TIL: Building a clock in Texas is illegal

[SOFTengCOMPelec]

There was NEVER any belief it was a real bomb. If ANYONE AT ANY POINT thought it was a real bomb the school would have been evacuated and the bomb squad would have been the only one handling the bomb. The English TEACHER DID NOT BELIEVE it was a bomb. If they did they wouldn't have picked it up.

They really cannot claim they followed protocol with the student when they didn't follow protocol for a hoax bomb.

Well the apparently official Police announcement video, about this incident. Seems to be saying, they were worried that it might have been possibly the infrastructure for a bomb.

http://www.usatoday.com/media/cinematic/video/32504809/

 

[Slew Foot]

I will say this, that is a totally retarded looking clock

 

[Ichinisan]

Good.

about now the school and police have to be scrambling to fix the major fuck up.

Come on, people. We are getting carried away.

This is not a "fuck up." Teachers are not bomb experts. They did exactly what I expect them to do.

The real question: Did the kid or his parents also expect this?

Do we really want non-experts (teachers) to immediately conclude any suspicious device is 100% safe without asking experts?

 

[Ichinisan]

I will say this, that is a totally retarded looking clock

Looks like all he did was cram a clock into a box. Didn't even bother to mount the transformer that's carrying 120v AC current -- so it actually appears to be somewhat dangerous.

The box is bent, so it won't close properly. There's a piece of cord wrapped around the latch for some unknown reason.

 

[Ichinisan]

Then, at worst, there should be a short investigation and that be the end of it. To extend this into a suspension and potential criminal charge is asinine

That's all there was. Police said there will be no charges. Will social media ever realize that?

 

[Ichinisan]

Then, at worst, there should be a short investigation and that be the end of it. To extend this into a suspension and potential criminal charge is asinine

So it's "asinine" to tell a kid that his device has the appearance of a hoax bomb and to tell him that there are possible consequences for building a hoax bomb?

No. You tell him what it looks like. You tell him what the implications are. You make sure he understands.

This was done. They chose not to charge him.

I see he was invited to bring it to the White House. I guarantee I would not be able to enter the White House carrying anything that resembled his device. I would be arrested and charged. I wouldn't even be able to carry a normal fully-intact retail clock into the White House. For even attempting, I would be detained and questioned.

 

[DrPizza]

To Ichinisan's post above. No, it doesn't look like a bomb. E.g., the bomb used in Boston looked like... a pressure cooker. The bomb used at the Oklahoma Federal Building looked like a rental truck. You and the English teacher base your reality on watching too much television instead of having a functional hobby, such as electronics.

I'm not happy with calling it racism.

There have been a huge number of terrorist attacks, over the last couple of decades (and longer). Many, many innocent people have been killed.

And a particular racial group, has mainly been involved in all the attacks.

So it sort of is and sort of is not, racialism.

The ideal solution, would be for the terrorists, to stop their terrible attacks round the world. Then anti-terrorist activities like this story, would no longer need to happen. Or at least less frequently.

To answer your question. We don't know, if they had been white. If the teacher/principle would still have contacted the police.

But I agree, it would have probably been less likely (if there had been no Islamic connection).

Not to call you wrong, but,
Theodore Kaczynski (unabomber) not Islamic
Oklahoma Federal Building bombing (McVeigh doesn't sound Arabic to me)
Centennial Olympic Park bombing - Eric Rudolph. Again, doesn't sound Arabic to me.

The list goes on and on. What have you got? 9/11 and the Boston Marathon bombing? If you want to use any random shooting of 2 or 3 people by some member of Islam - which are all reported to death when they occur, then you're going to have to balance that against all the other mass shootings by mostly white males.

Why ?

Surely they have the right to get worried about a suspicious device, which might be a bomb ?

It is just an innocent mistake.

As far as I can tell.

Initially, it was an innocent mistake by the English teacher, and a reasonable one as she was acting out of concern. But, as soon as he showed/told what it did, it went beyond innocent.

