Tmobile calls out the iPhone 4

[shortylickens]

Wheres Catherine Zeta?

 

[Pliablemoose]

Oh dear. The Iphone going to verizon won't change a thing. The hype on the iphone is dying down tremendously. Android is the new hot thing. Even so, people who wanted the Iphone already have it. I don't think opening it on verizon is going to steal many T-Mobile customers.

As for compelling products. Well there is really only one phone that you could say is compelling and on one carrier, that's the Iphone. Sprint, Verizon and T-Mobile don't fall into that category. That said, T-Mobile has the largest android lineup (the hottest OS right now) as well as a good host of other high quality phones.

1.) You're contradicting yourself.
2.) Did you watch the ad? You need to watch it again and think about what you're typing.

TMobile's crappy coverage makes Google navigation nearly useless for a road trip, do you expect people to war drive to use Google navigation?

I was with TMobile for 10 years, I can't tell you how many times people on the other end asked me what was wrong with my phone because of the poor signal, and spending 10 minutes navigating open WiFi networks, splash screens, TOS agreements, and the myriad of other issues that crop up with UMA isn't my idea of having a useful device to make phone calls with.

 

[rudeguy]

Wheres Catherine Zeta?

I forgot about that.

We need spandex cat suits....STAT!

 

[Cuda1447]

First let me say that I am a long-time fan of T-Mobile. I love their customer service people - and their prices.

But I have to disagree with some of what you wrote.

While T-Mobile's bandwidth is theoretically higher, it's real-world data rates have been shown to be slower in multiple published tests. Consumer Reports, Gizmodo, PC World - they show AT&T as having the highest real-world bandwidth.
http://gizmodo.com/5428343/our-2009-12+city-3g-data-mega-test-att-won
http://www.pcworld.com/article/1895...rlds_second_3g_wireless_performance_test.html

If you have more recent data showing T-Mobile trumping everyone in the real world from a respected source, then I'd love to see it.

While it's technically true that neither LTE nor WiMax are truly 4G technologies, they are both very close to the final 4G specification requirements and the final specification requirements will be designed to be backwards compatible with LTE that's being currently deployed. So while it's true that LTE isn't 4G, saying that HSPA+ is 4G is a significant stretch of the truth. You can say that one marketing lie is the same as another but I don't think it is. LTE and WiMax are very close to the final 4G spec - they are extremely close and basically failed on technicalities (can't scale to 40MHz bandwidth, and their local wireless data rates don't meet spec, are two... but they are close).. But the protocol will remain the same. Meanwhile HSPA+ is a souped up 3G spec and has no hope of coming close to the 4G requirements..

Both the articles you quoted are from a long time ago. One is from 2009, the other is from February of this year, nearly a year ago. T-Mobile didn't have their HSPA+ network going at this time. Look for any article for the last month or two regarding speed tests and you will see T-Mobile is #1. I'd pull one up for you but don't have the time right now.


In real world application, in HSPA+ cities, the G2 and Mytouch HD as well as the Rocket are getting on average about 6-7 MBPS and I've seen as high as 10. That is way faster than anything else anyone is getting.

 

[Cuda1447]

1.) You're contradicting yourself.
2.) Did you watch the ad? You need to watch it again and think about what you're typing.

TMobile's crappy coverage makes Google navigation nearly useless for a road trip, do you expect people to war drive to use Google navigation?

I was with TMobile for 10 years, I can't tell you how many times people on the other end asked me what was wrong with my phone because of the poor signal, and spending 10 minutes navigating open WiFi networks, splash screens, TOS agreements, and the myriad of other issues that crop up with UMA isn't my idea of having a useful device to make phone calls with.

I don't think I contradicted myself at all. There is only one compelling cell phone because it is really the only unique exclusive phone on a carrier. That said, I don't think it will change anything by going to verizon, as most people who want it already have it.


As for GPS being useless.... well if you lose service, than sure. I won't sit here and tell you that T-Mobile has the largest footprint, we both know they dont. *shrugs*

If you travel around the country a lot, T-Mobile probably isn't for you. But for most people that's not an issue.


