Thinking of getting a ninja205r

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: OILFIELDTRASH

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: OILFIELDTRASH
Sorry about reposts im on a smartphone 4 1st time. By the time u get use to riding u will loathe the day u spent $4k on a 250. You control the throttle and control of the bike its not the other way around. You could safely ride a zx14 just as safe as a 250. Now if you start riding like a idiot thats ur fault.

Are you fucking kidding me? You're suggesting a ZX14 for someone who has never ridden a motorcycle and hasn't even taken the MSF course yet?

I'd recommend the OP get the Ninja 250 but I would buy used unless you are paying cash for it and are prepared to lose $1500-2000 on it in the first year.

Definitely do not mod it...it's not worth the money and you'll outgrow it in 3-6 months and want something new anyway.

I'm not suggesting a zx14 for him. Im just saying that if you ride with some sense and self control it doesn't matter what you ride. The rider is the one ultimately responsible for how fast or safe he/she makes the ride. If you act like a jack ass even on a 250 your gonna be roadkill.

And new riders lack the experience to deal with a powerful bike like the ZX14. There are many ways to get into trouble or over your head on that bike much faster than on a Ninja 250. Plus the lighter weight 250 will instill confidence much sooner than a heavier bike like the ZX14. The ZX14 will be more demanding to ride and far less forgiving if he makes a mistake...as new riders are prone to doing.

Experience is what makes one a good rider, it's not just about good judgement.

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: jlarsson

Originally posted by: Demon-Xanth
The new one actually does have a good bit of differences over the old one, but the markup on them right now is hideous. Kawasaki bumped the MSRP up $500 twice to get their cut on the dealer markup. Don't expect to get one out the door for under $4k, and expect to haggle to get one under $5k.

Depends on where you live. I got mine OTD for $4050 (MSRP plus $50 "documentation" fee). Most of the other dealers in my area had $400-$500 of markup over MSRP. With a 250r, you can expect to get most of your money back on it when you decide to sell it (there's always a good market for people looking for either first or fuel-efficient/commuter motorcycle).

The 250r is a perfect starter bike. I took my MSF course in April, bought my '09 250r a week later and have since put on 2000 miles on it.

As far as mods, the '08-'09 models are starting to have more and more mods coming out to market. There are several fender elimination mods out already, as well as exhausts.

Guy that I bought my rear spool stand from bought a used one with under 1K miles for $3200 ... hell of a steal.

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: OILFIELDTRASH

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: OILFIELDTRASH
Sorry about reposts im on a smartphone 4 1st time. By the time u get use to riding u will loathe the day u spent $4k on a 250. You control the throttle and control of the bike its not the other way around. You could safely ride a zx14 just as safe as a 250. Now if you start riding like a idiot thats ur fault.

Are you fucking kidding me? You're suggesting a ZX14 for someone who has never ridden a motorcycle and hasn't even taken the MSF course yet?

I'd recommend the OP get the Ninja 250 but I would buy used unless you are paying cash for it and are prepared to lose $1500-2000 on it in the first year.

Definitely do not mod it...it's not worth the money and you'll outgrow it in 3-6 months and want something new anyway.

I'm not suggesting a zx14 for him. Im just saying that if you ride with some sense and self control it doesn't matter what you ride. The rider is the one ultimately responsible for how fast or safe he/she makes the ride. If you act like a jack ass even on a 250 your gonna be roadkill.

WRONG

First time you grab a handful of the front brake on a super sport (or anything with floating rotors), you will be sliding off to the ditch. Same thing goes when you're holding yourself up on the clipons, hit a bump in a turn and jerk your right wrist. Same thing when something runs out into your way and you have to to toss the bike around to avoid it.

All the scenarios above end up with a lowside if you're riding a super sport and don't yet have the proper muscle memory in your hands. It's the same way a 16 year old kid doesn't know how to modulate the brake and gas pedals at first, you won't have the granularity to operate the brakes and twist the throttle. That's fine on a 250, but deadly on a supersport.


On the sidenote, I would make the argument that zx14 is relatively safer compared to the 636 and liter Kawi, but obviously none of them are starter bikes.

 

[CombatChuk]

4000 for a new Ninja 250? Just get a used SV650 or even GS500F, you won't get as bored as fast.

 

[pcguru78]

I have a GS500F and I love it, it's very forgiving for a new rider. Big difference in hitting a bump on it and accidentally blipping the throttle on it vs doing it on a super sport.

 

[AngelBeGood]

Don't get a 250, you'll outgrow it in a week and will take a bath on resale. -- Typical anti-250 banter. Both claims are false.

I'll go backwards: resale. If my bike didn't have 12,000 miles on it, I'd be able to sell it for almost what I paid for it a year ago (I paid $4,300, could get $4k easily on Craigslist). Buy a used bike and you can resell it for basically the same that you paid, provided your inflicted wear and tear isn't great.

