the water. The S6 is Samsung's top selling phone, available at very large volumes at launch. Compare that to Intel, which only had a tiny amount of Broadwell Y Core M chips available through some very limited computer models available at launch.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Most likely more than Samsung will. Plus Intel may already be with a 14nm wafer volume that Samsung will never reach throughout the lifespan of the node.

We dont even know if the 14nm Exynos chips will be market segmented for the S6. Something Samsung have done a lot with.

 

[Fjodor2001]

Most likely more than Samsung will.

On 22 nm where the most of the usual armada of Intel SKUs were released at launch, I agree. But on 14 nm no way, it was as close to a paper launch as you get get by normal Intel standards. They forced out a few Broadwell Y Core M chips only to be able to claim a 14 nm 2014 launch.

 

[ShintaiDK]

What is Samsungs current 14nm volume? What was Intels 14nm volume in Q4? What is it now?

 

[Fjodor2001]

What is Samsungs current 14nm volume? What was Intels 14nm volume in Q4? What is it now?

I said 2015Q2, so it's not known yet. But given the normal S6 sales volume we can be sure it's very high. Do you have some data indicating otherwise?

 

[ShintaiDK]

Will all S6 contain the chip? Look at the S5. Exynos 5422, Snapdragon 801(2 models), Snapdragon 805. And S5 sales was...dissapointing.

 

[monstercameron]

Will all S6 contain the chip? Look at the S5. Exynos 5422, Snapdragon 801(2 models), Snapdragon 805. And S5 sales was...dissapointing.

But the volumes weren't.

 

[ShintaiDK]

But the volumes weren't.

For the 5422?

Wast majority of the phones didnt even ship with it.

 

[Fjodor2001]

Will all S6 contain the chip? Look at the S5. Exynos 5422, Snapdragon 801(2 models), Snapdragon 805. And S5 sales was...dissapointing.

As far as I'm aware there has not been any Qualcomm based variant of the S6 announced. So that implies Samsung 14 nm Exynos 7420 on all S6 models.

 

[mavere]

It's not sub-20nm. It's still 20nm. It's "sub"-HKMG.

It's sub-20nm. Samsung improved feature sizes compared to its 20nm.

(And I was under the impression TSMC did the same with its FF+ variant, but I haven't seen numbers.)

 

[witeken]

It's sub-20nm. Samsung improved feature sizes compared to its 20nm.

(And I was under the impression TSMC did the same with its FF+ variant, but I haven't seen numbers.)

Incorrect 2 times. The 15% density improvement is due to something else.

 

[erunion]

Certainly higher volumes than Intel 14 nm though, especially when comparing volumes at launch of Samsung/TSMC 14/16 nm vs Intel 14 nm process...

way to derail the thread with anti-Intel sniping. Reported.

 

[erunion]

.

I'm a bit surprised since TSMC won't start HVM until Q3. It seemed more reasonable to expect both TSMC+SS for A9.

?

I wonder about that too. That doesn't seem like a very big window. Assuming apple launches un September.

Could apple launch with test wafer products?

 

[mavere]

Incorrect 2 times. The 15% density improvement is due to something else.

They shrunk the gate length and contacted gate pitch.

I'm not sure why this is even an argument. It's, like, a thing.

 

[Fjodor2001]

way to derail the thread with anti-Intel sniping. Reported.

It was a response disputing the comment in the previous post saying "May be the classic volume as difference. Doesnt help much if Samsung can only manufactor a limited amount of chips on 14nm. Reality and PR is usually 2 different worlds. ".

If you want to report something, go ahead and report that instead which was the derail initiator, if anything.

 

[kagui]

here is another report
https://www.semiwiki.com/forum/content/4422-apple-leaks-chip-sources.html

 

[witeken]

10nm (FinFET) in 2016 ?

 

[Fjodor2001]

10nm (FinFET) in 2016 ?

So ahead of Intel then. As expected, given the latest trends in process tech advancements...

Also interesting to note this:

Apple iPad & Mac, A10X order allocation, 2016: Samsung 10 nm FinFET, 100%

I.e. it would confirm rumors of Apple migrating from x86 to ARM on Mac.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Confirming a rumour with a rumour?

 

[Fjodor2001]

Confirming a rumour with a rumour?

No, confirming a rumor with leaked inside info, making the rumor more likely to be correct. It's the best we've got at the moment.