To all AT home audio people, help me design a system!

[NewSc2]

hey ATers, just moved into my new apartment about a week ago, and i'm looking forward to a nice hifi audio setup to complement all the CD's i've purchased recently. I'm looking to spend no more than $1100 on a system, and preferably about $700-800 would be perfect.

This is going to be for my bedroom, and it's going to go along with probably a new 27" flatscreen TV.

For my computer, i have a set of HD580's and VideoLogic Digitheatre DTS system, so i'm looking to hopefully beat that setup soundly. (if the price allows for it) I hate to sound shallow or anything, but if there's a deal for something that looks spiffy i'd probably go for it. (sound before looks, but looks matter ). In AudioAdvisor's catalog, there's this Nakamichi 8-pc stereo system for about $800... but not sure how it'll turn out or anything.

A few questions that i still have... (sorry if they're dumb)

1) what's the difference between a receiver, an amplifier, and a pre-amplifier?

2) do DVD players play CDs as well as CD players? (i've been comparing this Cambridge Audio CD player to a Pioneer Elite DVD player) if they do then i'd probably want a DVD/CD player than just a CD player to cut costs down..

3) A lot of reviewers have commented that the Digitheatre DTS actually performs just as well as ~$1000 stereo systems. If this is the case, then i might as well move my Digitheatre to the TV and get some Klipsch 5.1's or something else for my computer~

I've also been looking at a few pairs of bookshelf speakers that some magazines have commented to sound very much like pairs of speakers that cost $5000+. (Wharfdale Diamond 8.1 Spakers, Sound Dynamics RTS-3) If they do sound this good then I guess i could tag along a nice subwoofer and a nice receiver and a nice CD player... however totalling costs for that goes into the ~$1000+ range. I have yet to come across a "recommended" receiver for ~$200.

 

[Tiberius]

1) In a nutshell, AV receivers are amplifiers with extra features, many of which are essential nowdays. Pre-amplifiers don't fit into your budget, so no point discussing them, since you're going to need a receiver.
2) All DVD players play CDs, and most can handle CD-Rs and CD-RWs as well. More and more are starting to support MP3 CDs as well. However, CDs apparently sound better when played on a CD player than a DVD player. Once again though, this isn't a quality difference you'd notice on a 1000-dollar audio system, so a DVD player should work fine for you.
3) I don't know what reviewer told you that, but he was lying. I have never heard this system myself, but from looking at the specs, it's laughable. Any and all systems that come pre-packaged with miniature receivers are trash, with no exceptions. This system isn't good enough for your main setup, but it's overkill for the PC. About half of what you paid for it is for that miniature receiver, and it won't even be used unless you watch DVDs on your PC. It would be your best bet to sell it off on eBay and buy a Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 system if you don't play games, or the 5.1 if you do.

Now, if you only have $1100 to work with, i imagine you won't exactly have a myriad of systems to choose from. There is only a handful of systems that are usually recommended for your budget, the most popular by far being the Energy Take 5.2. This system is extremely popular, and for a good reason - it sounds great. If you can afford it, upgrade to the 10" sub from the stock 8", but that'll cost you a bundle. If not, you should be able to pick these up stock for around $550USD on eBay.

Of course, this system doesn't come packaged with a crappy receiver, so you're going to have to buy one separately. My personal favorite in this price range is the Denon AVR-1802 because i own it's bigger brother, the AVR-3802. The 1802 can be purchased on eBay for around $350, and is worth every penny - you'll know what i mean when you first listen to it. I have no regrets about buying my 3802, and it set me back for $900.

So that leaves you a few hundred bucks for the DVD player - just enough to get a pretty good one. I would recommend the Toshiba SD2800, which usually goes for around $150USD on eBay. If your box is an HDTV, be sure to go for the Toshiba SD3800 because it has progressive scan.

The components recommended above are truly great - after spending months researching, i decided to buy these myself several months ago. But then decided to double my home theater budget and go with other components instead. A few words of caution though: beware of systems that come packaged with receivers. Beware of brands like SONY or Panasonic, or any brand that every consumer knows and loves thanks to their gigantic ad campaigns. Beware of anything written in home theater magasines. Beware of any advise given to you by people who aren't real audiophiles. Beware of home theater store salesmen. If you want real, good advise, from real professionals, the place to get it is AVSForum.

