Time to raise the gasoline Tax?

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: techs

Originally posted by: Brovane

Originally posted by: techs
Yes. New oil and energy development projects are being killed in the U.S. since the projects need a certain price of oil to be profitable.
If oil had a tax supported bottom of say, 65 per barrel, these projects wouldn't be cancelled and many more would started. This would provide the US energy security while the US consumer would still spend far less for a gallon of gas than anyone else in the First world.

I agree whole heartily with that. Some of the projects like deep water drilling and oil shale require oil to be above a certain level in order for them to make economic sense.

Some people think there could be up to 200 BILLION barrels of oil in the Bakken formation in Montana and South Dakota.
Buh bye, OPEC.

I was talking to an engineer last weekend in Fargo. She was goign out to Wiliston ND to help the city plan for infrastruture upgrades due to the influx of people flocking there due to this resevoir. She was telling me they just got back some findings and it should contain more oil than all of Texas. Apparently this thing is very very deep compared to most fields.

They are pumping pretty good right now and many ranchers are recieving checks for 50K\week in royalties.

 

[MovingTarget]

Considering the way the economy is going right now, raising the gas tax is a BAD idea. Sure, I'd love to fund or otherwise help the development of renewable energy, but I do not feel that is the way to do that. I do however think that this is the time to re-fill our Strategic Petrolium Reserve. This would temporarily increase demand for crude, and give us a bit more insurance for further oil supply issues.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Brainonska511
I could see raising the gas tax only if they put that money towards infrastructure (fix roads, add more public transit, charging stations for electric cars (?), etc).

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: techs

Originally posted by: Brovane

Originally posted by: techs
Yes. New oil and energy development projects are being killed in the U.S. since the projects need a certain price of oil to be profitable.
If oil had a tax supported bottom of say, 65 per barrel, these projects wouldn't be cancelled and many more would started. This would provide the US energy security while the US consumer would still spend far less for a gallon of gas than anyone else in the First world.

I agree whole heartily with that. Some of the projects like deep water drilling and oil shale require oil to be above a certain level in order for them to make economic sense.

Some people think there could be up to 200 BILLION barrels of oil in the Bakken formation in Montana and South Dakota.
Buh bye, OPEC.

I was talking to an engineer last weekend in Fargo. She was goign out to Wiliston ND to help the city plan for infrastruture upgrades due to the influx of people flocking there due to this resevoir. She was telling me they just got back some findings and it should contain more oil than all of Texas. Apparently this thing is very very deep compared to most fields.

They are pumping pretty good right now and many ranchers are recieving checks for 50K\week in royalties.

my grandma owns mineral rights right in the middle of it

 

[Jmman]

Actually I think we should wait until the Dow is at 5000 and unemployment at 15% before we raise the gas tax......

Why in the world would you raise taxes when the economy is so close to disaster right now? You want to send it over the cliff?

 

[Brovane]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget
Considering the way the economy is going right now, raising the gas tax is a BAD idea. Sure, I'd love to fund or otherwise help the development of renewable energy, but I do not feel that is the way to do that. I do however think that this is the time to re-fill our Strategic Petrolium Reserve. This would temporarily increase demand for crude, and give us a bit more insurance for further oil supply issues.

SPR was never drained. Bush has been slowly filling it since he took office until Congress made him stop a couple of months ago.

However there is discussions of increasing the size of the SPR to get it back to a 6-month supply for the US.

Should we just wait until gas is back to $4-$5 gallon before we do anything?

What about the national security implications of being dependent so dependent on oil?

 

[Brovane]

Originally posted by: Jmman
Actually I think we should wait until the Dow is at 5000 and unemployment at 15% before we raise the gas tax......

Why in the world would you raise taxes when the economy is so close to disaster right now? You want to send it over the cliff?

Actually I think that the Federal Reserve and Wall Street already did a fine job of sending the economy over a cliff.

 

[GoPackGo]

Raise the tax!

 

[glenn1]

Sure, the more regressive taxes we can raise the better. Better for the earth as well, since too many working class people are driving rather than taking buses and mass transit, or better yet bicycles or walking.

 

[Schadenfroh]

Originally posted by: Jmman
Why in the world would you raise taxes when the economy is so close to disaster right now? You want to send it over the cliff?

Agreed, once the market recovers gas prices will rise again and alternative fuels will be viable once more. Probably would not be good to increase the cost of energy right now... considering the current economic stagnation.

 

[EXman]

Originally posted by: Brovane
Is it time to raise the gasoline tax?

