TIL Reagan once fired all the ATC's

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
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Someone brought this topic up at work, never heard of it! :eek:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional_Air_Traffic_Controllers_Organization_(1968)

August 1981 strike

On August 3, 1981, during a press conference regarding the PATCO strike, President Reagan stated: "They are in violation of the law and if they do not report for work within 48 hours they have forfeited their jobs and will be terminated."

On August 3, 1981, the union declared a strike, seeking better working conditions, better pay and a 32-hour workweek. In addition, PATCO wanted to be excluded from the civil service clauses that it had long disliked. In doing so, the union violated 5 U.S.C. (Supp. III 1956) 118p (now 5 U.S.C. § 7311), which banned strikes by government unions. Ronald Reagan declared the PATCO strike a "peril to national safety" and ordered them back to work under the terms of the Taft-Hartley Act of 1947. Only 1,300 of the nearly 13,000 controllers returned to work.[5]

Subsequently, Reagan demanded those remaining on strike return to work within 48 hours, otherwise their jobs would be forfeited. At the same time, Transportation Secretary Drew Lewis organized for replacements and started contingency plans. By prioritizing and cutting flights severely, and even adopting methods of air traffic management that PATCO had previously lobbied for, the government was initially able to have 50% of flights available.[5]

On August 5, following the PATCO workers' refusal to return to work, Reagan fired the 11,345 striking air traffic controllers who had ignored the order,[7][8] and banned them from federal service for life. In the wake of the strike and mass firings, the FAA was faced with the task of hiring and training enough controllers to replace those that had been fired, a hard problem to fix as, at the time, it took three years in normal conditions to train a new controller.[2] They were replaced initially with nonparticipating controllers, supervisors, staff personnel, some nonrated personnel, and in some cases by controllers transferred temporarily from other facilities. Some military controllers were also used until replacements could be trained. The FAA had initially claimed that staffing levels would be restored within two years; however, it would take closer to ten years before the overall staffing levels returned to normal.[2] PATCO was decertified from its right to represent workers by the Federal Labor Relations Authority on October 22, 1981. The decision was appealed.[9]

Some former striking controllers were allowed to reapply after 1986 and were rehired; they and their replacements are now represented by the National Air Traffic Controllers Association, which was organized in 1987 and had no connection with PATCO. The civil service ban on the remaining strike participants was lifted by President Bill Clinton in 1993.[10]

TL;DR:
1. Air traffic controllers did a strike in 1981 (they had a no-strike agreement due to national security reasons)
2. President felt blackmailed, fired 'em all.
3. Flights all over the world got cancelled as a result, took nearly 10 years to recover the workforce.
 
Feb 4, 2009
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Yup it was a big story at the time. I was young I do remember the air traffic guys turning down several offers to talk.
I'm a pro union guy and I remember these guys being kind of dicks but again I was young.
 

edro

Lifer
Apr 5, 2002
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Where exactly do you get another job, when your only experience is in a field you can no longer work in?

It's like a doctor having his license revoked, or a lawyer being disbarred.
 

Fritzo

Lifer
Jan 3, 2001
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I remember when that happened. That was before CNN and Fox News, so pretty much the whole country was "YEAH RONNIE! YOU STICK IT TO 'EM!"

Today, you'd have one side of the news calling him a Commie, the other side calling him Jesus, and no matter what he did it would be wrong.
 

twinrider1

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2003
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reagan-620x395.jpeg
 

Newell Steamer

Diamond Member
Jan 27, 2014
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Ronald Reagan fires them; Woo-hoo GAWD Blers 'Murica!!!shift+1!!!

Anyone today fires them; TEH COMMUNASTS!! TEH COMMUNASTS R'TAKIN OVER 'MURICA!!!!shift+1!!!
 

Homerboy

Lifer
Mar 1, 2000
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I remember when that happened. That was before CNN and Fox News, so pretty much the whole country was "YEAH RONNIE! YOU STICK IT TO 'EM!"

Today, you'd have one side of the news calling him a Commie, the other side calling him Jesus, and no matter what he did it would be wrong.

1430434612477.jpg
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
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If I remember correctly most were rehired.

Originally about 13,000 air traffic controllers participated in the strike. Roughly 1,300 returned to work when Reagan ordered it. Reagan fired the remaining 11,345 ATC's & banned them from working for the FAA for life. However, in 1993, Clinton lifted the civil service ban on the remaining strike participants.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
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Yup it was a big story at the time. I was young I do remember the air traffic guys turning down several offers to talk.

The thing is, people typically don't strike when they feel like they're being taken care of. That's the whole reason why unions were invented in the first place, to prevent people from getting screwed over. But because we like to go to extremes, unions turned into the "union attitude" & created its own sets of problems.

The difficulty is that with stuff like this, they had a no-strike agreement, so how do you strike to get better working conditions without actually striking, and then if you do that, how do you get taken seriously so that real change actually happens? I have no idea if their complaints were legitimate or not, but asking for more pay & less time when working in a very stressful job that falls under national security seems to be a pretty reasonable request.
 

pete6032

Diamond Member
Dec 3, 2010
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IMO the air traffic controller situation is one of the most prominent points of the Reagan presidency, what he and his administration are known for.
 

gophertron

Member
Apr 25, 2012
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Interesting story, happened before I was born but curious how something like that would play out today.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
50,453
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32 hour work week? Reaching a bit there, yeah?

To be fair, being an ATC is one of the top 5 most stressful jobs in America (via the CDC circa 2010) & has a mandatory retirement age of 56. You basically have to use full concentration the whole time. Remember what happened on Breaking Bad??
 

poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
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The thing is, people typically don't strike when they feel like they're being taken care of. That's the whole reason why unions were invented in the first place, to prevent people from getting screwed over. But because we like to go to extremes, unions turned into the "union attitude" & created its own sets of problems.

There isn't a term/group in America that needs a rebrand as much as unions. Union is now a four letter word in America, and worker wages have sucked because of that.

I don't have an answer for a replacement though. The obvious other choice (confederacy) won't work for other reasons.
 

nakedfrog

No Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
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To be fair, being an ATC is one of the top 5 most stressful jobs in America (via the CDC circa 2010) & has a mandatory retirement age of 56. You basically have to use full concentration the whole time. Remember what happened on Breaking Bad??

No, I haven't seen it.

:runs away:
 
Feb 4, 2009
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No they weren't.

A few were, but most were banned from that type of work for 12 years. After which their relevancy and job skill training is completely gone.

I thought that there was a couple of warning shots, then one final warning and a bunch came back.
Again I was pretty young I could easily be wrong.

Now that I think of it the military filled in for a good amount of time.
 

thraashman

Lifer
Apr 10, 2000
11,112
1,585
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Yet another reason Reagan was a dick and a crappy President. If W hadn't come along, Reagan would have been the worst President in my lifetime.
 
Feb 4, 2009
35,862
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Yet another reason Reagan was a dick and a crappy President. If W hadn't come along, Reagan would have been the worst President in my lifetime.

I'm a pretty Union friendly guy I've only worked in one as a young man but I have managed bargained for employees for 13 years. Modern Unions are pretty well balanced.
Remember Regan was dealing with critical workers whose own Union agreed to a no strike clause. They went on strike before their current agreement expired. Its hard to form an agreement with someone who won't live by the agreement.
 

Fritzo

Lifer
Jan 3, 2001
41,920
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Yet another reason Reagan was a dick and a crappy President. If W hadn't come along, Reagan would have been the worst President in my lifetime.

I think you're in the minority on that one bud ;) Even the democrats liked Reagan