Today's lesson in perspective

[Red Squirrel]

Dunno what the tree service industry is like up near you, and how close your off grid property is to anything, but you could probably get wood free from tree companies, and they'll drop if off at your property. You'd get a lot of shit wood, but you have the space to make it disappear.

I was actually thinking that, I would need to call some of them just to ask what they typically do with the trees. Maybe they already have an agreement with some firewood companies but if not I would take some for sure. I don't think they'd be willing to drop it off all the way there but I could go pick it up wherever works for them. This particular batch happened to be near my property so dropped most of it off there and brought a truck load to my house which I since split. Ended up investing in a log splitter, as much as it's fun to split by hand, good to give myself a break too. 😛 This stuff was super wet too but managed to get it down to like 20-25%. I need to measure it again hopefully it went down more, might be able to burn it this year.

I have a bunch of cedar from my hedges that I cut several years ago so that stuff is super dry.

 

[Ajay]

Very few people own the buildings they live in. VERY few.

I happen to be one of them.

We just paid off our mortgage and it certainly is a good feeling. It was the only debt we had. We’ll probably acquire some debt in the next couple of years for an auto loan (geez have cars gotten expensive). Part of me would like to take out a small loan to build a two car garage. It was a no brainer when interest rates were low (take out a cheap loan and put money into the market). The choice isn’t so clear with higher rates and a more fickle stock market.

 

[Red Squirrel]

I wouldn’t be in favor of a 100% death tax on all assets. It’s very natural for parents who have saved and/or invested well to want to pass some of that on to their children. A tax law that completely bypasses natural maternal and paternal instincts would be unjust in my opinion. So there are lines that need to be drawn. One area that would need to be addressed are certain types of trusts that allow all assets to be passes tax free to adult children - most typically in wealthy families.

Yeah I'm more in favour of taxing money as close to the beginning of it being earned as possible and not after. In a perfect world we'd have zero taxes but if we're going to have them IMO it should be income tax, and we should get rid of every single other tax. Get taxed once, everything after that is yours. Slash size of government and government spending down to only bare essentials like healthcare and infrastructure, bring income tax down to like 10% at least for the lower/middle class then slowly bring the percentage up for millionaires and up. Simplify the system so you don't need a full team of accountants just to manage it. Less overhead for everyone including the government itself.

 

[highland145]

The tax structure is how congress wants it.

 

[MtnMan]

I

• Wealth taxes (such as asset taxes) boost the economy. Want to lower your asset tax bill? Buy some things. Major economic boosts will happen as the ultra wealthy buy all kinds of services to reduce their tax bills. They'd hire nearly every single feasible unemployed person to do more services for them to reduce their taxes.

Then register that Yacht in the Bahamas, so you don't have to pay taxes on that "asset"

 

[dullard]

Then register that Yacht in the Bahamas, so you don't have to pay taxes on that "asset"

Why would the government give exceptions to people that register it outside the country?

I know that people dislike this option. But it would be the best for the economy, the fairest, and honestly freeing to never pay income or sales taxes again. And most people are already paying property taxes directly or indirectly (higher rent if your landlord pays property taxes) so that isn't much of a change. Yes, there are options to hide wealth like l already mentioned above. That would have to be addressed.

 

[MtnMan]

Why would the government give exceptions to people that register it outside the country?

I know that people dislike this option. But it would be the best for the economy, the fairest, and honestly freeing to never pay income or sales taxes again. And most people are already paying property taxes directly or indirectly (higher rent if your landlord pays property taxes) so that isn't much of a change. Yes, there are options to hide wealth like l already mentioned above. That would have to be addressed.

Same reason a government can't enforce a law outside its jurisdiction.

 

[dullard]

Same reason a government can't enforce a law outside its jurisdiction.

We already tax foreign income. Even more specifically we already tax income from foreign assets: https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f8938.pdf

 

[Stopsignhank]

I collect dogs.

The problem is we used to have 30 to 40 pound dogs. Now we have 10 to 20 pound dogs so it is a case of diminishing assets.

 

[jmagg]

Covid allowed the gouge across the board. No amt of govt relief can compensate.

 

[nakedfrog]

Yeah I'm more in favour of taxing money as close to the beginning of it being earned as possible and not after. In a perfect world we'd have zero taxes but if we're going to have them IMO it should be income tax, and we should get rid of every single other tax. Get taxed once, everything after that is yours. Slash size of government and government spending down to only bare essentials like healthcare and infrastructure, bring income tax down to like 10% at least for the lower/middle class then slowly bring the percentage up for millionaires and up. Simplify the system so you don't need a full team of accountants just to manage it. Less overhead for everyone including the government itself.

That perfect world wouldn't seem so perfect if you actually had to live in it.