As the ultimate source, I honestly point to the media. These people see circuit boards and wires with a countdown timer on stupid cop TV shows... And honestly, how does a teacher, school admin, or standard cop even know what a REAL bomb looks like? It's quite apparent things like confuses minds that are inferior (school teachers, traffic cops).

Tis a shame that so many in the population think that kids should be sitting at home, watching television - especially cop shows, so they know what a bomb looks like. "When I was his age, I learned how to open up a bag of pork rinds with one hand while holding an RC cola in the other hand, and with a moon pie stuffed in my mouth. I don't know why a kid like that would want to have a hobby like electronics. It just doesn't make sense."

I wish there were a lot more kids like that kid, willing to create something like that, show it off to other kids, and get more kids interested in science related hobbies.

 

[Ichinisan]

To Ichinisan's post above. No, it doesn't look like a bomb. E.g., the bomb used in Boston looked like... a pressure cooker. The bomb used at the Oklahoma Federal Building looked like a rental truck. You and the English teacher base your reality on watching too much television instead of having a functional hobby, such as electronics.


Not to call you wrong, but,
Theodore Kaczynski (unabomber) not Islamic
Oklahoma Federal Building bombing (McVeigh doesn't sound Arabic to me)
Centennial Olympic Park bombing - Eric Rudolph. Again, doesn't sound Arabic to me.

The list goes on and on. What have you got? 9/11 and the Boston Marathon bombing? If you want to use any random shooting of 2 or 3 people by some member of Islam - which are all reported to death when they occur, then you're going to have to balance that against all the other mass shootings by mostly white males.


Initially, it was an innocent mistake by the English teacher, and a reasonable one as she was acting out of concern. But, as soon as he showed/told what it did, it went beyond innocent.



Tis a shame that so many in the population think that kids should be sitting at home, watching television - especially cop shows, so they know what a bomb looks like. "When I was his age, I learned how to open up a bag of pork rinds with one hand while holding an RC cola in the other hand, and with a moon pie stuffed in my mouth. I don't know why a kid like that would want to have a hobby like electronics. It just doesn't make sense."

I wish there were a lot more kids like that kid, willing to create something like that, show it off to other kids, and get more kids interested in science related hobbies.

Electronics is a hobby of mine, even more so when I was 14 years old.

How do you expect THE TEACHERS to conclude what is safe? I do not expect them to. I do not want them to.

They said it looks like a hoax bomb, and I agree. That's exactly what it looks like.

 

[Ichinisan]

I wish there were a lot more kids like that kid, willing to create something like that, show it off to other kids, and get more kids interested in science related hobbies.

By all appearances, he crammed the guts of a clock into a box and didn't even mount the AC transformer.

At his age, I had soldering equipment, over $1,000 worth of Heathkit stuff (I think it was over $2k), and a full course on VHS. This was all from my poor single mother, raising twins on welfare. Other than that, there was no government subsidy.

I'm looking for any indication that he has done something more than haphazardly cramming stuff into a box.

 

[CZroe]

35 years ago I started the Electronics class in my High School and the first project was a digital clock from a 555 Timer chip.

Sad to see in 2015 that Electronics class is considered Terrist.

That clearly isn't what this is. He gutted a commercially produced clock, threw away the housing, and stuck it in a box. Now, I hope he learned something in the process (entirely possible) and I believe his curiosity should be encouraged, but we need to stop feeding his delusion that this is his "invention" or even something he made. He's 14 years old and still calling it "my invention." When I was 14 I was taking real electronics courses at home and was would not even remotely consider this an "invention."

 

[brianmanahan]

I hated all types of programming. I don't have the patience to figure out where a ' ' is missing in 9,000 pages of text. But I'll sit there and troubleshoot a circuit all day long. Go figure.

programming is funner because you are not constrained by reality

 

[Red Squirrel]

Do we really want non-experts (teachers) to immediately conclude any suspicious device is 100% safe without asking experts?