And what myriad of issues crop up with UMA? The first UMA-lite Android phone was just released a few days ago. You've already tested it enough to know the issues that will crop up?

 

[Deeko]

Its not really T-Mobile attacking the iPhone, its really T-Mobile attacking AT&T. They're basically saying "yea, they've got the iPhone, and its cool and all, but its weighed down by that crappy network"

pm - AT&T typically won the speed tests last year, but that was before Spring starting selling Wimax and T-Mobile started their HSPA+ network. Having owned an Epic 4G and a HD2 (which isn't fully HSPA+ ready like the G2), I can tell you that in this area at least, with full signal, T-Mobile is faster than Sprint, and both are faster than AT&T right now.

 

[Deeko]

TMobile's crappy coverage makes Google navigation nearly useless for a road trip, do you expect people to war drive to use Google navigation?

I've had T-Mobile since 2002 and I use it for road trips all the time. I drove across the country using T-Mobile/GPS, I've used it to go to various places in the sticks here in Washington/Oregon, as well as most of the northeast.

If you're in an area where T-Mobile has no coverage, you can often roam on someone else (like AT&T). No one has rural coverage like Verizon does, but its ridiculous to say you can't use T-Mobile for a road trip.

On top of the fact that Google loads the directions at the beginning, so even if you're out of service, it will still tell you when to turn...

 

[Pliablemoose]

I've had T-Mobile since 2002 and I use it for road trips all the time. I drove across the country using T-Mobile/GPS, I've used it to go to various places in the sticks here in Washington/Oregon, as well as most of the northeast.

If you're in an area where T-Mobile has no coverage, you can often roam on someone else (like AT&T). No one has rural coverage like Verizon does, but its ridiculous to say you can't use T-Mobile for a road trip.

On top of the fact that Google loads the directions at the beginning, so even if you're out of service, it will still tell you when to turn...

I've had considerably worse experiences, unfortunately, and I've had the GPS just freeze up because of no data in the hills around LA

Again, don't get me wrong, I LOVED TMobile, but when I threw in the no reception at work and the discounted plans through my employer and realized that of all the phones I have, the HD2 was by far my favorite, (only with Android hacked onto it), the choice was pretty simple.

 

[Deeko]

Odd. I haven't had that happen.

I do think with T-Mobile its more "luck of the draw" than with other carriers. That's part of why they're cheaper. However, if you are in an area with decent HSPA+ coverage, T-Mobile is fantastic.

 

[abaez]

While it's technically true that neither LTE nor WiMax are truly 4G technologies, they are both very close to the final 4G specification requirements and the final specification requirements will be designed to be backwards compatible with LTE that's being currently deployed. So while it's true that LTE isn't 4G, saying that HSPA+ is 4G is a significant stretch of the truth. You can say that one marketing lie is the same as another but I don't think it is. LTE and WiMax are very close to the final 4G spec - they are extremely close and basically failed on technicalities (can't scale to 40MHz bandwidth, and their local wireless data rates don't meet spec, are two... but they are close).. But the protocol will remain the same. Meanwhile HSPA+ is a souped up 3G spec and has no hope of coming close to the 4G requirements..

FWIW, now that the 4G spec has officially been released, none of the carriers saying they have 4G actually have 4G. You can read more about it here: http://www.bgr.com/2010/11/03/the-4g-forgery/

for a service to qualify as 4G, it must deliver peak download speeds of approximately 100Mbps in high-mobility environments (cell phones) and peak download speeds of approximately 1Gbps in low-mobility environments.

So right now all of the carriers are engaging in false advertising/marketing. Not that this has stopped them before ("unlimited" plans), but until they get sued I guess it won't get changed since they've already spent billions on marketing this fake "4G" service.

 

[Patranus]

Oh dear. The Iphone going to verizon won't change a thing. The hype on the iphone is dying down tremendously. Android is the new hot thing. Even so, people who wanted the Iphone already have it. I don't think opening it on verizon is going to steal many T-Mobile customers.

Android is an OS, the iPhone is (well) a phone.

How exactly is the iPhone hype "dying down tremendously" when Apple just climbed into the #4 overall spot of phone manufacturers?

