Thoughts on 'paid leave'?

[VW MAN]

No, just the cost of it. Having a man off work for 12 weeks would cost me $24K.

So wrong....but I will let your tiny moronic brain try and figure out why

 

[Zorba]

Where I'm from (Germany) it's 12 months mandatory paid leave and 14 if the father wants two months BUT you have the right to request twice that and this can be done up to the childs 8'th birthday.

Employers plan ahead as notice is given and that's fine. Obviously the days for sick leaver or for taking care of your sick child are not regulated, as it works in any civilized nation.

Naturally your paid vacation is not counted towards any of that so you'll still get your four weeks every year (which is a bit low compared to other nations) so you can add that in there.

Is that on companies to pay for, or does the government pay for some of it?

 

[Zorba]

Paying people to do not work is a bad idea. If you want Family leave, fine. Go use your PTO/Vacation time. You want to be paid to be off work and still retain all your other time off as well? Sorry, but you cant have your cake and eat it too.

PTO is also paying people to not work.

 

[Zorba]

We've had a shortage of trade workers for well as long as I can remember. This void has long been filled by illegal labor from abroad and not just Mexico...lots of Poles when I was in Chicago. Instead of increasing the legal supply of this labor through immigration and doing tighter regulation of employers we've just pushed it under the table, which is traditionally how America usually chooses to deal with policy problems.

I wonder if a big reason there aren't a lot of Americans wanting to go into this field is because of the mentality of people like BoomerD. Why bust your ass at a job in the heat, for shit pay and zero benefits, all so you have a bad back by 45.

 

[digiram]

Part of having a good standard of living in your beloved country, no? Just bow to your corporate overlords I suppose. I still don’t get how right wingers complain about corporate censorship. Maybe we should tax em more and give em less power? Otherwise shut up and take your microchip.

 

[MrSquished]

PTO is also paying people to not work.

Critical thinking skills aren't exactly a feature of right wingers. In fact quite the opposite

 

[FelixDeCat]

PTO is also paying people to not work.

Yes, but PTO is earned along with your tenure, performance and per paycheck.

This paid family leave garbage is a handout employers are forced to pay.

 

[nickqt]

Yes, but PTO is earned along with your tenure, performance and per paycheck.

This paid family leave garbage is a handout employers are forced to pay.

Want to do business in America, follow American laws.

Next topic.

 

[MrSquished]

Yes, but PTO is earned along with your tenure, performance and per paycheck.

This paid family leave garbage is a handout employers are forced to pay.

You make no sense. Family leave can be just as earned PTO as regular vacation days. It's still earned by you working at the company. They are both PTO, just for different reasons. This isn't hard to grasp, unless you are a dishonest GQP'er.

 

[Jaskalas]

Thoughts on 'paid leave'?

Sounds like something Basic Income would generally cover fairly well. Takes it off the backs of employers, but ensures people have the security to do what they need.

 

[dank69]

Whether or not a company offers a benefit should be up to the company. Maybe by choice. Maybe by contract negotiations. It should NOT be required by law.

Alright derpface, if you let anyone not offer the benefit, very few companies would be able to voluntarily put themselves at a huge competitive disadvantage by offering them. It's all or nothing, and that isn't a secret so I'm not sure why you don't understand it.

Paying people to do not work is a bad idea. ...

As evidenced by all the countries currently doing it now for the past 30+ years without issue. Is this what passes as a compelling argument in your circles?

 

[dank69]

Sounds like something Basic Income would generally cover fairly well. Takes it off the backs of employers, but ensures people have the security to do what they need.

Easiest, most effective system by far to implement. No means testing, instances of fraud should be extremely minimal with good planning, and you could even tax it right back from rich people. Combined with a consumption tax with similar progressive mechanisms could transform government overnight. Thousands of government workers in hundreds of departments could be instead working on meaningful infrastructure projects all over the nation. No let's complicate everything because my brain can't comprehend a "lazy" person getting a steady paycheck without yelling at socialism clouds

 

[woolfe9998]

The world obviously does. But that doesn't mean we should make it harder for professionals to have kids.

