This is what happens when hardware reviewers smoke too much crack

[Ilmater]

Anyone looking to buy a Panaflo fan? Wanna know how they perform? Let me tell you where NOT to get advice from:

Link to the PC Extreme review

To make this as easy as possible for you, I'll list all of the specs of the Panaflo 80mm line:

L1A - 24cfm @ 21dBA @ 1900rpm
M1A - 32.1cfm @ 28dBA @ 2450rpm
H1A - 39.6cfm @ 32dBA @ 2950rpm
U1A - 46.9cfm @ 38.2dBA @ 3450rpm

Now, here is what the reviewer is claiming to be reviewing:

I have reviewed one 80mm Panaflo fan here for testing, this model is the low end model, but let me tell you, I was surprised to see how well this fan performed when it was only the low end model.

But later, he says:

EliteCool.com were kind enough to supply me with 1 80mm fan, which is the mid-range model. EliteCool also has the 1 higher end, and 1 lower end Panaflo fan as well.

Didn't he just say it was the low-end model?? Anyway, I assume that he means the M1A, but I don't know. Here are the specs for the part that he lists. In italics are my comments:

46.98cfm <-- this corresponds to a U1A
44dB <-- this doesn't correspond to any Panaflo 80mm fan, so who knows
2950rpm [same as the H1A] (it is supposed to be 2500 [M1A] according to the site but mine is running at 2950[H1A] ...)
Input Power: 3 Watts <-- the U1A is 3.24W
Current: .25 Amps <-- the U1A is .27

Then he has a picture of "the fan" which is clearly a U1A because of the model number (ends in a U).

Next, he compares the fan to an LED 80mm fan that he already had. He says:

As you can see, there was 14 CFM difference in air flow and a +12 dba change in noise level, it was pretty much a draw, but the Panaflo offers more air flow at the same decible level.

You mean to tell me that by increasing the cfm by a factor of ~43% and increasing the noise levels by (remember, every three decibels is twice the noise) a factor of 1600% that it's a fair trade?! Even if his original dB numbers were wrong, the U1A still makes almost 400% more noise. So I'd disagree with his sentiments, but you can come to your own conclusions.

Then he tests the fan (I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and assume that he kept the same ambient room temperature) and says that it dropped case temps by 6C and CPU temps by 2C, which is fine (and very likely).

What's his conclusion (my issues in italics again)?

It's all well and good to have massive CFM flowing through your case or radiator, but this usually comes as a compromise to the noise levels [and this differs from our current situation, how?]. Things like the Delta fan push through a lot of air, but also sound similar to a mini hairdryer at the same time[see last comment]! For some people, this noise wouldn't worry them (I put up with a 80mm TORNADO for a while) but others simply can't stand any extra noise.

The Panaflo fans are certainly recommended if you want to increase your case cooling without increasing the noise levels too much I don't think there's "technical" definition for "too much" but...]. Although I only looked at the low end 80mm version, the same quality and low noise levels should carry across the entire range[again with the "low-noise" claims, this is getting tiring].

Overall, the Panaflo 80mm is an outstanding product and the only "con" is that it had no commercial packaging. I give it an overall rating of 4X 's.

And my overall rating for his review? Three blunts and a crack rock. We license people to drive, maybe we should license some hardware reviewers.

P.S. Oh, and just before you say, "Maybe he didn't know the correct specs of the fan," he has a link to Panaflo's fans in his review. That means that he doesn't even have an excuse for not knowing.

 

[amcdonald]

his only "con" was that it didn't have retail packaging...
How does that even matter at all... its a freakin oem case fan.

As you can see the packaging was a little shabby, i would have like to see this fan in its own box or something, maybe a little more padding. But the fan arrived in perfect condition so i guess this will do.

Thats in reference to the supplier, not the product...
He had absolutely no information on his testing other than his idle temps, when load is way more important...

I had tried to setup a recording of the noise levels, but unfortunately the background noise was too high during the recordings.

??? He couldn't isolate them?
overall a very poorly done review. This guy shouldn't be writing reviews... he could at least look at how other reviews are written and compare.