 

[pm]

Both the articles you quoted are from a long time ago. One is from 2009, the other is from February of this year, nearly a year ago. T-Mobile didn't have their HSPA+ network going at this time. Look for any article for the last month or two regarding speed tests and you will see T-Mobile is #1. I'd pull one up for you but don't have the time right now.


In real world application, in HSPA+ cities, the G2 and Mytouch HD as well as the Rocket are getting on average about 6-7 MBPS and I've seen as high as 10. That is way faster than anything else anyone is getting.

I agree, the reports are old and things move somewhat quickly in the cell phone market, but... I haven't seen anything more recent to refute them beyond anecdotal evidence.

If you have anything more recent, I would like to see it.

 

[Deeko]

I agree, the reports are old and things move somewhat quickly in the cell phone market, but... I haven't seen anything more recent to refute them beyond anecdotal evidence.

If you have anything more recent, I would like to see it.

http://www.phonescoop.com/articles/article.php?a=376&p=2705

 

[Pliablemoose]

And what myriad of issues crop up with UMA? The first UMA-lite Android phone was just released a few days ago. You've already tested it enough to know the issues that will crop up?

I've had/used a TMobile UMA capable BB for over a year, and I read the thread on XDA Developers about the issues with Android UMA, they should iron out quite a bit with a few revisions, but the fact remains, you need to navigate splash screens, agree to TOS, etc etc.

How long have you been using UMA?

 

[Cuda1447]

I've had/used a TMobile UMA capable BB for over a year, and I read the thread on XDA Developers about the issues with Android UMA, they should iron out quite a bit with a few revisions, but the fact remains, you need to navigate splash screens, agree to TOS, etc etc.

How long have you been using UMA?

I had full UMA on my blackberries years ago as well. On android I've been using it for a couple of weeks on the Mytouch 4G as well as the motorola defy. It has been working just fine for me.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

First of all, T-Mobile's HSPA+ is 3G. They call it 4G here, but the rest of the world has been upgrading to 7.2, 14.4, 21mbps HSPA already. It's all 3G. Some places are upgrading to 42mbps too. It's fucking 3G.

But like people said, who cares? IF it's just as fast as 4G technologies, then I don't care. This is what I've been saying from the beginning. Sprint and VZW MUST upgrade to 4G technologies because EVDO-Rev A maxes out around 3mbps. IF you want to compete against HSDPA, you must upgrade your network. Since they refuse to move to Rev B, 4G LTE/WiMAX is the only choice.

So while AT&T and T-Mobile and GSM carriers around the world can continue beefing up their 3G tech, the CDMA carriers must go to 4G. This is purely marketing as initial 4G speeds aren't even that fast. I'd say there will be roughly equivalent speeds between upgraded 3G and the 4G rolled out by Sprint and VZW. So instead of bashing the carriers for failing to roll out 4G (I know a lot of people hate AT&T and laugh at them for this), but realize that the rest of the world is happy with their HSPA speeds and that a full LTE rollout won't be done til at LEAST 2011 if not 2012. This is the same argument that an LTE iPhone probably won't hit till 2012.

Android is an OS, the iPhone is (well) a phone.

How exactly is the iPhone hype "dying down tremendously" when Apple just climbed into the #4 overall spot of phone manufacturers?

This. People only think Android is exploding because no other carriers in the US offer the iPhone. News check. The iPhone has been working on all networks around the world for sometime now. So because the iPhone is exclusive in the US, your only other choice is Android, meaning any new phone = iPhone dying down. LOL.

 

[Cuda1447]

This. People only think Android is exploding because no other carriers in the US offer the iPhone. News check. The iPhone has been working on all networks around the world for sometime now. So because the iPhone is exclusive in the US, your only other choice is Android, meaning any new phone = iPhone dying down. LOL.

Read any report that's come out in the last 6 months. Android is growing in every category imagineable. Iphone is still strong, but its mostly stagnant or showing minimal growth. Android is growing at a very rapid pace by comparison. By almost any account, Android is the hot OS right now and by a good amount. But this thread isn't about Android or IOS, so let's just leave this argument alone. We know how it will turn out.