#1-To help spur development of alternative modes of transportation? Like electric cars, more fuel efficient cars, etc? Maybe pay for tax incentives for production of cars that don't use internal combustion engines?

#2- We know the infrastructure of this country needs some serious investment. Put more spending into this infrastructure which should also spur jobs?

#3- Use tax revenue to significantly increase the SPR?

Should we use this opportunity to make some serious changes to try and get off being so dependent on petroleum as part of national energy policy? Do we just let the free market work?

#4 take this $1.63 a gallon I paid today as a welcome relief from the ass-raping that somehow liberals think we all Americans deserve due to our thirst for oil. I remember our Pres elect saying he didn't mind us paying $4 a gal but he wanted us to get to that point in over a longer period of time so we'd be used to it. F taxes i see this as recaptured income.

 

[OFFascist]

Yeah because thats exactly what our economy needs right now, for people to have less money in their pockets. :roll:

 

[MovingTarget]

Originally posted by: Brovane

Originally posted by: MovingTarget
Considering the way the economy is going right now, raising the gas tax is a BAD idea. Sure, I'd love to fund or otherwise help the development of renewable energy, but I do not feel that is the way to do that. I do however think that this is the time to re-fill our Strategic Petrolium Reserve. This would temporarily increase demand for crude, and give us a bit more insurance for further oil supply issues.

SPR was never drained. Bush has been slowly filling it since he took office until Congress made him stop a couple of months ago.

However there is discussions of increasing the size of the SPR to get it back to a 6-month supply for the US.

Should we just wait until gas is back to $4-$5 gallon before we do anything?

What about the national security implications of being dependent so dependent on oil?

Good point. I do think we should increase the size of the SPR. We have nothing to lose and everything to gain by doing so. Maybe it is just me wearing the tinfoil, but Bush filling the SPR when prices were at record levels seems like some sort of payoff for one of his old oil cronies.

 

[brandonbull]

Maybe we should get the gov't to stop useless spending first before we look to see if taxes need a bump.

 

[Double Trouble]

Yes, what a wonderful idea, increase taxes, further push our economy in the tank so the government can be forced to write more checks and print more money. Good thinking. Increasing taxes should be an absolute last resort answer, after every other realistic alternative has been considered and re-considered.

 

[Siddhartha]

Originally posted by: Brovane
Is it time to raise the gasoline tax?

#1-To help spur development of alternative modes of transportation? Like electric cars, more fuel efficient cars, etc? Maybe pay for tax incentives for production of cars that don't use internal combustion engines?

#2- We know the infrastructure of this country needs some serious investment. Put more spending into this infrastructure which should also spur jobs?

#3- Use tax revenue to significantly increase the SPR?

Should we use this opportunity to make some serious changes to try and get off being so dependent on petroleum as part of national energy policy? Do we just let the free market work?

Typically it is a bad idea to raise taxes when a country is in economic rexession. Increasing the cost of living would be a counter productive move with poeple lossing or have lost their jobs and companies going out of business or barely holding.

You raise taxes during economic recovery.

 

[bozack]

MA is already considering raising their gas tax as well as considerably raising their tolls, and from what I have heard property taxes will be on the rise soon...but then again it seems we love getting bent over here.

 

[daniel49]

Originally posted by: bozack
MA is already considering raising their gas tax as well as considerably raising their tolls, and from what I have heard property taxes will be on the rise soon...but then again it seems we love getting bent over here.

2012 Anyone but Obama

getting an early start?:laugh:

 

[cKGunslinger]

Originally posted by: Siddhartha

Originally posted by: Brovane
Is it time to raise the gasoline tax?

#1-To help spur development of alternative modes of transportation? Like electric cars, more fuel efficient cars, etc? Maybe pay for tax incentives for production of cars that don't use internal combustion engines?

#2- We know the infrastructure of this country needs some serious investment. Put more spending into this infrastructure which should also spur jobs?

#3- Use tax revenue to significantly increase the SPR?

Should we use this opportunity to make some serious changes to try and get off being so dependent on petroleum as part of national energy policy? Do we just let the free market work?

Typically it is a bad idea to raise taxes when a country is in economic rexession. Increasing the cost of living would be a counter productive move with poeple lossing or have lost their jobs and companies going out of business or barely holding.

You raise taxes during economic recovery.

Gas was $3.75 a few months ago. It's $1.75 right now. Would an extra $0.02/gal *really* be an insurmountable cost of living increase?

 

[L00PY]

I'd say no to raising the tax but yes to creating a new tax linked to the inflation adjusted price of gas. 1% per gallon at minimum, 2.5% when gas is $3.01 to $3.50, 5% when gas is $2.51 to $3.00, 7.5% when gas is $2.01 to $2.50, 10% when gas is $2.00 or less.

