tips on buying an engagement ring

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preslove

Lifer
Sep 10, 2003
16,754
64
91
The problem with lab created diamonds is that the lab owners don't want to flood the market with cheap diamonds, but instead market them as perfect stones (lab created diamonds have no inclusions), so they sell them for less than mined perfect diamonds, but more than lower quality mined diamonds.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Lab created stones aren't fake. That's like saying lab created water is fake. That's like saying salt created in the lab is fake salt. They're literally the exact same thing. Fake rolexes have inferior parts, don't last as long etc etc.
Lab created diamonds are the same as diamonds from the ground.

The ONLY value that diamonds have is that society says it does. The amount that a diamond cost should not be a factor in the strength of your relationship.

Fake real gold Rolex argument would be more suitable, many fake Rolex' have as good or better parts.

Fake hymen / vaginal rejuve argument. Think you took her virginity? It's going to be hard to tell otherwise now.

If you don't want to participate in the symbol of marriage for most of us, pick something else.

Most of use like rarity...which is probably the reason most above play video games to get those rare drops yet can do so in real life.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
The problem with lab created diamonds is that the lab owners don't want to flood the market with cheap diamonds, but instead market them as perfect stones (lab created diamonds have no inclusions), so they sell them for less than mined perfect diamonds, but more than lower quality mined diamonds.

That's now making the simulant people DeBeers.

They simply can't keep up.

Not all diamonds are worth anything. Same with other precious items like pearls and the like.

This all really comes down to the "designer denim" vs "Wranglers" and in the end it's about finances for some, but not even being in the game to start for most.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
$790.

Good luck finding a comparable emerald cut stone on price scope for anything close to that.

To me at $1500 at the top price it would be worth it.

To you, maybe that was how far you can go.

I am not hating you, I hope you and her are happy and going to be together to the end (unless that was not your agreement).

My cellular service was nearly $600 the last two months for a total of $1200.

Personally, for the woman I love I'd like to make a bigger sacrifice. Maybe it's retarded and a waste of money...I don't want fakes. I understand the science in it. I went through all the science stuff one could imagine in college. BIOCHEM AND BEYOND! (lol)

I wish this was in L&R to talk more about it. I am thinking most here just keep seeding posts.
 

preslove

Lifer
Sep 10, 2003
16,754
64
91
So, now I'm considering getting an art deco vintage ring off of etsy. Any advice on vintage rings?

That's now making the simulant people DeBeers.

They simply can't keep up.

Not all diamonds are worth anything. Same with other precious items like pearls and the like.

This all really comes down to the "designer denim" vs "Wranglers" and in the end it's about finances for some, but not even being in the game to start for most.

Lab created |= simulant.

Lab created gems are of perfect clarity and color because they don't have inclusions and the colors can be controlled in the lab. The market is smaller for rubies sapphires, so lab created gems of those type are cheaper than all mined ones, but since the market is so big for diamonds, the diamond makers restrict supply and charge more than diamonds of inferior clarity.
 
Oct 25, 2006
11,036
11
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I think what alkymest is arguing is simple.

Spending Money = Sacrifice
Sacrifice = Love
Thus
Spending Money = Love
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
So, now I'm considering getting an art deco vintage ring off of etsy. Any advice on vintage rings?



Lab created |= simulant.

Lab created gems are of perfect clarity and color because they don't have inclusions and the colors can be controlled in the lab. The market is smaller for rubies sapphires, so lab created gems of those type are cheaper than all mined ones, but since the market is so big for diamonds, the diamond makers restrict supply and charge more than diamonds of inferior clarity.

Why do it if you have no skin in the game?
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
I think what alkymest is arguing is simple.

Spending Money = Sacrifice
Sacrifice = Love
Thus
Spending Money = Love

I have done more, my girl has no ring (well a $400 one as a symbol).

I can't talk about it here.

BTW, just spell my name right, you can reach over and copy and paste it.