To me this is the most important thing that needs to actually happen before people are dubbed criminals. If someone brings something suspicious that device should be reviewed by someone that can actually confirm what it does. In this case they should have gotten the science teacher to look at it. You don't even need an EE background to realize that a circuit board and wiring is not a bomb when there is no actual explosive charge on it. This should have been dismissed before the cops were even involved.

Unfortunately we live in a world where authorities are often not exactly very smart and will not make smart judgement calls before they go ahead and ruin someone's life.

 

[SOFTengCOMPelec]

Not to call you wrong, but,
Theodore Kaczynski (unabomber) not Islamic
Oklahoma Federal Building bombing (McVeigh doesn't sound Arabic to me)
Centennial Olympic Park bombing - Eric Rudolph. Again, doesn't sound Arabic to me.

The list goes on and on. What have you got? 9/11 and the Boston Marathon bombing? If you want to use any random shooting of 2 or 3 people by some member of Islam - which are all reported to death when they occur, then you're going to have to balance that against all the other mass shootings by mostly white males.

I agree with you, that on a country by country basis.
Most particular countries, have a mixture, of terrorist types. But when you look at the news (since 9/11), on a world wide scale.
One regularly gets the impression, that a particular religious group has lots of terrorists, who desire to try to kill many westerners, and other people, around the world.

If you just catch a bit of the news. "country xyz..ia, a suicide bomber has just blown up 20 people. Thoughts of it being that particular, religious group, immediately spring to mind. From what I have heard.

Anyway, one can find a live, terrorists, bomb just about anywhere, potentially. We should always be vigilant.

Initially, it was an innocent mistake by the English teacher, and a reasonable one as she was acting out of concern. But, as soon as he showed/told what it did, it went beyond innocent.

It's reasonable for the Police to take time to decide what to do. They had found a device, which could, at the very least, be seriously considered as being a fake bomb device.
If it is true that the boy was being difficult (uncooperative), when the Police asked questions, about the device.
Then they are within their rights. To take him in for questioning and further processing.

In some respects, the boy has been lucky.

If they had evacuated the School, and brought in swat and/or bomb disposal teams. It could have hit the headlines. If they had reason to believe that he did it on purpose (fake bomb).
He could be in very serious trouble now.

 

[disappoint]

If he had just been honest about the whole thing.

"Here's a clock I dismantled! Where's my validation bitch?"

 

[waggy]

I agree with you, that on a country by country basis.
Most particular countries, have a mixture, of terrorist types. But when you look at the news (since 9/11), on a world wide scale.
One regularly gets the impression, that a particular religious group has lots of terrorists, who desire to try to kill many westerners, and other people, around the world.

If you just catch a bit of the news. "country xyz..ia, a suicide bomber has just blown up 20 people. Thoughts of it being that particular, religious group, immediately spring to mind. From what I have heard.

Anyway, one can find a live, terrorists, bomb just about anywhere, potentially. We should always be vigilant.



It's reasonable for the Police to take time to decide what to do. They had found a device, which could, at the very least, be seriously considered as being a fake bomb device.
If it is true that the boy was being difficult (uncooperative), when the Police asked questions, about the device.
Then they are within their rights. To take him in for questioning and further processing.

In some respects, the boy has been lucky.

If they had evacuated the School, and brought in swat and/or bomb disposal teams. It could have hit the headlines. If they had reason to believe that he did it on purpose (fake bomb).
He could be in very serious trouble now.

what?

HE told them its a clock. what else could he do? he didn't build something to look like a bomb. he did't hint it's a bomb.

he showed it to his engineering teacher. told him it was a clock.

he wasn't being difficult. he admitted what it was.

If he had just been honest about the whole thing.

"Here's a clock I dismantled! Where's my validation bitch?"

he was..he told them from the start it was a clock.

even the cops have said that. in fact they are upset that's all he would say it was.