All revenues from this tax go towards subsidizing alternative energies. When gas prices are higher, the impact on consumers will be less and market forces should naturally push towards fuel economy and development of alternative fuels. When gas prices are lower, consumers will still have relatively cheap gas and that is when development of alternative fuels needs the most funding.

Thoughts?

 

[Brovane]

Originally posted by: Siddhartha

Originally posted by: Brovane
Is it time to raise the gasoline tax?

#1-To help spur development of alternative modes of transportation? Like electric cars, more fuel efficient cars, etc? Maybe pay for tax incentives for production of cars that don't use internal combustion engines?

#2- We know the infrastructure of this country needs some serious investment. Put more spending into this infrastructure which should also spur jobs?

#3- Use tax revenue to significantly increase the SPR?

Should we use this opportunity to make some serious changes to try and get off being so dependent on petroleum as part of national energy policy? Do we just let the free market work?

Typically it is a bad idea to raise taxes when a country is in economic rexession. Increasing the cost of living would be a counter productive move with poeple lossing or have lost their jobs and companies going out of business or barely holding.

You raise taxes during economic recovery.

Would raising taxes on gasoline and then turning around and using this money to pay for increased infrastructure, ie road repairs, bridge maintenance, new roads, public transportation be such a bad idea? All these activities would require construction crews, equipment which means money flowing back into the economy to make all these activities happen. In the long run we get to move around quicker and this infrastructure bought has benefits for decades for the country.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: L00PY
I'd say no to raising the tax but yes to creating a new tax linked to the inflation adjusted price of gas. 1% per gallon at minimum, 2.5% when gas is $3.01 to $3.50, 5% when gas is $2.51 to $3.00, 7.5% when gas is $2.01 to $2.50, 10% when gas is $2.00 or less.

All revenues from this tax go towards subsidizing alternative energies. When gas prices are higher, the impact on consumers will be less and market forces should naturally push towards fuel economy and development of alternative fuels. When gas prices are lower, consumers will still have relatively cheap gas and that is when development of alternative fuels needs the most funding.

Thoughts?

That's more punishment though to push the green agenda. I can't believe people actually think like this but yet you see it in many of the posts in p&n.

Why not just incent (via tax decrease) alternative sources and more oil supply? The gubment should not be in the business of energy development as the free market can do a better job.

 

[Brovane]

Originally posted by: Double Trouble
Yes, what a wonderful idea, increase taxes, further push our economy in the tank so the government can be forced to write more checks and print more money. Good thinking. Increasing taxes should be an absolute last resort answer, after every other realistic alternative has been considered and re-considered.

Great what is your alternatives to get the US so it isn't so dependent on Petroleum? Also where do you propose we get the money to pay to start fixing the crumbing infrastructure in the US? Do we just do more deficit spending and let somebody else pay for it?

 

[Brovane]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: L00PY
I'd say no to raising the tax but yes to creating a new tax linked to the inflation adjusted price of gas. 1% per gallon at minimum, 2.5% when gas is $3.01 to $3.50, 5% when gas is $2.51 to $3.00, 7.5% when gas is $2.01 to $2.50, 10% when gas is $2.00 or less.

All revenues from this tax go towards subsidizing alternative energies. When gas prices are higher, the impact on consumers will be less and market forces should naturally push towards fuel economy and development of alternative fuels. When gas prices are lower, consumers will still have relatively cheap gas and that is when development of alternative fuels needs the most funding.

Thoughts?

That's more punishment though to push the green agenda. I can't believe people actually think like this but yet you see it in many of the posts in p&n.

Why not just incent (via tax decrease) alternative sources and more oil supply? The gubment should not be in the business of energy development as the free market can do a better job.

The Energy development of petroleum is a national security issue so the government has to be involved. The free market isn't going to act to protect the national security of the US.

 

[L00PY]

Originally posted by: spidey07
That's more punishment though to push the green agenda. I can't believe people actually think like this but yet you see it in many of the posts in p&n.

Why not just incent (via tax decrease) alternative sources and more oil supply? The gubment should not be in the business of energy development as the free market can do a better job.

Green agenda of funding American technological research? Green agenda of helping American technology businesses? Green agenda of creating new American jobs? Green as in cash and business friendly you mean?

The problem with merely incentivizing alternative sources and more oil supply is that it has been inconsistent and failed in the past. How much was done in this area and how much progress did we see prior to the seventies? Post embargo we saw a lot of it, but once oil prices dropped, down came the solar cells and out came the SUVs.