 

[Nighthawk69]

For the receiver, I'd go with something from Denon.
For the DVD I'd go with a Toshiba.
For the speakers on your budget I second the Energy lineup. I personally like Klipsch best and it's all I own, but it's very expensive for their good stuff. We paid $1000 per speaker for the fronts in our setup. But the Energy's are second to the Klipsch in my book for home theater.


Basically I agree with what the previous poster said.

 

[glen]

Reciever Pioneer
Speakers PSB or Paradigm

 

[NewSc2]

Tiberus: here's the review AnandTech VideoLogic DigiTheatre DTS Review

Thanks a lot for all the good comments, the Energy Take 5.2's have been mentioned a lot, and i'll look into it. I don't really like Klipschs much, my roommate has the Klipsch 4.1's and I don't really like the sound. It plays hip hop/techno very well, but that's not what I listen to.

There are also a few other reviews, namely 3dss.com and some on neoseeker audiophile forums that state the same thing. *shrug*

 

[Tiberius]

Actually, glen is right. I own some Paradigm Monitors myself and i can vouch for their quality. I didn't think you'd be able to fit anything from Paradigm into your budget, but after checking out their site, i think you might. You could grab two pairs of Atoms for fronts and rears, and a CC-170 for center. That will cost around $450 on eBay.

Of course, you'll also need a subwoofer, but that shouldn't be a problem. You'll have to stretch your budget out by an extra hundred or two to get a good subwoofer, but it will be well worth it, i promise. Head to AVSForum for subwoofer recommendations, as the cheapest good sub i can think of off the top of my head is the Hsu Research VTF-2, which goes for around $450 on eBay.

I'm not sure what to say about Digitheatre DTS - i searched AVS, HTF, AudioReview and ComputingReview, and didn't find a single review of the system. In my experience, there's never been a time when i searched for something i knew to be good and didn't find dozens of reviews of it. I've looked through the pages of the AnandTech review and saw nothing that justified the "Ferrarri of Sound" label they've given it. I have no doubt that it's one hell of a computer system, since Videologic is known for making good computer speakers, but it would make a really poor home theater setup, especially when compared to something from companies like Energy, Klipsch, PSB or Paradigm. Which is why i said that it's too good (read: too expensive) for the computer system, and not good enough for the main system.

 

[NewSc2]

hm.. i c, thanks for explaining Tiberius.

Also, one last question: what usually distinguishes the brand names of Energy, Paradigm, JBL, and others? i know of Klipsch's special sound, but besides that, i haven't read much about the other brands. Is there any rule of thumb, that if i listen to more classical, i would be better off with ____ or if i listen to more rock, i should be considering ___ speakers?

or do they all generally sound the same. thanks!

 

[EvilYoda]

They don't all sound the same, but whether a certain company's speakers are better for a certain type of music.........doesn't work that way. It all just depends on how they sound to you. I personally just spent $950 this summer (got a great deal) on a pair of Paradigm Monitor 9s (in rosenut!) and a Harman Kardon 320 receiver.

But, I assume that you're looking for full surround sound from the get-go? One set that people will suggest is the Paradigm Atoms/Titan, and just put those all around. As for a receiver, to keep the price down and specs up, you might want to consider the Pioneer 811 which is said to be a very good budget receiver. The Wharfedale's that you spoke of would be a good suggestion as well.

With such a blank slate, there are so many suggestions. Maybe you should decide on how much for a receiver, how much for speakers, and whatnot.

 

[NuclearFusi0n]

you good with a table saw and got a few free weekends? Build your own speakers
You'll spank the crap out of any commericial offerings at the same price. LMK if you want more info.

 

[Tiberius]

Also, one last question: what usually distinguishes the brand names of Energy, Paradigm, JBL, and others? i know of Klipsch's special sound, but besides that, i haven't read much about the other brands. Is there any rule of thumb, that if i listen to more classical, i would be better off with ____ or if i listen to more rock, i should be considering ___ speakers?

It doesn't really work that way. Just listen to a few different sets of speakers decide which one sounds better to you. You gotta do it right though, or the salesmen will trick you into buying what they want you to buy. In order to really tell which set of speakers sounds better to you, you have to make sure that the only variable is the set of speakers. In order words, the room, placement, player, receiver, recording and volume must remain exactly the same. Which can be a pain in the ass, but you should either do it right or not do it at all. Speaking of which, if you don't feel like going out and auditioning speakers, just go with the Paradigm package i recommended, or PSB's equivalent of that package. You will be extremely happy with either of them, no question about it.