 

[CZroe]

To me this is the most important thing that needs to actually happen before people are dubbed criminals. If someone brings something suspicious that device should be reviewed by someone that can actually confirm what it does. In this case they should have gotten the science teacher to look at it. You don't even need an EE background to realize that a circuit board and wiring is not a bomb when there is no actual explosive charge on it. This should have been dismissed before the cops were even involved.

Unfortunately we live in a world where authorities are often not exactly very smart and will not make smart judgement calls before they go ahead and ruin someone's life.

So, as an electronics guy, if someone asked me to investigate a device they thought was suspicious or likely to be a bomb, I am obligated to put my life on the line and risk my personal safety instead of calling the public safety officials trained to deal with this stuff safely? I don't have an ROV like the bomb squad has.

I'm glad no science teachers were asked to investigate Eric and Dylan's bombs.

 

[Ichinisan]

To me this is the most important thing that needs to actually happen before people are dubbed criminals.

He's not dubbed as a "criminal." He was told that it resembles a hoax bomb (it absolutely does). They told him the implications and decided not to charge him with anything.

That's exactly how it should happen.
That's exactly how it did happen.

If someone brings something suspicious that device should be reviewed by someone that can actually confirm what it does. In this case they should have gotten the science teacher to look at it.

LOL! It's the responsibility of science teachers to inspect possible hoax bombs?

You don't even need an EE background to realize that a circuit board and wiring is not a bomb when there is no actual explosive charge on it.

How did you concluded there's no explosive charge? Did you look behind the giant numeric display? Did you check to see if a flap at the bottom could be lifted to reveal anything below? Does someone without an EE background somehow know what an inductive transformer is and what it's supposed to look like? They might immediately suspect that a big, heavy component tightly wrapped with tape and wire is potentially an explosive component. Many ignorant people still think almost any of their electronic devices has the potential to explode.

This should have been dismissed before the cops were even involved.

Wrong. Should we dismiss everything that looks exactly like a hoax bomb? Really?!

Unfortunately we live in a world where authorities are often not exactly very smart and will not make smart judgement calls before they go ahead and ruin someone's life.

Did the authorities make the wrong decision here? Did they ruin his life? I think not.

 

[Ichinisan]

"Ruined his life."

Judging by what happened today, it's the best thing that ever happened to him.

 

[Red Squirrel]

lol just because there's a timer on it does not mean it looks like a bomb. By that note I'm guessing microwave ovens should be banned in schools. It even has a count down timer on noes! Just need someone to hide behind it to yell Allahu Akbar when someone's food is ready.

And anyone with half a brain will know that an inductor can't explode. This is why they should not just let some random person with absolutely zero knowledge make the decision of if a person should get arrested. I said the science teacher as an example, as that is probably someone who would have enough common sense to say it's not a bomb and tell the others to move on.

"oh noes it looks scary, all these exposed circuits!11!!"

 

[Red Squirrel]

"Ruined his life."

Judging by what happened today, it's the best thing that ever happened to him.

Yeah now he has a record that this happened, and wont be able to find a job in the future. This is the best thing alright... Even if in the end they may have dropped the charges there will more than likely be a record of the incident and his name in an actual government list.

 

[Ichinisan]

lol just because there's a timer on it does not mean it looks like a bomb. By that note I'm guessing microwave ovens should be banned in schools. It even has a count down timer on noes! Just need someone to hide behind it to yell Allahu Akbar when someone's food is ready.

And anyone with half a brain will know that an inductor can't explode. This is why they should not just let some random person with absolutely zero knowledge make the decision of if a person should get arrested. I said the science teacher as an example, as that is probably someone who would have enough common sense to say it's not a bomb and tell the others to move on.

"oh noes it looks scary, all these exposed circuits!11!!"

Haven't even read past the first line, but you're deluding yourself if you don't think an overwhelming majority of people would take one look and conclude that's a hoax bomb.

[edit]
They had the right people look at it. I wouldn't have blamed them for evacuating the school, but they didn't do that. I specifically mentioned the transformer because you cannot expect people to know that it's "safe."