Principally because we aren't developing sustainably, especially in reference to the use of fossil fuels. Without fossil fuel use, we could expand population quite a lot more without issue. We produce a large surplus of food yearly, and waste gigatons of it. The developing world could double their food production with advanced farming equipment.

 

[Meghan54]

No, just the cost of it. Having a man off work for 12 weeks would cost me $24K.

Why? Are you going to refuse to allow the govt. to cover the cost and instead try to be a martyr on the altar of stupidity?

 

[fskimospy]

No, just the cost of it. Having a man off work for 12 weeks would cost me $24K.

Ok so if all your competitors had to do the same…

 

[Leeea]

I couldn't imagine paying an employee to stay home for twelve weeks, that's $24k that I have to pay.
Who pays for my leave? Who pays for my health care? Who pays for my vacations? Who pays half of my SS taxes?
Funding all of that would cut my customer base by 85%, and end my business overnight.

-blinks-

Your panicking over nothing.

Most likely they would do it the exact same way as they already did paid covid leave.

Lines 11b and 11d on your Form 941. Just a credit toward your payroll taxes, does not cost you a penny. If your using QuickBooks for your payroll, it automates this away.


This is not going to effect you anymore more then your staff that had to take paid covid leave.

 

[Pipeline 1010]

Allowing time off is one thing. Paying you to stay home and burp a kid is another.

Bonding time between parent and child is pretty important. it is also very beneficial to help the parents adjust to a new human being in their household and develop routine. It helps the parents bond. I think there are very strong benefits long term from allowing this for parents of a newborn.

By the way, framing it as "to stay home and burp a kid" is pretty fucking condescending. I don't understand how this became a political issue anyway...this shouldn't even be a right vs left thing. The right STRONGLY believes in the nuclear family unit, right? Then why fight so hard against the ability to establish this close family bond?

Who does your job while you're out? Do they hire somebody else temporarily, raising costs by paying two people? Or do they offload your duties onto someone else, increasing their job load?

Well, what do they do when you take a month vacation? Or when you get 9 paid holidays? Or when you get Covid and have to quarantine for 20 days? Should you not get any of this? Should you not take time off for a honeymoon? Do businesses that allow this all just fail? Why don't they fail in other countries due to parental leave?

Now that I think of it, don't businesses have MONTHS of notice in advance of the childbirth? I kind of feel like if a company is so constantly close to failure that some parental leave for a new kid makes or breaks them then that company was poorly run and was going to fail anyway. They need to pull themselves up by their bootstraps and stop whining about how people owe them stuff. The business owner needs to start working hard and stop asking for handouts.

 

[Greenman]

Ok so if all your competitors had to do the same…

Did you miss the part about some of them not running above board operations?
You'd be surprised at how many people hire unlicensed contractors to save a few bucks.

 

[Zorba]

Principally because we aren't developing sustainably, especially in reference to the use of fossil fuels. Without fossil fuel use, we could expand population quite a lot more without issue. We produce a large surplus of food yearly, and waste gigatons of it. The developing world could double their food production with advanced farming equipment.

We are blowing through resources like there is no tomorrow. Sucking ground water dry all over the world. Trash filling up the oceans. In the midst of the 6th mass extinction event in world history. The best thing you can do for the environment is not have a kid, especially in a first world country.

That doesn't mean we should ban kids, or not have parental leave. But to claim the world doesn't have a population problem is just wrong.

 

[Zorba]

Sounds like something Basic Income would generally cover fairly well. Takes it off the backs of employers, but ensures people have the security to do what they need.

Many/most families couldn't/wouldn't take the pay cut for 8-12 weeks.

 

[Zorba]

By the way, framing it as "to stay home and burp a kid" is pretty fucking condescending. I don't understand how this became a political issue anyway...this shouldn't even be a right vs left thing. The right STRONGLY believes in the nuclear family unit, right? Then why fight so hard against the ability to establish this close family bond?

In the nuclear family the dad has nothing to do with care taking, and the wife stays home. That is why the right doesn't believe in paid family leave.

