Time for a new build after 8 years!

[crashtech]

I'm starting to understand now. It means that if I get a board/CPU combo that doesn't even boot, then I'm dead in the water because I don't even have the means to upgrade the BIOS at this point...correct? In which case, I have to find a CPU that will boot and then be able to do the BIOS update and then switch back to the other CPU?

That won't happen, it did happen once in the past when some people got boards that were made for Sandy Bridge and tried to put an Ivy Bridge into it (LGA 1155), but this won't happen with Haswell because the Refresh CPUs are of the same stepping. There won't be any boot failures, there have been none of which I am aware, and I have already put several Haswell Refresh CPUs into H81 & H87 boards.

 

[fretman]

That won't happen, it did happen once in the past when some people got boards that were made for Sandy Bridge and tried to put an Ivy Bridge into it (LGA 1155), but this won't happen with Haswell because the Refresh CPUs are of the same stepping. There won't be any boot failures, there have been none of which I am aware, and I have already put several Haswell Refresh CPUs into H81 & H87 boards.

That is good to hear. I was avoiding the 4460 with an H81 board because of this but since this won't be an issue I will look into this combo again. Prior, I was looking at the 4430 and 4440 with an H81 board.

 

[Ketchup]

That won't happen, it did happen once in the past when some people got boards that were made for Sandy Bridge and tried to put an Ivy Bridge into it (LGA 1155), but this won't happen with Haswell because the Refresh CPUs are of the same stepping. There won't be any boot failures, there have been none of which I am aware, and I have already put several Haswell Refresh CPUs into H81 & H87 boards.

Well, I am glad you haven't seen one. Unfortunately, ZGR has:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2389396

 

[crashtech]

Well, I am glad you haven't seen one. Unfortunately, ZGR has:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2389396

I'd like to reserve judgement on that for now.

 

[chusteczka]

Here is a lower level recommendation that reduces the CPU and Motherboard while keeping quality components for the rest. Started by Ken's original recommendation for the processor and motherboard but with an attempt to upgrade memory and video.

Intel
CPU: i3-4150 3.5GHz Dual-Core ($121 @ DirectCanada) (CPUBenchMark 5050) 54watts
MB: Socket LGA 1150 (Asus, ASRock, EVGA, Gigabyte, MSI), 2 RAM slots, Max RAM 16GB+ ($45-$65)

AMD
CPU: AMD FX-4300 3.8GHz Quad-Core ($120 @ Vuugo, NCIX, DirectCanada) (CPUBenchMark 5254) 95watts
MB: Socket AM3+, (Asus, ASRock, Biostar, Gigabyte, MSI), Max RAM 16GB+ ($57 - $75)

I know you earlier mentioned disinterest in MSI but I have used a couple of their motherboards in the past with good results. They create stable motherboards for the inexpensive and low end of options with no overclocking.

Video Card:
GTX 750 Ti ($140 - $200)
R9 270 ($160 - $202)
R9 270X ($180 - $260)

Memory: 1600MHz (1x8GB) CL9 1.5v ($95)
SSD : 128GB for OS ($65)
HDD : 1TB for files and games (7200 or slower rpm) ($65)
Case & PSU: ($120)
Operating System: MS Windows 8.1 64bit ($100)
Total: $445 + CPU + MB + video = $445 + $180 = $625 + video = $625 + ($150-$200) = $775 or $825

Costs can be reduced in the Case & PSU, I figured $60 for each but purchasing a combination would be cheaper than individually.

The total cost is still reaching $800 even with a lower cost cpu & motherboard. The video card can be knocked down to a $100 or $125 card. The memory can be knocked down to 4GB.

Other possibilities are Ken's original recommendation in Post #2, Combo Deals, Pre-Built OEM such as Dell or HP, or upgrading what you have.

 

[fretman]

Here is a lower level recommendation that reduces the CPU and Motherboard while keeping quality components for the rest. Started by Ken's original recommendation for the processor and motherboard but with an attempt to upgrade memory and video.