And if you outgrow a 250 ever in a lifetime, you are probably a MotoGP racer. Either that or you have no idea what it means to be a good rider. The Ninja 250 is a fantastic little bike and great fun, especially on tight, twisty back roads. And it's perfectly capable on the freeway--I just today got home from riding the 250 from San Francisco to Seattle and back. 2,000 + miles in a week and the bike seemed to enjoy it almost as much as I did.

As for deciding between new and used, I give this advice. If you intend to buy the bike to learn on but really want something else within the year, buy used and save yourself some money. The pre-'08 250s don't have the chassis and handling of the newer ones but they're great bikes as well, even a bit faster in a straight line. If you really love the looks of the new bike and plan to keep it for a while, go ahead and buy a new 250. Just try really hard to not drop it (I didn't drop mine--the people that promise you that you'll drop it are just the people that did).

 

[cheesehead]

You might consider an old Honda. Lots of parts and very cheap.

 

[CZroe]

Originally posted by: AngelBeGood
Don't get a 250, you'll outgrow it in a week and will take a bath on resale. -- Typical anti-250 banter. Both claims are false.

I'll go backwards: resale. If my bike didn't have 12,000 miles on it, I'd be able to sell it for almost what I paid for it a year ago (I paid $4,300, could get $4k easily on Craigslist). Buy a used bike and you can resell it for basically the same that you paid, provided your inflicted wear and tear isn't great.

And if you outgrow a 250 ever in a lifetime, you are probably a MotoGP racer. Either that or you have no idea what it means to be a good rider. The Ninja 250 is a fantastic little bike and great fun, especially on tight, twisty back roads. And it's perfectly capable on the freeway--I just today got home from riding the 250 from San Francisco to Seattle and back. 2,000 + miles in a week and the bike seemed to enjoy it almost as much as I did.

As for deciding between new and used, I give this advice. If you intend to buy the bike to learn on but really want something else within the year, buy used and save yourself some money. The pre-'08 250s don't have the chassis and handling of the newer ones but they're great bikes as well, even a bit faster in a straight line. If you really love the looks of the new bike and plan to keep it for a while, go ahead and buy a new 250. Just try really hard to not drop it (I didn't drop mine--the people that promise you that you'll drop it are just the people that did).

Welcome to AT and, AMEN. I crossed the country on my '08 (Atlanta to San Diego) and I don't see myself ever getting rid of it. Awesome bike.

 

[caspur]

Its a weeny bike thread again. Weeny bikes and shitty components. Every time these threads come up, its conveniently forgotten. Everything on these ninja 250s (and other budget bikes) is made to be affordable....all these people that are talking about handling, fun to ride, etc. buy a goddamn supermoto. A budget bike is made to be cheap transportation...and not to be too much of a snob about it, 250cc is really not sufficient for cruising...lack of torque in higher gears.

Here is a great link to test ride some motorcycles (Ducati Demo days) you just need a valid motorcycle license and equip...everything from a "beginner" Monster 695 up to a 848 (which were booked solid an hour before the test rides even started). You also get a rain poncho and microfiber shammy.

Ducati Demo Days

I think they have Hypermotards (incredibly fun, 1000cc supermoto-type bikes) for test riding..but that is a different truck.

edit. 848..not 1098.

 

[CZroe]

Originally posted by: caspur
Its a weeny bike thread again. Weeny bikes and shitty components. Every time these threads come up, its conveniently forgotten. Everything on these ninja 250s (and other budget bikes) is made to be affordable....all these people that are talking about handling, fun to ride, etc. buy a goddamn supermoto. A budget bike is made to be cheap transportation...and not to be too much of a snob about it, 250cc is really not sufficient for cruising...lack of torque in higher gears.

Here is a great link to test ride some motorcycles (Ducati Demo days) you just need a valid motorcycle license and equip...everything from a "beginner" Monster 695 up to a 848 (which were booked solid an hour before the test rides even started). You also get a rain poncho and microfiber shammy.

Ducati Demo Days

I think they have Hypermotards (incredibly fun, 1000cc supermoto-type bikes) for test riding..but that is a different truck.

edit. 848..not 1098.

What's wrong with "affordable?" Unlike most "affordable" vehicles, this one still looks great and gets unbeatable gas mileage to boot. I don't know how a supermoto is supposed to give you that if it isn't even street-legal. The '08 250R carries my 230lb ass on the freeway daily and the torque *IS* sufficient for commuting. Other than taking it through the higher elevations of AZ without adjustment for altitude (and LOADED down with ~100lbs of gear) and against incredibly strong headwinds in NM, I've never had a problem passing cars unless I was pushing 100MPH (indicated).

