Thinking of recharging myself....any experiences with alternative refrigerants?

[DesignDawg]

Hey all,

Forst, let me say that I AM mechanically inclined (built the engine in my car, do all my own repairs.) Now the problem: My A/C 9R12 freon) is down. Back in the day, that wasn't a problem, because anyone could go out and buy freon and charge it back up. Well, Now you have to have a license for that, and the only other alternative is to get a shop to do it. --But they won't. What they WILL do is convert my system to the new freon (R134) which would cost me around 600-700 bucks. ANOTHER alternative is to use alternative refrigerants (Hydrocarbons) which do not require any license to purchase, and do it myself. Now, it is my understanding that I will have to get a couple of fittings for my car (not the whole kit though), and then won't have to flush/vacuum anything out before I recharge? I am still a little unclear on all the details, so if anyone has any experience with them (ENVIROSAFE, specifically), please let me know your thoughts/share your wisdom.

Thanks,

Ricky
DesignDawg

 

[Wangel]

Doing the repair yourself will allow you to bypass most of the EPA regulations that garages must follow.

You can purchase some R22 or Propane, or some blend and top off your system.

You can get a kit at wallmart for about $30 and should work for your vehicle. It uses 134a.

Very soon you will be seeing 134a being regulated as stringent as R12.

 

[warlord]

generally the reason they convert your system is because the cooling properties of the coolants are different so the equipment needs to be changed. I was unaware that the hydrocarbon refirigerants will work in systems designed for freon. I'm only saying something because you could end up compressing a fluid way too much, or it may not do anything, so you'd be stuck where you are now, with no a/c.

good luck

 

[Stosh]

I generally recharge myself with 7 hours sleep, and plenty of food and beer. If you would prefer to use coolant, knock your self out

 

[Wangel]

Propane is a fabulous refrigerant. They have been using propane in Australia for many years without any problems. Here, the EPA will not approve any propane or hydrocarbon gasses. Service stations are not allowed to mix refrigerants, and are not allowed to top off an R12 system without first fixing the leak. They must also invest in lots of expensive equipment. As a vehicle owner you are not held to the same standard as a shop owner. You are not required to change the fittings, and other requirements. You might have a hard time finding a fitting to go from propane to your AC system. If you search the Internet, you will find various blend refrigerant companies such as McKool, Freeze, and others that sell blends. My experience with blends are they are much cheaper, and cool better than 134a. Good luck and remember to always wear your safety glasses.

 

[rahvin]

Myself I wouldn't want an explosive gas in my refrigerent system. I blew a hose once and lost all my freon in about 2 seconds, with the heat and sparks in the engine compartment I propably wouldn't still be alive if that had been propane/methane/whateverane. Not worth the risk to life in my opinion.

 

[warlord]

<< Myself I wouldn't want an explosive gas in my refrigerent system. >>


BOOM! :Q

there are refrigerants that are ten times better than R12, but as rahvin pointed out, flammable gasses are generally not wanted around combution engines. hey, maybe thats why the little sign tells you to shut off your engine when you fill it with gas.

 

[purplehayes]

A buddy of mine changed a system from R-12 to R-134a with a kit from AutoZone (insert your favorite auto parts store here). He said it was easy. I bought the truck from him later and can attest to the fact that the A/C works fine. I think all he did was evacuate the system, change the fittings, fill with 134a and oil and PRESTO!

Hey it works for me!

PH

 

[Chris A]

The $30.00 kit at Walmart will work fine. You just need to evacuate the system. how you do that is up to you. Other countries still sell R12 and it is let out into the environment by the ton.

 

[Yo Ma Ma]

You can still buy freon, on e-bay, but it's a bit on the shall we say expensive side, though nothing even close to hundreds of dollars.

 

[SuperSix]

An A/C technician buddy of mine abhors blends, they can wreak havoc on seals, hoses, etc. I would recommend going R134A. Keep in mind, R134A runs at a higher pressure than R12, so if you have any marginal hoses, seals, etc, they mey leak. Of course, replace and O-Rings you can get to. Remember to replace the dessicant (Accumulator, dryer, whatever it may be called on your car). The key to a succesful A/C job is COMPLETELY evacuating the system, for at least 30 minutes. By doing that, and dropping the pressure for so long, you &quot;boil&quot; out any moisture in the system. You can pick up a cheap evacuation pump for Harbor Freight tools. http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/taf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=3952 A set of manifold gauges are nice to have, a must if you plan on doing this again in the future. http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/taf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=1504 I earned my badge of honor, I replaced a compressor, expansion valve, and accumulator.. on a Honda..

Hope this helps..

 

[DesignDawg]

Hmmmmmm........

So, the point I failed to grasp is that you can BUY R134? ANYONE can? This is something I did not know. I was thinking of HC refrigerants because I thought you couldn't buy the R134 yourself. So, the kit at Wal-Mart, huh? ANd it comes with everything you need? I'll have to check it out. I didn't know they sold anything o the such. Do they also sell R134? Thanks again for your help, people. Always nice.

Ricky
DesignDawg

 

[SuperSix]

It's readily available here in Florida, everywhere.. ~ 4-5.00/can