To all the "Private Health Insurance is the way to go" people

Stunt

Diamond Member
Jul 17, 2002
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Canada's healthcare system is not something to long for :p
Although, I've heard good things from Canadians going to the US for care...
 

episodic

Lifer
Feb 7, 2004
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Originally posted by: Stunt
Canada's healthcare system is not something to long for :p
Although, I've heard good things from Canadians going to the US for care...

It seems people would not get refused as this man did.
 

TraumaRN

Diamond Member
Jun 5, 2005
6,893
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I want to comment but I dont wanna explode into a rant, so I'll just say I hope they win a wrongful death suit against the insurance company.
 
Jun 27, 2005
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Originally posted by: episodic
Originally posted by: Stunt
Canada's healthcare system is not something to long for :p
Although, I've heard good things from Canadians going to the US for care...

It seems people would not get refused as this man did.

Refused, probably not. But he would have probably still died waiting for treatment.

Sad story either way.
 

Stunt

Diamond Member
Jul 17, 2002
9,717
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Originally posted by: episodic
Originally posted by: Stunt
Canada's healthcare system is not something to long for :p
Although, I've heard good things from Canadians going to the US for care...
It seems people would not get refused as this man did.
Depends how you look at it.
That seems like a freak case; Canada's system is plagued with extremely long wait times and in my opinion, that is a form of widespread refusal.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
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www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: episodic
http://news.yahoo.com/s/kmbc/3257367;_y...;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

When is the last time you've seen Candians or British persons dieing in this totally unacceptable manner. This should be a murder trial imho.

"As he waited, his doctors appealed again and again, including a 27-page appeal spelling out that Tracy Pierce would die without care. Coventry insurance dismissed each request."

Cool :cool: Republican population control. :thumbsup:

They figure this guy would probably vote Democrat so he is expendable.
 

themusgrat

Golden Member
Nov 2, 2005
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Originally posted by: Stunt
Originally posted by: episodic
Originally posted by: Stunt
Canada's healthcare system is not something to long for :p
Although, I've heard good things from Canadians going to the US for care...
It seems people would not get refused as this man did.
Depends how you look at it.
That seems like a freak case; Canada's system is plagued with extremely long wait times and in my opinion, that is a form of widespread refusal.

My British friend told me last weekend of an aunt who had arthritis, and the doctors waited so long that they had to amputate 2 fingers because it was no longer treatable by the time they had time (waited 6 months) to look at it. No country has ever had good governmentalized health care, ever, so why do we think that it would work in the US? BTW, if I heard about it this weekend, very randomly, this malpractice? is not a freak thing, though dying maybe is.
 

dmcanally

Member
Oct 25, 2005
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It seems to me that this has nothing to do with private/public health care and everything to do with him having a bad carrier. If his carrier denied him something that was provided in his policy then his wife and son are going to be rich.
 

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,313
534
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From the article.

When Flink talked to Tracy Pierce, his cancer was attacking his body. Despite being fully insured, every treatment his doctors sought for him was denied by his insurance provider. First-Health Coventry deemed the treatments were either not a medical necessity or experimental.

"It's purely economical. You never see an insurance company try to block an inexpensive test," said William Soper.

What is going on is that some insurance companies deny even routine treatments because insurance companies treat their patients as costs, not as clients, Christopher said.


I am all for tax payer funded Government health insurance for all run by some bureacrat who decides what is a medical necessity or experimental, economical, and have to make decisions based on costs. Also if anything goes wrong good luck trying to sue.;)
 

EatSpam

Diamond Member
May 1, 2005
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Originally posted by: episodic
http://news.yahoo.com/s/kmbc/3257367;_y...;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

When is the last time you've seen Candians or British persons dieing in this totally unacceptable manner. This should be a murder trial imho.

When was the last time you saw a Canadian or British person go bankrupt paying for their medical bills?

This was, hopefully, an isolated incident.

Anyway, hasn't anyone else had problems getting our wonderful private insurance to cover things? My insurance company tried to call one of my mole removal surgeries cosmetic after the pathology report said the mole was precancerous!
 

EatSpam

Diamond Member
May 1, 2005
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Originally posted by: 1prophet
From the article.

When Flink talked to Tracy Pierce, his cancer was attacking his body. Despite being fully insured, every treatment his doctors sought for him was denied by his insurance provider. First-Health Coventry deemed the treatments were either not a medical necessity or experimental.