 

[Ajay]

The tax structure is how congress wants it.

Well, yes. It is their job. But some people, those with deep pockets, have more influence on the decisions that congress makes than us plebs. It just, uh, aggravates me.

 

[dullard]

That perfect world wouldn't seem so perfect if you actually had to live in it.

Hey, I hear Somalia is wonderful! Few people pay taxes there.

 

[KMFJD]

That perfect world wouldn't seem so perfect if you actually had to live in it.

I see it all the time here in the DR, the roads are fucking terrible, the water you cannot drink so you have to purchase it in jugs to drink, electricity cuts out a few times a week, Police are terrible and are constantly asking for bribes, hospitals? oh lord don't get me started on those unless you have money....bridges falling apart and taking YEARS to rebuild . Everything you take for granted in the US/Canada/Europe is a bit of a struggle to a big time pain in the ass. You should see the vehicles on the road here, no inspections, huge billows of black smoke coming out of the trucks as they attempt to go up a hill at 15mile an hour if your lucky

 

[Red Squirrel]

I see it all the time here in the DR, the roads are fucking terrible, the water you cannot drink so you have to purchase it in jugs to drink, electricity cuts out a few times a week, Police are terrible and are constantly asking for bribes, hospitals? oh lord don't get me started on those unless you have money....bridges falling apart and taking YEARS to rebuild . Everything you take for granted in the US/Canada/Europe is a bit of a struggle to a big time pain in the ass. You should see the vehicles on the road here, no inspections, huge billows of black smoke coming out of the trucks as they attempt to go up a hill at 15mile an hour if your lucky

TBH all of that sounds like what we deal with here. Seems everything is crumbling yet we pay more and more taxes, where does that money even go?

 

[Pohemi]

Any policy you try to target "the rich" with will also apply to everyone else including middle class.

If I buy a house or boat or whatever and now I have to pay taxes on it every month then at some point renting becomes cheaper. I really don't want to have to rent, I rather own, and shouldn't have to pay for life for that.

Wealth taxes, if actually targeted at the ultra rich could work, the problem is when they write these sort of policies it does not work out that way. Someone like me that owns a home and a separate 40 acre property would be seen as ultra wealthy by such a policy, even though I saved up for years to buy that and don't have that much money.

But if I have a 30k boat I may have spent 10 years saving up for that, why should I keep having to pay tax over and over on it? And now I have to sell it if I choose to retire because I can't afford the taxes anymore.

1) Unless you simply mean the likeliness of congress critters demanding that higher taxes apply to all brackets instead of just the top 1%, why do you keep stating that as fact? As if these taxes on the ultra wealthy are just impossible to enact without affecting YOU as well? You are the only one claiming this. Well except for maybe Greenman.

2) Why would you keep paying taxes on a boat as if you were renting it? I don't understand how you keep imagining these hypothetical situations, TBH. Even IF you were ultra-wealthy and owned assets like yachts, mansions, etc...why would you be paying taxes on those assets monthly? Why would you think this is just the only way it would work?

You already keep paying for a house and land NOW because of property taxes, so saying you don't want to do that...welp, you're doing it already. I don't understand how an asset tax that kicks in at some higher level ($10M in assets?) would negatively affect you, especially if it helped to lower property tax, sales taxes, income taxes, etc.

At least with income tax you only pay the tax once.

Do away with loopholes for income taxes (like for earned interest and capital gains, etc) for anyone with assets over a certain amount ($10M? again as a hypothetical). The richest folks now claim very little to no income year to year because they aren't taking in wages. Why do you think Elon gave himself a $1 annual salary when he took control of Twitter?

That system as it is now, needs to change.

I want to hoard platinum!

Gold has been riding pretty high, and Platinum has been relatively low, despite being far rarer than gold. The slowdown in sales in the automotive industry has had a big effect on the value of Platinum the past few years as it's the highest global usage of it (catalytic converters). I think it's a good time to hoard it.

IANAFA, btw 😛

 

[dullard]

TBH all of that sounds like what we deal with here. Seems everything is crumbling yet we pay more and more taxes, where does that money even go?

Sounds like you need to get out of Timmins (economically destroyed for selling much of its resources to the highest bidder) and explore the world more.

 

[Red Squirrel]

1) Unless you simply mean the likeliness of congress critters demanding that higher taxes apply to all brackets instead of just the top 1%, why do you keep stating that as fact? As if these taxes on the ultra wealthy are just impossible to enact without affecting YOU as well? You are the only one claiming this. Well except for maybe Greenman.

2) Why would you keep paying taxes on a boat as if you were renting it? I don't understand how you keep imagining these hypothetical situations, TBH. Even IF you were ultra-wealthy and owned assets like yachts, mansions, etc...why would you be paying taxes on those assets monthly? Why would you think this is just the only way it would work?

