Time for a new transmission? Hard shifting from 1st to 2nd gear (Update)

[JEDI]

2005 mazda3i automatic, 200k miles

this past month I noticed that my car sometimes shifts hard from 1st to 2nd gear.
and this only happens when the engine is cold.

well, this morning (coldest all summer @ 50F), my car jerked TWICE when going from 1st to 2nd.

Would a transmission flush fix this? or is it time to replace the transmission?


edit:
took it to a highly rated Angie's List transmission shop.

they did a test drive. felt the hard shift from 1st to 2nd gear.
dropped the tranny pan and saw a lot of metal shavings.

their recommendation: just keep driving it till it dies.
putting in a rebuilt tranny would cost more than the car is worth.

I asked if a drain and fill w/new fluid would help. they said no.

I'm picking the car up up this afternoon.
no charge!

I would have figured they would have made some $ by at least saying yes to a drain and fill since they drained it to drop the pan?!?!

guess that's why they're highly rated on angie's List.

 

[satyajitmenon]

When was the transmission fluid last changed? You could start with that.

Made a bit of a difference for my truck with 170k miles on it.

 

[JEDI]

When was the transmission fluid last changed? You could start with that.

Made a bit of a difference for my truck with 170k miles on it.

about 75k miles ago.
I stopped because the manual doesn't list transmission as one of the fluids to change.

how does new fluid help?

And which atf is better?
- advanced auto parts lists Castrol Transmax High Mileage (ATF) Automatic Transmission Fluid (1 Quart)
http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/...ic-transmission-fluid-1-quart-06812/8150025-P

- Napa lists Valvoline MaxLife Universal ATF - 1 Qt
http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/C...Life-Universal-ATF-1-Qt/_/R-VAR324_0120605980

-autozone lists Lucas Oil/Multi-vehicle automatic transmission fluid
http://www.autozone.com/autozone/ac...ion-fluid/_/N-25aa?itemIdentifier=853250_0_0_

 

[basslover1]

Find out how much it'll cost to do a trans fluid change. And I don't mean just a drain and fill, drop the pan and change the filter as well.

I would at least consider doing that first before jumping right into a new trans.

 

[Yuriman]

In the case of my brother's Saturn, all that was needed was a new solenoid in the valve body. His transmission had a plate with a few bolts on top that allowed easy access, the swap took all of around 20 minutes with a basic ratchet set.

 

[twinrider1]

I'd start with checking the fluid level.

 

[BUTCH1]

It's best to change it regardless of what the manual says, the "lifetime fluid" idea is a joke. Try a fluid change and see if it helps, DO NOT flush a tranny with 200K on it as your asking for trouble with a piece of debris coming loose and getting stuck somewhere in the valve body. Throw on a new filter while your at it, if your old one is partially clogged it will affect transmission performance in a bad way.

 

[railer]

I would not even consider replacing the transmission on a 200k mile car because I thought it shifted hard once in a while. A transmission replacement cost has to be close to what the car is worth.

 

[BUTCH1]

I would not even consider replacing the transmission on a 200k mile car because I thought it shifted hard once in a while. A transmission replacement cost has to be close to what the car is worth.

Meh, the only "makes sense" option is if OP could find one in a bone-yard for around $300-500 and install it himself but by reading his post's so far I don't think that would be possible, FWD trannies are not easy to swap out.

 

[phucheneh]

If the issue is due to a sticking solenoid in the valve body, changing the fluid may cure it.

If the issue is due to worn friction linings, changing the fluid will make sure that the car has nice clean fluid in it while it is towed to the junkyard.

 

[Jimzz]

My last car had the similar issue. Very hard shift when cold for the first couple gears. After it warmed up it was ok.

Changing the fluid and filter helped a little. I had to pull the valve body, replace 1 spring, and hand clean it to get rid of I say 90% of the firmness. I could still kinda feel it but not to bad.

 

[ballmode]

Id replace the fluids

 

[BUTCH1]

If the issue is due to a sticking solenoid in the valve body, changing the fluid may cure it.

If the issue is due to worn friction linings, changing the fluid will make sure that the car has nice clean fluid in it while it is towed to the junkyard.

LOL, he may get lucky if the filter is clogged enough that it's interfering with normal pressure, I'd risk the $25 to try it and as I mentioned if it's a common tranny the bone-yard might work out OK providing the rest of the car (engine compression, ect.) is in decent shape, kind of a gamble with a used unit but car payments suck too.

 

[JEDI]

I'd start with checking the fluid level.

fluid level is within the lines on the dip stick
(red fluid)

 

[phucheneh]

LOL, he may get lucky if the filter is clogged enough that it's interfering with normal pressure, I'd risk the $25 to try it and as I mentioned if it's a common tranny the bone-yard might work out OK providing the rest of the car (engine compression, ect.) is in decent shape, kind of a gamble with a used unit but car payments suck too.