 

[muddocktor]

Also, if you check the link to elitecool, it does go to a Panaflo H1A fan, with the correct specs. If you look at the enlarged view of the fan he says he tested, it is a U series fan, not an H series.:disgust: If you look around elitecool's site, they also sell the U1A 80mm Panaflo fans too. This guy is too dumb to even know what the hell he's testing.

All I can say is that this person better not quit his day job to live on his reveiwing prowness.

 

[Ilmater]

We can only hope that he HAS a day job, and that he'll go back to it.

 

[BadAttitude]

You guys have some valid points, but this was this kid's first review EVER. He is not a seasoned veteran that is why his first review was a fan. A FAN... Not a huge investment folks. If you really care to criticize his work, then why not email him yourself (rob@pcextreme.net) and try to help the kid out and be a bit constructive instead of tearing him down on a public board.
He is still learning, and is a very bright kid. If he didn't get the specs right, let him know. I think he may have had it right before the edit, but I never saw the fan so I can't say for sure. I'm sure he will do a bit more homework in future reviews after all the harassment he got from guys like yourselves, but come on cut the kid a break.
Wanna make a difference? Help him out...

 

[amcdonald]

Originally posted by: BadAttitude
You guys have some valid points, but this was this kid's first review EVER. He is not a seasoned veteran that is why his first review was a fan. A FAN... Not a huge investment folks. If you really care to criticize his work, then why not email him yourself (rob@pcextreme.net) and try to help the kid out and be a bit constructive instead of tearing him down on a public board.
He is still learning, and is a very bright kid. If he didn't get the specs right, let him know. I think he may have had it right before the edit, but I never saw the fan so I can't say for sure. I'm sure he will do a bit more homework in future reviews after all the harassment he got from guys like yourselves, but come on cut the kid a break.
Wanna make a difference? Help him out...

Look most of our posts, I & others pointed out some major flaws in the review.
There is no disclaimer that says "I am a bright young kid with no reviewing experience, so don't take this too seriously when considering what fan to buy."
People might go to this review, not see past his mistakes, and end up misguided.
See why this is a bad idea? its even worse for your website because there's an association.
I don't know anything about you or the website, because I didn't look at anything after I read that article...
I don't mean to tear him down on this board, just his article.
I'm sure he's smart, but the review is not good.
Sorry if I seem harsh in this reply, I only mean well.
I completely encourage more reviews, as they really help people out...
but there's gotta be some kind of editing before it ends up getting disected here, ya know?

 

[BadAttitude]

Absolutely, I agree. And I really appreciate any kind of feedback, to better the site and reviews.
At one time I did all the reviews myself, but it got to be too much for one guy to handle, so I started letting other guys help out who voluteered. With that comes a bit of liability and I have made plenty of mistakes myself, don't get me wrong.

After reading completely through the thread, I have to say that Ilmater knows his stuff, and his criticism is even tastefully comical.
I see your side of course, but I feel bad for this kid because it really was his first review. I sent him a link to this thread, so perhaps he can see that people actually read those reviews, and to be more careful in the future.

I have learned a lot doing reviews, and try to be as thorough as I can. Please take a look at a few others, and send me some feedback.

Take care,

Dwayne

 

[Ilmater]

I completely agree with amcdonald. When I read a hardware review, I assume that the reviewer really knows his/her (Look at me! I'm politically correct!) way around hardware. Thus, when I read reviews like this, I assume that the reviewer isn't as smart as he/she thinks they are.

That being said, if the review was opened with the statement, "This is my first review, please feel free to give me your feedback..." then I completely give them the benefit of the doubt. This is obviously not that popular of a thread, so I don't think that there's any harm done. In the future, if you'd like, I'd be willing to offer my time to you to take a look at any reviews that Rob puts out. I'm far from saying that I'm any kind of expert, and I might not even know as much about hardware as Rob and yourself, but I do have three things going for me:

1) I've had nothing to do at work for the last 6 months (they swear it's coming around the corner) and I've read at least 4 or 5 reviews a day, so I know what to look for in a good/bad review, and I know a lot about not only current technology and future technology.