Clearly you are an idiot.

Spending money is a sacrifice.

It's not sexual love.
 

SP33Demon

Lifer
Jun 22, 2001
27,928
143
106
A woman doesn't have to know if it's real or lab created. What I'm more concerned about is the cut, and the lab created ones just don't have the branded cuts nor skill since it's such a small market. To me, cut is the most important aspect. If you can find me a specially cut lab diamond, that would be the ideal when looking for best bang for your buck. It's like when Apple computers sucked and you wanted to buy one but they didn't have the best games, Windows did, so you had to go with Windows.
 

Insomniator

Diamond Member
Oct 23, 2002
6,294
171
106
A woman doesn't have to know if it's real or lab created.

Missing the point again. She's going to assume its 'real', so are you going to lie to her when she asks if you spent 1k on lab vs 10k on real? If you don't think real diamonds mean anything (which is reasonable) then why even bother going the fake/lab route? That means you must care in SOME way.

No one's arguing that real diamonds are actually worth what they cost, but if you happen to have a girl that grew up dreaming about one then that could be worth it to you. If this is the case, then the lab created is not a substitute, unless maybe she is a chemist and actually cares about the structure of the gem.
And if your girl doesn't care about a nice ring, good for you. If you say you're waiting to find one that isn't so petty then good freakin luck.
 

Sonikku

Lifer
Jun 23, 2005
15,911
4,945
136
It's funny how so many retailers that sold jewelry were selling them "75-90% off". And they were doing it ALL the time. And they were STILL overpriced! XD I'd sure hate to see what they go for when they aren't on "sale". >.<
 

preslove

Lifer
Sep 10, 2003
16,754
64
91
Why do it if you have no skin in the game?

Because I'd rather spend less than $1000 on a ring, not go into debt, and spend the money on wedding/honeymoon, and jewelry later.

Edit: Also, those art deco rings look really cool and unique. I prefer the gold filigree to just some sparkly rock.
 
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SP33Demon

Lifer
Jun 22, 2001
27,928
143
106
Missing the point again. She's going to assume its 'real', so are you going to lie to her when she asks if you spent 1k on lab vs 10k on real? If you don't think real diamonds mean anything (which is reasonable) then why even bother going the fake/lab route? That means you must care in SOME way.

No one's arguing that real diamonds are actually worth what they cost, but if you happen to have a girl that grew up dreaming about one then that could be worth it to you. If this is the case, then the lab created is not a substitute, unless maybe she is a chemist and actually cares about the structure of the gem.
And if your girl doesn't care about a nice ring, good for you. If you say you're waiting to find one that isn't so petty then good freakin luck.

You're missing the point. Anyone who is in the know will tell you that an amazing quality cut (e.g. one that scores straight 10's on GemEx's Brilliance Scope) will make up for even an SI2 diamond so the money is actually going into the cut, not necessarily the type of diamond. You're still paying thousands upon thousands for a brand name cut, so the actual diamond doesn't matter - only in the sense that it's a diamond. She's not going to give a shit where the diamond came from, especially one with a branded cut and I've even seen very reputable branded cuts at Jared's with questionable paperwork (IGI certs). Why? Because the cut makes up for a shitty stone, so Jared is maximizing their profits but putting a $5K cut on a subpar I-SI2 $2K diamond and then selling it for $12K. In the end, the girl is still getting the shiniest rock in the world (yes, shinier than 99% of her friends who went the costco route) since it has the best cut in the world, diamond quality be damned.

So back to my original point, if you could get a branded cut on a lab rock then that would most definitely be the best bang for your buck. The sucky thing is that unless you know someone who can do these cuts, you're still paying the markup to the person who got the rock cut. Therein lies the profit (on a shitty rock after the cut) for the guy who is hooked up with cutters. It'd be nice if we could just call a reputable diamond cutter in the phone book who was trained to do xyz cut but the industry has it locked down so this would never happen.