It's possible that he has a line pressure issue from a restricted filter...if there is a filter. I just went ahead and assumed that there probably isn't a filter, as is often the case on modern FWD Japanese cars. A simple screen, much like what you find on an oil pump pickup tube, is often all they have.

Buuuttt...I decided to use a little Googe-fu...and yeah, it appears you're right. There is a serviceable filter. In which case, I'd say replace it and refill the trans. That should leave a solid half of the old fluid, if not more. I would definitely avoid something like using an actual flush machine to pump 10+ quarts of new fluid through the trans.

 

[BUTCH1]

It's possible that he has a line pressure issue from a restricted filter...if there is a filter. I just went ahead and assumed that there probably isn't a filter, as is often the case on modern FWD Japanese cars. A simple screen, much like what you find on an oil pump pickup tube, is often all they have.

Buuuttt...I decided to use a little Googe-fu...and yeah, it appears you're right. There is a serviceable filter. In which case, I'd say replace it and refill the trans. That should leave a solid half of the old fluid, if not more. I would definitely avoid something like using an actual flush machine to pump 10+ quarts of new fluid through the trans.

Yea, 200K is a lot of time for crud to accumulate and a flush is a really bad idea at this point.

 

[JEDI]

There is a serviceable filter. In which case, I'd say replace it and refill the trans. That should leave a solid half of the old fluid, if not more. I would definitely avoid something like using an actual flush machine to pump 10+ quarts of new fluid through the trans.

a drain and fill is only 1/2 the fluid?
so a 6quart pack of Castrol high milage ATF is too much? ($31 at amazon)

google has said 3-4 quarts for a drain and fill for my car.
thx.
will just buy 4 quarts.

and will get the filter kit

 

[phucheneh]

a drain and fill is only 1/2 the fluid?
so a 6quart pack of high milage ATF is too much? ($31 at amazon)

google has said 3-4 quarts for a drain and fill for my car.
thx.
will just buy 4 quarts.

and will get the filter kit

If you look at the manufacturers specs in a proper service manual, there will typically be two numbers- a 'service fill' number and a total capacity. If the service fill is 3.5qt, I would wager on the total capacity being somewhere in the 7-8qt range. The bulk of the extra fluid is in the torque converter, plus a fair amount inside the valve body and generally covering/filling all the various guts of the transmission.

Some of Mazda's transmissions have used JWS3309 (aka Toyota T-IV, among other names), but I believe yours use the more standard Mazda M-V fluid. Valvoline MaxLife is definitely compatible. Unsure about Mobil1 or other similar 'do it all' fluids.

 

[T2urtle]

a drain and fill is only 1/2 the fluid?
so a 6quart pack of Castrol high milage ATF is too much? ($31 at amazon)

google has said 3-4 quarts for a drain and fill for my car.
thx.
will just buy 4 quarts.

and will get the filter kit

Its better to have a extra bottle of ATF then to be short one.

But yes, from all the FWD trans i've done. The pan normally holds about 2.5-4qts of fluid.

This is $50 to possibly save/prolong your trans another 50-100k.

 

[JEDI]

Update:
took it to a highly rated Angie's List transmission shop.

they did a test drive. felt the hard shift from 1st to 2nd gear.
dropped the tranny pan and saw a lot of metal shavings.

their recommendation: just keep driving it till it dies.
putting in a rebuilt tranny would cost more than the car is worth.

I asked if a drain and fill w/new fluid would help. they said no.

I'm picking the car up up this afternoon.
no charge!

I would have figured they would have made some $ by at least saying yes to a drain and fill since they drained it to drop the pan?!?!

guess that's why they're highly rated on angie's List.

 

[Carson Dyle]

I've had this problem from about two years after I bought my Subaru Forester XT. Had the transmission fluid changed, but that didn't help much, if at all. It's only between 1st and 2nd, and more noticeable when downshifting rather than up. Only when the temps get below 40F and it goes away quickly - usually within two or three miles of driving.

 

[JEDI]

so for a quick fix solution, I try to always be in 2nd gear after the car stops (red light/stop sign) before accelerating.
been 3 months and car is still going but I don't think 3months is a sufficient data point.

also, I found this:

just pour into the transmission.
would this help?

or is it snake oil?

 

[BUTCH1]

so for a quick fix solution, I try to always be in 2nd gear after the car stops (red light/stop sign) before accelerating.
been 3 months and car is still going but I don't think 3months is a sufficient data point.

also, I found this:

just pour into the transmission.
would this help?

or is it snake oil?

Have you even bothered to change the fluid and filter yet?, start there before you go the additive route, IMHO if a 200K tranny's worn out I doubt any additive would help much.

 

[LTC8K6]

they did a test drive. felt the hard shift from 1st to 2nd gear.
dropped the tranny pan and saw a lot of metal shavings.

Only one thing is going to fix that...

 

[skyking]

sorry about the dying transmission, but wow, what a nice shop!