You already keep paying for a house and land NOW because of property taxes, so saying you don't want to do that...welp, you're doing it already. I don't understand how an asset tax that kicks in at some higher level ($10M in assets?) would negatively affect you, especially if it helped to lower property tax, sales taxes, income taxes, etc.

Do away with loopholes for income taxes (like for earned interest and capital gains, etc) for anyone with assets over a certain amount ($10M? again as a hypothetical). The richest folks now claim very little to no income year to year because they aren't taking in wages. Why do you think Elon gave himself a $1 annual salary when he took control of Twitter?

That shit needs to change.

Isn't an asset tax basically a property tax but on all assets? And yeah I know property tax already exist, I'm saying it shouldn't. We shouldn't have any tax that is continuous that you pay over and over on the same thing. Money should only be taxed once. I do agree on ending the loopholes. That's why I think income should be taxed right away. You make money you pay tax on it. If you have enough left over to buy Twitter or w/e then all the power to you. You shouldn't be able to just give yourself a low salary but then still make a bunch of money anyway.

Sounds like you need to get out of Timmins (economically destroyed for selling much of its resources to the highest bidder) and explore the world more.

It's not just here, it's a universal issue really. Some places are worse than others but it's more and more widespread.

 

[Pohemi]

Isn't an asset tax basically a property tax but on all assets? And yeah I know property tax already exist, I'm saying it shouldn't. We shouldn't have any tax that is continuous that you pay over and over on the same thing. Money should only be taxed once. I do agree on ending the loopholes. That's why I think income should be taxed right away. You make money you pay tax on it. If you have enough left over to buy Twitter or w/e then all the power to you. You shouldn't be able to just give yourself a low salary but then still make a bunch of money anyway.

I think that sounds right for the asset tax...I think.

I don't believe you should necessarily pay repeating taxes on the same money, especially on income. What motivation would keep the richest people from hoarding their money and resources more than they already do? If they keep billions sitting in banks/funds/trusts for years on end, how does that help the economy or anyone but their account balance bragging rights (and gained interest)?

I don't think we should be reliant on the richest 1% to pay all the tax burden of the country, but enacting (and effectively enforcing) stronger asset taxes on wealthy CAN lower taxes on the rest of us, and in other tax types like income, sales, property, or school district taxes, etc.

"They" are collecting a majority share of the wealth creation in the country, and it isn't because they're "job creators". They should not be able to dodge more taxes or pay lower rates than anyone else.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

I'm in a tiny rural county, mostly agricultural. Some industry, little other business. Very low tax that only applies to working people, not retired or other. Low property tax also.

Our roads are paved and maintained rather well. Utility lines have been upgraded in recent years and we have few outages.

Paid EMS and sheriff, volunteer fire departments.

It isn't taxes or lack of, it's how the budget is managed.

 

[dullard]

I'm in a tiny rural county, mostly agricultural. Some industry, little other business. Very low tax that only applies to working people, not retired or other. Low property tax also.

Our roads are paved and maintained rather well. Utility lines have been upgraded in recent years and we have few outages.

Paid EMS and sheriff, volunteer fire departments.

It isn't taxes or lack of, it's how the budget is managed.

I agree that how the budget is managed is very important. No locality should run a deficit for long. Keep spending under control.

But I did have to chime in a bit. Rural governments in the US, on average, get 35.6% of their budget from cities as subsidies (through state or federal taxes). That drain on urban areas and boost to your rural area does make the comparison a bit unfair. It would be a lot harder for your area to manage the budget and a lot easier for cities to manage their budgets if there wasn't this yearly transfer from urban to rural areas.

 

[RearAdmiral]

Very few people own the buildings they live in. VERY few.

I happen to be one of them.

While I assume you mean real ownership and not mortgaged, based on the first google result 65.8% are homeowners. 225k networth vs 6,300 for renters, ouch.

 

[KMFJD]

TBH all of that sounds like what we deal with here.

lol no, not even close

 

[lxskllr]

Third world disrepair is on a whole different level. MD has great roads. PA less so, but probably still luxurious compared to DR, and certainly compared to the description of Romania my friend told me about after a visit.

 

[KMFJD]

Third world disrepair is on a whole different level. MD has great roads. PA less so, but probably still luxurious compared to DR, and certainly compared to the description of Romania my friend told me about after a visit.

It's getting better, but the infrastructure is in no way keeping up with the population, the roads just keep getting busier and busier as more cheap vehicles are offloaded here....and some of the semi trucks...no cab on the engine at all, sometimes no doors, big black clouds of smoke bellowing out the side right into the moto-conchos, i'll try to get a picture sometime.