Once again, ask the folks over at AVSForum for subwoofer recommendations, but you'll have to give them a budget to work with first. So find out how much everything else is going to cost first, and then figure out how much you can afford to spend on the subwoofer. I ended up buying better components and not buying the sub immediately because i couldn't afford to buy it all at the same time. Without a doubt, 9/10 people at AVS will tell you that SVS builds the best damn subs in the world, and that's why you should consider doing what i did and waiting until you can afford to buy an SVS - they start at $500USD. Quality comes at a price. I'm hopefully buying this one in a couple of days. It's a non-powered version, so it also requires a 150-dollar amp to work.

Another thing you have to remember is that everything will cost more if you buy retail. You will save a lot of money by buying your hardware from eBay or online retailers, but you will also take a risk, since some manufacturers, such as Denon, won't honor the warranty unless you purchased from an authorized dealer. I decided to buy my receiver online and saved about 25%. To hell with the warranty, if anything breaks, it can't possibly cost that much anyway.

 

[NewSc2]

thanks for the AVSforum tip, i'm going right now to check it out (i must've skimmed over it in your first post). I eBay a lot, so i'm looking to buy most my components on eBay.

I'm really not very picky in the very very minute details of an audio system right now, simply because i don't have a good enough TV to complete the whole experience and because of my budget. Hopefully later on when i can afford $5k+ then i'll really pay attention to the details and audition speakers. Right now the system I'm trying to put together I want to last for about 5-10 years (i'm in the middle of my college years right now ). Thanks for the inputs Nighthawk, Glen, and EvilYoda. And NuclearFusi0n1, i might look into building speakers later on as a hobby, just not yet .

 

[Tiberius]

Don't forget to let us know what you end up getting!

 

[NewSc2]

Tiberius, i think you directed me into the wrong forum , everybody there seems to have fallen in love with the Divas by Swans. I myself am seriously considering a pair, and if i can scrounge enough money, I'm going to try and pair up the Diva Swans 4.1 with perhaps a HSU VTF-2 and a Denon 1802. ($700+$350+$350) This is slightly outside of my range, but perhaps mom or dad can chip in a couple hundred bucks =\ or i might start selling off some extra things I have lying around.

The Diva 4.1's overall have gotten rave reviews from near everybody who's talked about it on this forum and on a few other places i've checked up, and I really like their 30-day trial policy. (of course shipping costs might ruin that policy, but it's a nice thing to have)

*Argh just checked they have this sale going on: buy Diva 4.1 and Diva C3 Center Channel, and they'll throw in Diva 2.1's for free...."

okay well that is sort of out of my price bracket~ (^@$*(&!*(%$&@#$%^!).

Well, for the first configuration I had, I was thinking that i could go along with that for a while, and use my xBox as a DVD/CD player for a few months until Xmas or whatnot. It looks like a decent system to upgrade on, adding in surround sound, center channel, and amplifier when the need arises and when I save up enough. Okay, but the thing with the newest deal sounds really good, because the Diva 2.1's go for $399 a pair. (maybe i could buy the set and auction off the 2.1's.. hm..)

But anyways I had a question, and the AVSForum seems really slow. Not sure if any other Audiophiles are still hanging around ATOT at this hour, but would using the 4.1's without a subwoofer completely lack real bass? Would I be better off with a cheapie Subwoofer from Fry's for ~$100 for the time being?

Also any opinions on the small set i've configured would be great

 

[NuclearFusi0n]

dude, with a moderate budget like yours, DIY would be right up your alley

 

[NewSc2]

haha okay, YGPM, i'm open to all suggestions and i haven't had many reads into DIY so if you could point me in a few directions I suppose I'll look into that too.

 

[Tiberius]

Let's continue this on AVS. Read my reply there.

 

[Goi]

I second the DIY suggesion. Check out Adire Audio and Madisound kits. I've also heard extremely good things about GR-Research DIY kits. These supposedly beat speakers in the thousands of dollars.

 

[ATLien247]

Originally posted by: NuclearFusi0n1
dude, with a moderate budget like yours, DIY would be right up your alley

Only if he has access to a decent woodshop... or has all of the tools he needs already.

 

[Tiberius]

Most large hardware stores have a money-back guarantee on tools. If you're a Ferengi like myself, you can just buy, use and return.

 

[kherman]

Speaking from experience:

If you're renting an appartment, maybe you should save your money to buy a house or condo. Or invest your money.