"It's purely economical. You never see an insurance company try to block an inexpensive test," said William Soper.

What is going on is that some insurance companies deny even routine treatments because insurance companies treat their patients as costs, not as clients, Christopher said.


I am all for tax payer funded Government health insurance for all run by some bureacrat who decides what is a medical necessity or experimental, economical, and have to make decisions based on costs. Also if anything goes wrong good luck trying to sue.;)

If you have an HMO or most other private insurance, its really no different. Instead of a government goon deciding what's "necessary", you have a private company goon. I'd rather have the government goon, since he probably doesn't give a rat's ass whether the government spends extra money or not, whereas the private goon gets a bonus for denying claims.
 

episodic

Lifer
Feb 7, 2004
11,088
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Originally posted by: 1prophet
From the article.

When Flink talked to Tracy Pierce, his cancer was attacking his body. Despite being fully insured, every treatment his doctors sought for him was denied by his insurance provider. First-Health Coventry deemed the treatments were either not a medical necessity or experimental.

"It's purely economical. You never see an insurance company try to block an inexpensive test," said William Soper.

What is going on is that some insurance companies deny even routine treatments because insurance companies treat their patients as costs, not as clients, Christopher said.


I am all for tax payer funded Government health insurance for all run by some bureacrat who decides what is a medical necessity or experimental, economical, and have to make decisions based on costs. Also if anything goes wrong good luck trying to sue.;)



Ok, I can agree with you.

The solution would be for the government to fund a private agency to expiditiously handle claims. Bonuses to said corporation would be paid when performance is high and no restrictions placed on needed medical care. To define what is covered and what isn't should be placed in the hands of the a government committee, an independent committe consisting of university bioethicists, and medical professionals (mostly predetermined of course), not on a case by case basis. If needed treatment was unusual then have a swift set of procedures to approve the needed medical care as long as it wasn't anything ludicrous like oriental tea leaf massage or something. Spending is managed by agreeing to 'fair' prices for procedures and setting those prices, revisiting them every few years.

Persons wanting private insurance could still buy it if they felt the need. Hospitals could also charge for 'upgrades' like private rooms, etc for those with the ability/will to pay extra. Secondly, we could start by providing free medical educations for quality students with interest and desire in return for 10 years of service at a living wage (40-50k) in return for their free education from highschool to end of internship. This in turn would drive cost down.
 

SarcasticDwarf

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2001
9,574
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Right now there seems to be two different extremes. There is private healthcare where only the majority get care and some people are denied for specifc things. Those that get care (the majority) get very good care. There is also government run healthcare where everyone gets care. The care tends to not be as good and there are very long wait times for all care.

damned if you do, damned if you don't.
 

episodic

Lifer
Feb 7, 2004
11,088
2
81
Originally posted by: SarcasticDwarf
Right now there seems to be two different extremes. There is private healthcare where only the majority get care and some people are denied for specifc things. Those that get care (the majority) get very good care. There is also government run healthcare where everyone gets care. The care tends to not be as good and there are very long wait times for all care.

damned if you do, damned if you don't.

You notice noone ever answers why there can't be both. We should have a nationalized system and private healthcare.

If you are happy with a good nationlized system or can't afford private then you can do that. If you want the best when you want it pay for private.

Why can't both exist?
 

EatSpam

Diamond Member
May 1, 2005
6,423
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Originally posted by: episodic
Originally posted by: SarcasticDwarf
Right now there seems to be two different extremes. There is private healthcare where only the majority get care and some people are denied for specifc things. Those that get care (the majority) get very good care. There is also government run healthcare where everyone gets care. The care tends to not be as good and there are very long wait times for all care.

damned if you do, damned if you don't.

You notice noone ever answers why there can't be both. We should have a nationalized system and private healthcare.

If you are happy with a good nationlized system or can't afford private then you can do that. If you want the best when you want it pay for private.

Why can't both exist?

I'm all for a two tiered system. I think a public system that covers all and then optional value added private insurance is the way to go.
 

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,313
534
126
Originally posted by: EatSpam
Originally posted by: 1prophet
From the article.

When Flink talked to Tracy Pierce, his cancer was attacking his body. Despite being fully insured, every treatment his doctors sought for him was denied by his insurance provider. First-Health Coventry deemed the treatments were either not a medical necessity or experimental.

"It's purely economical. You never see an insurance company try to block an inexpensive test," said William Soper.

What is going on is that some insurance companies deny even routine treatments because insurance companies treat their patients as costs, not as clients, Christopher said.