2) I've got good grammar skills. That can't hurt, right?

3) I've got lots of free time, and I'd be happy to spend it giving his reviews a once-over.

It's just a thought, but I would be happy to give constructive criticism to any reviews. If you're interested, just PM me.

Considering it was his first review, I hope he doesn't take any of this to heart. Good luck in the future.

 

[Robage]

Hello, this is Rob.

I am the one all you guys are dissin' on and I can say you are really immature for doing so and I do NOT appreciate it.

I am a brand new reviewer and that was my first review ever, I was really excited that my name was actually on a website on the Internet!! I mean, that was like the coolest thing to me. Now to get totally trashed by some people I don't even know... It hurts.

But I do appreciate some of your advice and opinions...I think it would be better if you gave feedback in a positive way rather then a negative. I also have found a temporary relief to some questions you have. The supplier from EliteCool had accidentally sent me the wrong fan... I was supposed to be reviewing the H1A Panaflo fan, but I got sent the U1A. So thinking I had the H1A (and I wasn't sure how to read the model number) I just assumed so. So I put the specs mostly of the H1A, but then I realized something was wrong and I though I had the right specs and that is where everything went horribly wrong.

I have had the review re-edited to fix a few things such as the Specs... I hope it is somewhat decent, but I know there is many a things wrong with it. I hope my mistake has not lead you to believe that PC Extreme is a bad site and we do bad reviews, because we certainly don't. I look forward to your positive feed back on my upcoming review of a DangerDen watercooling kit and a Lian-Li case, talk to you then.

 

[GroundedSailor]

Originally posted by: Robage
Hello, this is Rob.

I am the one all you guys are dissin' on and I can say you are really immature for doing so and I do NOT appreciate it.

I am a brand new reviewer and that was my first review ever, I was really excited that my name was actually on a website on the Internet!! I mean, that was like the coolest thing to me. Now to get totally trashed by some people I don't even know... It hurts.

Welcome to AT.

Don't feel bad - you're being criticized by the best of the best -AT'ers!! People on this board really know their stuff and all said & done Ilmater points were valid and he was not trashing you rater he was just being sarcastic. Take it as constructive criticism from your peers.

Hope to see more of you around here.

 

[Robage]

Ok it has been edited... But I have now found out my original specs were correct! Here is a direct quote from EliteCool.com (Where I got the fan) Here is the link for this: http://www.elitecool.com/product_info.php?cPath=25&products_id=76

Fan Specs:
Dimensions: 80x80x25mm
Air Flow: 46.9 CFM
Noise: 44 dB
Fan Speed: ? (Not listed on the EliteCool.com site)
Current: .36 Amps
Input Power: 4.32 Watts
Voltage: 12 Volts
Bearing: Hydrowave bearing
Connector: 3 pin

Here is what you said I had wrong with the Spec part of my review.

46.98cfm <<-- this corresponds to a U1A
44dB <<-- this doesn't correspond to any Panaflo 80mm fan, so who knows
2950rpm [same as the H1A] (it is supposed to be 2500 [M1A] according to the site but mine is running at 2950[H1A] ...)
Input Power: 3 Watts <<-- the U1A is 3.24W
Current: .25 Amps <<-- the U1A is .27

Those were the exact specs I had on there when you guys criticized it, this makes me angry because I believe I was correct on this part of the review, please be more careful when you make such harsh comments in the future. But you were right that this is NOT the low end fan, I did mess up there. Obviously, either you are wrong, or EliteCool is wrong. I take EliteCool on this one because they are the ones who were kind enough to supply me with this fan and for their benefit I took their specs.

Also, I don?t have a day job, I'm only 15 and you could say school is my job right now.