And, yeah, I'm sure they'd have a heart-attack letting any old Joe on a 1098.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: caspur
Its a weeny bike thread again. Weeny bikes and shitty components. Every time these threads come up, its conveniently forgotten. Everything on these ninja 250s (and other budget bikes) is made to be affordable....all these people that are talking about handling, fun to ride, etc. buy a goddamn supermoto. A budget bike is made to be cheap transportation...and not to be too much of a snob about it, 250cc is really not sufficient for cruising...lack of torque in higher gears.

Here is a great link to test ride some motorcycles (Ducati Demo days) you just need a valid motorcycle license and equip...everything from a "beginner" Monster 695 up to a 848 (which were booked solid an hour before the test rides even started). You also get a rain poncho and microfiber shammy.

Ducati Demo Days

I think they have Hypermotards (incredibly fun, 1000cc supermoto-type bikes) for test riding..but that is a different truck.

edit. 848..not 1098.

I test rode a Ducati Monster 1100 S a few months ago and other than 20 more hp it wasn't that much different than my SV. That bike only had 100 miles on it so I wasn't pushing it too hard although I did wheelie it through an intersection at one point.

That will be my next bike for sure.

 

[Greenman]

There is nothing wrong with a 250, I'm a fan of the Honda rebel because I don't like sport bike looks. But if you own one don't ever ride a bike with with a lot more HP, cause you can't go back. Horsepower is crack for motorheads, once you have it you just can't give it up.

Off topic. My daughter wants a bike, if she follows through and takes the MSC, I'm going to get her a Honda Rebel and trick it out a bit, make it look like a baby Harley.

 

[cheesehead]

A guy down the street has a Honda Nighthawk 250. He seems to like it well enough, and he's not exactly a lightweight.

Some of the low-end Honda bikes start at a little over $3,000, and you probably won't have any trouble finding a good one used for half that.

 

[AngelBeGood]

Originally posted by: caspur
Its a weeny bike thread again. Weeny bikes and shitty components.

Components are just fine, I don't know what you're talking about. The clocks aren't as nice as those of a $10,000 bike, there's no carbon fiber, and it's carbureted, but it's not like the bike is falling apart at the seams. I've got over 12,000 miles on mine already and the bike is physically and mechanically superb. Save for some scratches an a-hole in a San Jose parking lot left me with.

 

[cheesehead]

Originally posted by: AngelBeGood
I've got over 12,000 miles on mine already and the bike is physically and mechanically superb. Save for some scratches an a-hole in a San Jose parking lot left me with.

The guy with the Nighthawk down the street weighs at LEAST 200 pounds, and parks it in the street.

It still looks great.

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: AngelBeGood
Don't get a 250, you'll outgrow it in a week and will take a bath on resale. -- Typical anti-250 banter. Both claims are false.

I'll go backwards: resale. If my bike didn't have 12,000 miles on it, I'd be able to sell it for almost what I paid for it a year ago (I paid $4,300, could get $4k easily on Craigslist). Buy a used bike and you can resell it for basically the same that you paid, provided your inflicted wear and tear isn't great.

And if you outgrow a 250 ever in a lifetime, you are probably a MotoGP racer. Either that or you have no idea what it means to be a good rider. The Ninja 250 is a fantastic little bike and great fun, especially on tight, twisty back roads. And it's perfectly capable on the freeway--I just today got home from riding the 250 from San Francisco to Seattle and back. 2,000 + miles in a week and the bike seemed to enjoy it almost as much as I did.

As for deciding between new and used, I give this advice. If you intend to buy the bike to learn on but really want something else within the year, buy used and save yourself some money. The pre-'08 250s don't have the chassis and handling of the newer ones but they're great bikes as well, even a bit faster in a straight line. If you really love the looks of the new bike and plan to keep it for a while, go ahead and buy a new 250. Just try really hard to not drop it (I didn't drop mine--the people that promise you that you'll drop it are just the people that did).

I agree with the bolded statement. The fact that you can hit the redline in top gear doesn't mean you've outgrown the bike or advanced beyond the limits of the bike. I challenge anyone that claims their abilities have surpassed anything a 250cc bike can handle to prove it on the track. When you have a handful of top 3 finishes to show me, I'll concede.

 

[rstrohkirch]

I don't know if that is such a good comparison.
There are plenty of people who could out ride a stock 250r in 4-5 full trackdays. If I have to put $250 into tires and another $900 into the suspension to go faster does this still count as the same bike? Couldn't I sell the bike and take the extra $1000 and buy something better. If this is happens to be a sports bike and I'm faster on it....didn't I technically out ride the 250r?

When it comes to racing AND winning there is a lot of money put into these bikes. Unless you're talking about HP, but racing is done by class so this is discounted to some regard.