I am all for tax payer funded Government health insurance for all run by some bureacrat who decides what is a medical necessity or experimental, economical, and have to make decisions based on costs. Also if anything goes wrong good luck trying to sue.;)

If you have an HMO or most other private insurance, its really no different. Instead of a government goon deciding what's "necessary", you have a private company goon. I'd rather have the government goon, since he probably doesn't give a rat's ass whether the government spends extra money or not, whereas the private goon gets a bonus for denying claims.

You are correct about it being no different, but when something goes wrong you have recourse against the private goon but what about the government goon?
 

desertdweller

Senior member
Jan 6, 2001
588
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Originally posted by: episodic
http://news.yahoo.com/s/kmbc/3257367;_y...;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

When is the last time you've seen Candians or British persons dieing in this totally unacceptable manner. This should be a murder trial imho.

You've never actually seen how bad Medicare is have you? If you think private bean counters are bad, wait until you have to deal with a government bean counter. Oh, and they don't pay for anything that is "experimental" either.

At least with a private company, there is some recourse when something like this happens.
 

EatSpam

Diamond Member
May 1, 2005
6,423
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0
Originally posted by: 1prophet
Originally posted by: EatSpam
Originally posted by: 1prophet
From the article.

When Flink talked to Tracy Pierce, his cancer was attacking his body. Despite being fully insured, every treatment his doctors sought for him was denied by his insurance provider. First-Health Coventry deemed the treatments were either not a medical necessity or experimental.

"It's purely economical. You never see an insurance company try to block an inexpensive test," said William Soper.

What is going on is that some insurance companies deny even routine treatments because insurance companies treat their patients as costs, not as clients, Christopher said.


I am all for tax payer funded Government health insurance for all run by some bureacrat who decides what is a medical necessity or experimental, economical, and have to make decisions based on costs. Also if anything goes wrong good luck trying to sue.;)

If you have an HMO or most other private insurance, its really no different. Instead of a government goon deciding what's "necessary", you have a private company goon. I'd rather have the government goon, since he probably doesn't give a rat's ass whether the government spends extra money or not, whereas the private goon gets a bonus for denying claims.

You are correct about it being no different, but when something goes wrong you have recourse against the private goon but what about the government goon?

You can sue the government. Check out TennCare, Tennessee's example of how not to run government healthcare.
 

alent1234

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2002
3,915
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someone i work down the hall from was treated for cancer last year and is still working. insurance paid for it.

Coventry is probably just a scam company that doesn't pay for anything expensive and people probably made the mistake of signing up with them.
 

BarneyFife

Diamond Member
Aug 12, 2001
3,875
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76
You guys should just pray that you don't have to go to the hospital instead of worrying about who has the better health care system.
 

arsbanned

Banned
Dec 12, 2003
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Originally posted by: EatSpam
Originally posted by: episodic
http://news.yahoo.com/s/kmbc/3257367;_y...;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

When is the last time you've seen Candians or British persons dieing in this totally unacceptable manner. This should be a murder trial imho.

When was the last time you saw a Canadian or British person go bankrupt paying for their medical bills?

This was, hopefully, an isolated incident.

Anyway, hasn't anyone else had problems getting our wonderful private insurance to cover things? My insurance company tried to call one of my mole removal surgeries cosmetic after the pathology report said the mole was precancerous!

Try paying that out of pocket. Our insurance covers nothing at all and features an ever increasing premium and a $15,000 (US) deductible. It's our best option. But I'm sure it's much better than Canada's. :roll:
 

Meuge

Banned
Nov 27, 2005
2,963
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The problem is that while the insurance system in the U.S. is totally buggered right now, the alternative is worse. It seems that there are no middle-of-the-road people. There are those who support ultra laissez-faire "go-and-die" capitalism... and those who support "pay-doctors-10X-less, let-everyone-have-crappy-care, expand-the-uber-bureaucracy" socialists.
 

DVK916

Banned
Dec 12, 2005
2,765
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Originally posted by: Meuge
Originally posted by: episodic
http://news.yahoo.com/s/kmbc/3257367;_y...;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

When is the last time you've seen Candians or British persons dieing in this totally unacceptable manner. This should be a murder trial imho.
You're out of your mind. If you're 55 and need dialysis in the UK, they let you die, unless you can pay out of pocket. There's thousands of these cases per year.


I hear Canada is similar with Dialysis but with a higher upper age.