Speaking of, under FMLA, if a husband and wife work at the same company the company can make them share the 12-weeks of FMLA, instead of each getting their own.

 

[purbeast0]

My second son was born during covid in August of 2020. It's been a big time blessing to be working from home since that time being able to help and see him grow daily and my wife has also been at home since then. Her plan was to take off anyways but covid forced her to be out of work months before she gave birth.

 

[MrSquished]

We are blowing through resources like there is no tomorrow. Sucking ground water dry all over the world. Trash filling up the oceans. In the midst of the 6th mass extinction event in world history. The best thing you can do for the environment is not have a kid, especially in a first world country.

That doesn't mean we should ban kids, or not have parental leave. But to claim the world doesn't have a population problem is just wrong.

Here's the thing, no overpopulation issues are in first world developed nations with parental leave. Parental leave in first world industrialized nation contributes absolutely zero to this issue.

The issue is wealth inequality, a lack of environmentalism, a disposable goods mentality, not helping undeveloped countries, religion and anti sex education values and anti women's choice issues or access to reproductive healthcare making people in certain areas make too many people. We can fix these things instead of spending all those resources on going to Mars, a place that would be infinitely more expensive to make habitable rather than fixing the fucking gorgeous habitable planet we have now.

Look at pretty much all of Scandinavia and most of western Europe where parental leave goes along with developed and industrialized nations and you will see zero overpopulation. There is no issue there.

What you do see is overconsumption of goods driving the trash and resource binging issues because of the over proliferation of disposable consumer capitalism as the only way to go, driven by us here in the united states. I mean I like some of the products this gives us but it's becoming too much I think. Life was ok before a lot of this shit when you think about it.

 

[Pipeline 1010]

In the nuclear family the dad has nothing to do with care taking, and the wife stays home. That is why the right doesn't believe in paid family leave.

No, by nuclear family, they mean a male father, a female mother, and children. And that family will ideally like each other and bond because that's how it should be. And if the kid does drugs or joins a gang or fails school it's because the father wasn't there. But dammit it kinda seems like they don't want the father there. Because that would hurt companies.

I LIKE the idea of the nuclear family. Whatever structure that is. I LIKE the idea of a father or parent taking responsibility for raising the child and being there. But if you advocate for that and then fight it FROM DAY ONE OF CHILDBIRTH, then you never actually believed in it...you were just using it as an excuse to be a condescending prick to families who have problems.

Speaking of, under FMLA, if a husband and wife work at the same company the company can make them share the 12-weeks of FMLA, instead of each getting their own.

Wow, I didn't know that. I can understand from a small business perspective how hard it would be to lose 2 employees at the same time for 1/4 year. I totally empathize with that. But if, as a society, we decide that bonding is important, there should be some protection for businesses to cover this time period. I think we should not only support the lost costs financially, but support the costs of training the temp worker(s).

I'm not a huge fan of taxes, and not a huge fan of government. But, having experienced only being allowed a week off to handle the birth of and to be with my firstborn, I have firsthand knowledge of how difficult it was to only have a very short period off. Labor lasted almost 2 full days, got home from the hospital 2 days after that, so it really only covered a single day to bond at home. I feel like this is a prime example of how government could step in to help and it would be beneficial in the short/mid/long term.

 

[woolfe9998]

We are blowing through resources like there is no tomorrow. Sucking ground water dry all over the world. Trash filling up the oceans. In the midst of the 6th mass extinction event in world history. The best thing you can do for the environment is not have a kid, especially in a first world country.

That doesn't mean we should ban kids, or not have parental leave. But to claim the world doesn't have a population problem is just wrong.

Every analysis I've seen says world population growth is already on the decline, and is projected to stop by the end of the this century, topping out at about 10 to 11 billion. Example:

World population growth is expected to nearly stop by 2100

For the first time in modern history, the world’s population is expected to virtually stop growing by the end of this century.

www.pewresearch.org

We need to focus on avoiding overconsumption of key resources, and ending fossil fuel use, not population control measures.