 

[imported_Imp]

Sounds more like people confusing outgrowing with wanting something nicer. Most people can probably stick with a low level Civic, Corolla or '90s beater their whole lives, but they will buy that Porsche or Beemer just because. Same goes for the 250r. Unless you plan on tracking it, you probably just want something nicer/bigger, not because the bike's holding you back.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Originally posted by: AngelBeGood

Originally posted by: caspur
Its a weeny bike thread again. Weeny bikes and shitty components.

Components are just fine, I don't know what you're talking about. The clocks aren't as nice as those of a $10,000 bike, there's no carbon fiber, and it's carbureted, but it's not like the bike is falling apart at the seams. I've got over 12,000 miles on mine already and the bike is physically and mechanically superb. Save for some scratches an a-hole in a San Jose parking lot left me with.

the ninja250R still has carbs? damn, i thought everyone went FI. that's why yamaha killed off the YZF 600R - carbs couldn't meet newer emissions standards. beautiful bike

my GS650 has carbs. then again, it's from 1982 and it's still damn sexy

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: Imp
Sounds more like people confusing outgrowing with wanting something nicer. Most people can probably stick with a low level Civic, Corolla or '90s beater their whole lives, but they will buy that Porsche or Beemer just because. Same goes for the 250r. Unless you plan on tracking it, you probably just want something nicer/bigger, not because the bike's holding you back.

That's true too. I originally planned on getting a 250R but because the 2008's were in such short supply still, and the 2009's already had long waiting lists I decided to go with a ZX6R that was sitting right there on the floor. Not to mention the 250R would have cost me $5000 OTD with tax, title, delivery, etc. etc. No room to bargain on those with people waiting on a list to pay for them with cash. So I got more than twice the bike for a couple thousand more.

I can't fault anyone for wanting a 250R to start with and then once they learn to ride wanting something bigger with more torque for cruising. But claiming it's because you've outgrown the bike, or you can outride the bike... not likely. Sure you can go faster on a 600... it has 3X the power... that doesn't mean you're a better rider than you would be on a 250.

 

[CZroe]

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon

Originally posted by: AngelBeGood

Originally posted by: caspur
Its a weeny bike thread again. Weeny bikes and shitty components.

Components are just fine, I don't know what you're talking about. The clocks aren't as nice as those of a $10,000 bike, there's no carbon fiber, and it's carbureted, but it's not like the bike is falling apart at the seams. I've got over 12,000 miles on mine already and the bike is physically and mechanically superb. Save for some scratches an a-hole in a San Jose parking lot left me with.

the ninja250R still has carbs? damn, i thought everyone went FI. that's why yamaha killed off the YZF 600R - carbs couldn't meet newer emissions standards. beautiful bike

my GS650 has carbs. then again, it's from 1982 and it's still damn sexy

It's FI almost everywhere else. I know the US, Indonesian, etc are carbed, but most countries got the FI version.

 

[CZroe]

All this whining about waiting lists and OTD prices... get on a waiting list and start saving the cash. With cash you have enough bargaining power to talk them down to MSRP. I paid MSRP + crate/setup ($200) then drove it home to my state and paid the taxes there (another $200). Of course, this was AFTER they sold one right out from under me locally (deposits don't mean shit) and canceled another (Kawi wanted their share and canceled the rest of the '08s to jack them up $500 as early '09s). If you're willing to drive a few hundred miles you can find them in stock with no waiting... just remember that freeway driving is bad for new engine break-in.

 

[Pliablemoose]

After the MSF class, you should be able to feel comfortable on a 650, perhaps skip the 250cc bike. Although IMHO, the Ninja 250 is a great bike.

<--former MSF basic & advanced instructor & owned 14 bikes.

 

[CZroe]

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
After the MSF class, you should be able to feel comfortable on a 650, perhaps skip the 250cc bike. Although IMHO, the Ninja 250 is a great bike.

<--former MSF basic & advanced instructor & owned 14 bikes.

You posted in my thread last year.

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
...
Lastly, considering safety etc, google "motorcycle wrecks" images, take a long hard look at what the human body looks like when you have an accident at speed, it ain't pretty, but it's real. Then go sit in the back yard and have someone spray you with water for how long your commute is normally, then go sit in a freezer for the same length of time.

If you're still sure you want a bike, then take the MSF course before you buy a bike.

<---Former owner of 14 bikes and former basic & advanced MSF instructor.

Thanks! To that, I have ridden cross-country in late December and have been undeterred by cold and rain. That meant gearing up in front of a fountain at my motel that was a completely frozen cascade of icicles and it meant losing an iPhone 3G to water damage, but it was worth it. Hell, many months earlier I rode 500mi home from the dealer and it poured rain on me before I got to the first gas station.

The MSF has served me well. You were helpful in convincing me to get the CP Blue '08 250R instead of the Blast and I've been loving every second of it.