Intel
CPU: i3-4150 3.5GHz Dual-Core ($121 @ DirectCanada) (CPUBenchMark 5050) 54watts
MB: Socket LGA 1150 (Asus, ASRock, EVGA, Gigabyte, MSI), 2 RAM slots, Max RAM 16GB+ ($45-$65)

AMD
CPU: AMD FX-4300 3.8GHz Quad-Core ($120 @ Vuugo, NCIX, DirectCanada) (CPUBenchMark 5254) 95watts
MB: Socket AM3+, (Asus, ASRock, Biostar, Gigabyte, MSI), Max RAM 16GB+ ($57 - $75)

I know you earlier mentioned disinterest in MSI but I have used a couple of their motherboards in the past with good results. They create stable motherboards for the inexpensive and low end of options with no overclocking.

Video Card:
GTX 750 Ti ($140 - $200)
R9 270 ($160 - $202)
R9 270X ($180 - $260)

Memory: 1600MHz (1x8GB) CL9 1.5v ($95)
SSD : 128GB for OS ($65)
HDD : 1TB for files and games (7200 or slower rpm) ($65)
Case & PSU: ($120)
Operating System: MS Windows 8.1 64bit ($100)
Total: $445 + CPU + MB + video = $445 + $180 = $625 + video = $625 + ($150-$200) = $775 or $825

Costs can be reduced in the Case & PSU, I figured $60 for each but purchasing a combination would be cheaper than individually.

The total cost is still reaching $800 even with a lower cost cpu & motherboard. The video card can be knocked down to a $100 or $125 card. The memory can be knocked down to 4GB.

Other possibilities are Ken's original recommendation in Post #2, Combo Deals, Pre-Built OEM such as Dell or HP, or upgrading what you have.

Wow...that is still getting up their in price for an I3. But I've made up my mind on at least one thing and I'm not turning back now. And that is I want an I5. I'm just not sure if I should go with the Haswell or the Haswell refresh.

 

[Ketchup]

Wow...that is still getting up their in price for an I3. But I've made up my mind on at least one thing and I'm not turning back now. And that is I want an I5. I'm just not sure if I should go with the Haswell or the Haswell refresh.

When you find a board and refresh chip that match, I am not sure why you would want to go that route, unless you find one of the olders significantly cheaper.

 

[chusteczka]

When you find a board and refresh chip that match, I am not sure why you would want to go that route, unless you find one of the olders significantly cheaper.

Then you can search for combo deals based on the processor. That makes it easier. For example, Newegg has several combos to choose from.

A case and psu combo will help cut costs. I am not sure if you need a 500w or 600w psu.

Determine the system setup you want. For example a hard drive for file storage paired with an SSD of either 120 or 256GB, or no SSD at all. The magnetic hard drive, whether it is fast at 7200 rpm's or slow at 5400, 5700, or "Green" speed. You want your operating system on either an SSD or a 7200 rpm drive.

Then determine 4GB or 8GB memory. Then the video card. You will also need a cpu cooler.

 

[mfenn]

These look like good numbers for the AMD compared to the Intel numbers. I wonder since I use my machine about 10hrs/week if the power consumption increase really has a big affect.

Passmark is a completely synthetic benchmark that has no relation to performance in real-world applications. Since it runs a very predictable, branch-free code integer code, AMD's relatively weaker branch predictor and floating point units get a big pass. Most real code is not like that (especially the branchy-ness part).

 

[fretman]

When you find a board and refresh chip that match, I am not sure why you would want to go that route, unless you find one of the olders significantly cheaper.

The lowest price I5 refresh chip would be the 4460. I think that would suit my needs.

Can people here tell that I wouldn't be making a mistake by going with this chip? If no other alternate opinions, I will start building around this CPU.

 

[mfenn]

The lowest price I5 refresh chip would be the 4460. I think that would suit my needs.

I agree! :awe: Check my build from post #75.

 

[crashtech]

Well, I am glad you haven't seen one. Unfortunately, ZGR has:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2389396

After looking at that thread again, the board in question is a Z97, so this cannot say anything about H81 or H87 boards in regards to Haswell Refresh.

 

[fretman]

I agree! :awe: Check my build from post #75.