 

[lordbob99]

hey rob,

don't worry bout it... no matter what you end up doing in life, there's always gonna be someone out there to bash on you as soon as you make a little mistake. just take whatever positive notes you can take out of someone's comments and just move on with life. if we all spent our time worrying about some jerk's non-constructive comments then we'd all probably never get anything done.

i think it's pretty cool that ur doing reviews already at the age of 15. sure wish i had the opportunity to do stuff like that 6 years ago

LordBob99

 

[lumen]

As a merchandise reviewer myself I've just got to say to Rob, you need to toughen up kid. If you plan to do any more of this I guarentee you will hear a lot worse. Second, negative criticism is just as valid as the positive sort, and even more helpful I find. Get used to it is the best advice I can offer, the best way to deal with negative criticism is respond in a professional manner and get over it... and as they say in showbiz, you are never as bad or as good as people say you are.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Learn to love the flame. I actively want flame to post for fun on my site.

 

[Ilmater]

Hey Rob. Listen, don't take any of this personally. The reason I was as harsh as I was was because of the fact that, other than the issues that I pointed out, it looked like a professional review. If I thought it was obvious that a 15-year-old was writing the review, I wouldn't have said anything. Like I said, there was nothing in the review that made me think you were a first-time reviewer. Like I've also said, I've read a TON of reviews, so you should take that as a complement. Besides, as you've pointed out, you took Elitecool's information for granted, which is totally fine. The mistake is theirs.

Now, that being said, I would suggest changing the dBA rating to 38.2. I can't say for sure why in the world Elitecool lists those specs, but both the manufacturer of the fans (Panaflo's website) and Gizzo's Fan Database list the specs that I listed. I understand wanting to be faithful to the site that was kind enough to supply you with the fan for review, but I can't imagine that they would be upset because you used the manufacturer's numbers that were lower than theirs. That could only help their sales, after all.

Just my two cents.

 

[OulOat]

Since you want constructive advice, here I go...

1) Make a table and list out the specs of fans next to each other, so the reader doesn't have to scroll down to compare. I'm sure you guys know enough HTML to make it look nice too.

2) Spell check. Nothing is more annoying than a document with misspelled words. I.E. "descided."

3) The actual review. Test more. If all scientists stopped after a single experiment, we'll be either dead or slaves of monkeys. I know a fan isn't exactly the most glamorous thing to review, but be creative. Test it in multiple computers, and at different voltages. Better yet, wait until you have lots of different fans and then rank them.

4) Professionalism. The following is a lack of it. "That isn't that bad...but the following shocked me! I put the fan in the same spot, ran the computer idle again for 2 hours, watched the case temp...and it leveled off at 30 degrees C!!! that is a 6 degree drop! OMG! This fan rules! My CPU temp dropped 2 degrees from 42 degrees to 40." If you want readers to take you seriously, write seriously. Take a look at any reviews from Tom's Hardware or Anandtech if you haven't. And also, never ever use exclamation marks or OMG unless Jebus in a bikini appears before you.

5) Assuming you were right, 44db is loud. Most people can barely hear a 21db panaflo L1A, so that fan would be more than 200 times louder (logarithmic scale) that the L1A. At least, compare the noise levels between the two fans that you have chosen. Lastly, because of #3, I find the conclusion somewhat lacking.


I hope this doesn't deter you from future reviews. Just learn from your mistakes and improve your work. You can, and should, ask us to preview your next review (sort of like a beta-testing) so you can receive feedback before everyone else see it. Hope to see your future work.

 

[Pulsar]

Just a note...... one of the "best of anandtech" evidently made a mistake in trying to point out the kid's specifications. When does Rob get an apology? It appears from the elitecool link that he was correct in his review specifications.......

Who was it that said he needs to spend more time looking at the specs?

 

[Ilmater]

Originally posted by: LsDPulsar
Just a note...... one of the "best of anandtech" evidently made a mistake in trying to point out the kid's specifications. When does Rob get an apology? It appears from the elitecool link that he was correct in his review specifications.......

Who was it that said he needs to spend more time looking at the specs?

Coincidently, I did admit that his specs were correct according to Elitecool. However, they are not the correct specs for the fan. And for the record, I didn't call myself the best of Anandtech, but the complement was appreciated

Maybe you should read all of the posts before posting yourself.

 

[Ilmater]

Originally posted by: OulOat
And also, never ever use exclamation marks or OMG unless Jebus in a bikini appears before you.