It's not safe, BTW. The thing isn't mounted and has 120v AC connected to it.

 

[SOFTengCOMPelec]

what?

HE told them its a clock. what else could he do? he didn't build something to look like a bomb. he did't hint it's a bomb.

he showed it to his engineering teacher. told him it was a clock.

he wasn't being difficult. he admitted what it was.



he was..he told them from the start it was a clock.

even the cops have said that. in fact they are upset that's all he would say it was.

After more searching on information about the story.

The Police seemed to eventually realize it was not a real bomb.

But he had cut out (or something), a section of the brief case. So that the clock display was actively showing, through.
Just like a number of bombs do, in the movies.

I.e. They often show red digits, counting down to zero. When the bomb will explode, unless the correct colour, of red or blue wire, is cut in time.
The wrong one causes the bomb to go off immediately.

So the Police seem to be saying, that he was aiming to on purpose, construct such a hoax bomb. They did not believe his "clock" story, enough, to leave him alone.

So he was arrested, for the fake bomb device.

Different sources/parties, seem to be giving conflicting answers, about the blame, as regards his arrest.

tl;dr
The Police blame the boy.
The boys, associates, blame the school/Police etc.

I'm not sure either way, if he made it look like a hoax bomb on purpose, or not.

Hopefully, he did not do it on purpose.

 

[Ichinisan]

Yeah now he has a record that this happened, and wont be able to find a job in the future. This is the best thing alright... Even if in the end they may have dropped the charges there will more than likely be a record of the incident and his name in an actual government list.

Right now, eeeeeverybody thinks this kid will work for NASA someday because he was wearing a NASA shirt (how convenient). He's going to meet the President. He's not going to have any problem getting employment...even if this somehow turns out to be a full-blown calculated hoax.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Haven't even read past the first line, but you're deluding yourself if you don't think an overwhelming majority of people would take one look and conclude that's a hoax bomb.

[edit]
They had the right people look at it. I wouldn't have blamed them for evacuating the school, but they didn't do that. I specifically mentioned the transformer because you cannot expect people to know that it's "safe."

It's not safe, BTW. The thing isn't mounted and has 120v AC connected to it.

And those people should not be allowed to make decisions about somebody's fate. This is what's wrong with the way the policing system works now days. It's all based on fear mongering and misinformation to accuse someone before the facts are actually checked by someone who has half a brain to determine the person is not actually criminal.

 

[CZroe]

lol just because there's a timer on it does not mean it looks like a bomb. By that note I'm guessing microwave ovens should be banned in schools. It even has a count down timer on noes! Just need someone to hide behind it to yell Allahu Akbar when someone's food is ready.

And anyone with half a brain will know that an inductor can't explode. This is why they should not just let some random person with absolutely zero knowledge make the decision of if a person should get arrested. I said the science teacher as an example, as that is probably someone who would have enough common sense to say it's not a bomb and tell the others to move on.

"oh noes it looks scary, all these exposed circuits!11!!"

Stop pretending that it was just the timer that made it suspicious. That is not an honest discussion tactic and you know it.

Look at any checklist for suspicious packages. Specifically, I've seen this one at three different workplaces:
https://about.usps.com/posters/pos84.pdf
Protruding wires - Check (AC cord and wire he tied the damaged case closed with)
Lopsided packaging - Check (dented/damaged case with a hole cut in the side; unable to latch closed)

There was more than enough to call it in as either a hoax or a suspicious package. Sure, it doesn't look like a real bomb (real bombs don't say "Look at me! I light up, count-down, and tick/beep!"), but you act like you've never been told what a suspicious package looks like.

It isn't right to ask science teachers or whoever else "with a brain" to put their lives on the line by expecting them investigate suspicious packages. What if they were asked to investigate Eric and Dylan's bombs and died in the process? You see that part on the USPS poster that says "Isolate area immediately?" How do you interpret that to mean "send in ill-equipped innocent people to check it out?"