Man...so many posts I've lost track. Thanks. I may upgrade video card from 270X to 280 if price is right. You don't recommend a GEForce card though? I thought NVidea cards were more suited for intel chips?

 

[bononos]

Man...so many posts I've lost track. Thanks. I may upgrade video card from 270X to 280 if price is right. You don't recommend a GEForce card though? I thought NVidea cards were more suited for intel chips?

No they are not. Just use whichever brand suits you.

 

[Ketchup]

After looking at that thread again, the board in question is a Z97, so this cannot say anything about H81 or H87 boards in regards to Haswell Refresh.

You noticed correctly. Are you saying that you expect any of the refresh chips to work on an older chipset, when there are chips that the latest chipset won't even run without an update?

 

[DSF]

Man...so many posts I've lost track. Thanks. I may upgrade video card from 270X to 280 if price is right. You don't recommend a GEForce card though? I thought NVidea cards were more suited for intel chips?

Maybe you're thinking of the fact that AMD bought ATI? Either way CPU and GPU brands don't have to have anything to do with each other. Look up some benchmarks for the games you expect to play and see which card offers you the best performance/$.

 

[crashtech]

You noticed correctly. Are you saying that you expect any of the refresh chips to work on an older chipset, when there are chips that the latest chipset won't even run without an update?

At this point we don't even know what the problem is, I believe it is premature to attribute it to an incompatibility, and tbh, I would question any conclusion made by a user with limited resources at hand with which to do some methodical testing.

I'll certainly retract my comment if it looks like it was an incompatibility. I'm not afraid to be wrong, but none of the vendors I've dealt with think it is a big deal either.

Sorry to the OP about the digression, but it is at least tangentially related to the subject at hand.

 

[Ketchup]

.... Sorry to the OP about the digression, but it is at least tangentially related to the subject at hand.

Same here, time to move on.

 

[fretman]

I agree! :awe: Check my build from post #75.

Question about the mobo and memory. The mobo supports up to 1600 ram. But the ram recommendation in the build is 1833. Does it matter? Or should I just choose a 1600 ram instead? Or I'm wondering if you just picked the 1833 ram because of price?

 

[DSF]

Question about the mobo and memory. The mobo supports up to 1600 ram. But the ram recommendation in the build is 1833. Does it matter? Or should I just choose a 1600 ram instead? Or I'm wondering if you just picked the 1833 ram because of price?

At its core all RAM is essentially the same. The advertised speed is just the fastest speed that the manufacturer guarantees for that stick. These days you can always put "fast" RAM into a slower motherboard.

 

[crashtech]

Some H97 boards will run the XMP profile just fine, it might not be advertised as such though.

 

[mfenn]

At its core all RAM is essentially the same. The advertised speed is just the fastest speed that the manufacturer guarantees for that stick. These days you can always put "fast" RAM into a slower motherboard.

Yep, exactly. I just picked the 1866 due to price.

 

[fretman]

Yep, exactly. I just picked the 1866 due to price.

OK...I was just concerned that a higher rated ram speed than what the mobo is spec'd at might have caused some compatibility issues. I'll go with the recommended part in this case. Never heard of G-Skill before but the Rip Jaw series gets excellent reviews.

 

[coolpurplefan]

I believe I recommended 1866MHz RAM earlier in the thread but that was because it can run at 1600MHz at 1.5V. At 1866MHz, it's at 1.65V. Later in the thread I recommended RAM that can run default at 1600MHz at 1.5V.

In any case, I've intentionally tried to shy away from this thread because I started suspecting this is a troll thread. Just to let you know, I decided to look at Gigabyte, AsRock, Asus and MSI motherboards and I'm still more impressed with the Gigabyte GA-H97-D3H. There's even a Z97 version. It has Realtek ALC1150, Intel LAN and it has an M2.PCIe connector. You could put a way faster SSD later on if you wanted.

 

[Ketchup]

....In any case, I've intentionally tried to shy away from this thread because I started suspecting this is a troll thread. ....

Eh, I wouldn't call you a troll. Maybe somebody that needs his own thread though.