 

[Pliablemoose]

I had full UMA on my blackberries years ago as well. On android I've been using it for a couple of weeks on the Mytouch 4G as well as the motorola defy. It has been working just fine for me.

Interesting, especially since the update yesterday was the first implementation of uma on the Android platform.

Hmmm, care to explain how you're the only person on the planet to have uma on an Android phone for weeks ? And that you've had a Defy for weeks?


**Bullshit cough cough **

 

[Cuda1447]

Interesting, especially since the update yesterday was the first implementation of uma on the Android platform.

Hmmm, care to explain how you're the only person on the planet to have uma on an Android phone for weeks ? And that you've had a Defy for weeks?


**Bullshit cough cough **

Yea, sure. I work for T-Mobile, asshole.

 

[Cuda1447]

Interesting, especially since the update yesterday was the first implementation of uma on the Android platform.

Hmmm, care to explain how you're the only person on the planet to have uma on an Android phone for weeks ? And that you've had a Defy for weeks?


**Bullshit cough cough **

Oh and the update yesterday was for the G2. The Mytouch 4G and Defy had it preloaded on the phone.

 

[JS80]

ATT and T-mo are both the same trash on trash GSM. My dad used to have T-mo...I don't think I've ever had a conversation with him where the phone didn't cut off.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Oh and the update yesterday was for the G2. The Mytouch 4G and Defy had it preloaded on the phone.

And you've had a Defy and a My Touch with uma for weeks?

 

[Cuda1447]

And you've had a Defy and a My Touch with uma for weeks?

About two weeks, yep. I get quite a few phones prior to release.

 

[Pliablemoose]

T-Mobile blames its poor performance on lack of iPhone

By Daniel Eran Dilger
Published: 07:15 PM EST

​

Germany's Deutsche Telekom AG reported profits that beat expectations, but blamed poor performance in its American T-Mobile business upon its inability to sell the iPhone.

"The U.S. used to be a cash cow for Deutsche Telekom," reports the Wall Street Journal, "but it has struggled there since 2008 and has been forced to invest more to keep existing customers and attract new ones."

The report said TMobile "gained 137,000 customers in the September quarter driven by wholesale growth in the prepaid business, bringing its subscriber base to 33.76 million, but the number of more valuable contract customers fell by 60,000 to 26.69 million."

No chance of getting the iPhone in the short term

Chief Executive Rene Obermann said T-Mobile's churn rate in the U.S. is being driven by the iPhone. "Consumers like T-Mobile but they also want to have the iPhone," which T-Mobile USA "has no chance of getting in the short term," the report said.

In Europe, Deutsche Telekom was an early, exclusive partner with Apple in selling the iPhone, but has recently lost its exclusive status as Apple added other carriers.

In the US however, the firm's T-Mobile business can't sell Apple's existing iPhone models at all; even though T-Mobile is, like AT&T, a GSM/UMTS carrier, it uses unique radio frequencies for its 3G service that are not compatible with existing iPhones.

Greater iPhone threat on the horizon

Apple is widely reported to be introducing a new CDMA-compatible iPhone in early 2011 that can be sold by Verizon Wireless, a move that will put even more pressure on T-Mobile.

"Judging by Apple's experience in other markets," the report stated, "adding Verizon could double iPhone's U.S. smartphone market share. In France, for instance, iPhone's market share tripled from 3% to 11% between the first and third quarters of 2009, after Apple went from one carrier to three, says Strategy Analytics. The firm's global wireless practice director, Neil Mawston, says markets like the U.K. have shown a similar pattern."​

http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20101104-715290.html

So the CEO of DT agrees with me Cuda1447, guess you two will have to agree to disagree

 

[GTaudiophile]

I have been with TMO since 2003...and I am a very satisfied and loyal customer.

I travel all over the USA and Europe on business and only had a a coverage problem until a few weeks ago when attending a conference in Williamsburg, VA.

I have never had a single billing problem.

Customer Service in-store and on-phone/online has always been TOP NOTCH!

I get great international calling rates and even better (seamless) international roaming.

The iPhone is not worth enough to me to switch away from TMO. I won't have a problem using a Android- or WM7-based phone when the time comes.