When the rubber meets the road, light reflection is the be all end all of diamonds because it's all women can see when they're with their friends, not carats, not cert, not natural vs lab, etc. Only performance.
 
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RearAdmiral

Platinum Member
Jun 24, 2004
2,280
135
106
Way too many opinions on this. It's too easy to get overwhelmed. Go with what you believe is right in your relationship dynamic.

The only tip is to take your time.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
A woman doesn't have to know if it's real or lab created. What I'm more concerned about is the cut, and the lab created ones just don't have the branded cuts nor skill since it's such a small market. To me, cut is the most important aspect. If you can find me a specially cut lab diamond, that would be the ideal when looking for best bang for your buck. It's like when Apple computers sucked and you wanted to buy one but they didn't have the best games, Windows did, so you had to go with Windows.

Wow...start a marriage off with a lie.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Because I'd rather spend less than $1000 on a ring, not go into debt, and spend the money on wedding/honeymoon, and jewelry later.

Edit: Also, those art deco rings look really cool and unique. I prefer the gold filigree to just some sparkly rock.

The thing is one should not be going into debt for an engagement ring.

People here seem to have no problem spending a couple grand on a rig.
 

Babbles

Diamond Member
Jan 4, 2001
8,253
14
81
I think people tend to forget that the utility of the diamond is not the value of the carbon itself, nor even the labor to cut it, but the social utility one gets from scarcity. Obviously we can moan and groan about DeBeers creating artificial scarcity, but it's a moot point: scarcity exists. Therefore when you get a lab created diamond, you are acquiring a product that by it's definition has different social utility; it's not playing in the scarcity 'marketplace' if you will. This makes it fundamentally a different product.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
I think people tend to forget that the utility of the diamond is not the value of the carbon itself, nor even the labor to cut it, but the social utility one gets from scarcity. Obviously we can moan and groan about DeBeers creating artificial scarcity, but it's a moot point: scarcity exists. Therefore when you get a lab created diamond, you are acquiring a product that by it's definition has different social utility; it's not playing in the scarcity 'marketplace' if you will. This makes it fundamentally a different product.

It's just like most women feel the same when the lights are out. When the lights are on we want others to like what we got.
 

SP33Demon

Lifer
Jun 22, 2001
27,928
143
106
Wow...start a marriage off with a lie.

A sparkly diamond is a sparkly diamond. She doesn't have to know where the fuck it came from, that has nothing to do with lying to her just being smart with what you tell her. If she does want to know, then you probably picked a lemon for a wife. She should feel lucky to get anything from you if she really loves you.
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
12
76
I think what alkymest is arguing is simple.

Spending Money = Sacrifice
Sacrifice = Love
Thus
Spending Money = Love

I think the reality is some people recognize that they're already betting an enormous amount of money on black in the game of marriage\divorce roulette, and alkymest is telling them to put down even more.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
A sparkly diamond is a sparkly diamond. She doesn't have to know where the fuck it came from, that has nothing to do with lying to her just being smart with what you tell her. If she does want to know, then you probably picked a lemon for a wife. She should feel lucky to get anything from you if she really loves you.

lol, ok, bro...seriously ok.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
I think the reality is some people recognize that they're already betting an enormous amount of money on black in the game of marriage\divorce roulette, and alkymest is telling them to put down even more.

If one cannot see the value in spending what their computer or a set of tires runs on their sports car for a proper engagement ring they probably shouldn't be in the dating arena to begin with.

I don't encourage anyone to go into debt over a ring nor do I believe the 2 months salary scales well (hell DeBeers tried to encourage 3 months salary at one point).

For most $1000-2000 would be a high budget, for many $5000 or so about right, and others $10-20k.

Really going over this in size is for those with a ton of money.

Certain numbers mean a lot to my fiancee and so I am targeting a .87 carat round G or better and excellent cut / H&A.

I should be able to get buy at $6k or go for a D / FL around $12k