LOL What a wonderful Simpsons quote. SAVE ME JEBUS!

 

[OulOat]

Originally posted by: LsDPulsar
Just a note...... one of the "best of anandtech" evidently made a mistake in trying to point out the kid's specifications. When does Rob get an apology? It appears from the elitecool link that he was correct in his review specifications.......

Who was it that said he needs to spend more time looking at the specs?

???? Who are you going to believe, Elitecool or the company who makes the fans?

 

[Robage]

I have notified EliteCool about their apparent flaw in thier stats on this fan. I will keep the specs the same on my review only because they are the supplier and i use theri specs for it. THank you all for you help, I learned a lot from this after i sorted through all your negative comments.

 

[Robage]

In the future guys, i would really appreciate if you kept my mistakes personal, it was pretty embarassing and depressing knowing people are dissind me pretty hard on my first review. So please, in the future, if you see a mistake in on e of my reviews, e-mail me you comments so i can make corrections instead of finding out this way. But you do have your freedom of speech so i can't stop you.

 

[Ilmater]

Originally posted by: OulOat

Originally posted by: LsDPulsar
Just a note...... one of the "best of anandtech" evidently made a mistake in trying to point out the kid's specifications. When does Rob get an apology? It appears from the elitecool link that he was correct in his review specifications.......

Who was it that said he needs to spend more time looking at the specs?

???? Who are you going to believe, Elitecool or the company who makes the fans?

Absolutely. And, more importantly, I don't think that it's really even an issue of trusting one over another because I don't think Elitecool even tests the fans. I think it's just a misprint. Here's what they said before they got these fans in:

We will be offering two types of 80mm Panasonic Panaflo fans which are well known for their quality airflow with quieter bearings. The two models that will be in stock with pre-soldered 3 pin connectors are:

FBA08A12H1A 32dB 39.6 CFM
FBA08A12U1A 44dB 46.9 CFM

These should be up by next friday most likely.

They didn't say, "We got some preliminary shipments and tested them and got the following specs," they simply said they'll be in, here are the specs. They don't make the claim anywhere on their site that they test their fans (or any other product for that matter) for the correct specs, so it's not an issue of who's right, it's an issue of when will they fix their misprint.

 

[Robage]

You are right about thier specs being wrong, but the fact is that EliteCool are the suppliers, and I will use the specs they have. Not the actualy fan's specs, i do this because im not reviewing Panasonic's fan, I am reviwing the ones supplied by EliteCool.com.

I am currently working on a review from Xoxide.com on their LL Warrior case, along with a DangerDen water cooling kit. I hope when they become public you guyz will take a look at them and tell me how i did! Thank you.

 

[amcdonald]

Originally posted by: Robage
You are right about thier specs being wrong, but the fact is that EliteCool are the suppliers, and I will use the specs they have. Not the actualy fan's specs, i do this because im not reviewing Panasonic's fan, I am reviwing the ones supplied by EliteCool.com.

I am currently working on a review from Xoxide.com on their LL Warrior case, along with a DangerDen water cooling kit. I hope when they become public you guyz will take a look at them and tell me how i did! Thank you.

I'm sorry, but to say you are reviewing the supplier and not the fan seems ridiculous to me.
How can you use empirically false information in a review simply because a supplier has made a typo?
You have to realize that however you look at it, this is not an elitecool fan, it is a panaflo.
You only mention Elitecool as a sponsor... nowhere do you claim that this is a review of Elitecool.
The point is that Elitecool or Newegg or any other supplier should NOT be a definitive source of panaflo information.
They are middlemen and can screw things up. As a reviewer you should be looking to show the true value of a PRODUCT. If you want to review Elitecool then write a review on Elitecool... However, this review is titled Panaflo FBA08A12U 80mm Fan... not Panaflo FBA08A12U 80mm Fans from Elitecool.

I'm sorry to be so blunt with you but you continue to exhibit unprofessional behavior.
My suggestion for your next review would be to look at the format and practices used by other reviewers and use those basic methods as a basis for the review.