Thinking about it.. an afterlife doesn't make sense, sadly

[Aberforth]

Originally posted by: So

Originally posted by: Aberforth

Originally posted by: So

Originally posted by: bignateyk

Originally posted by: Aberforth

Originally posted by: Woosta

Originally posted by: bignateyk
Life doesn't make sense either. Think about it. You live in this universe that had to have come from somewhere, but where the hell did it come from? You live on a habitable planet in the middle of that chaotic universe. What are the odds of that? 1 in trillions? even less? On top of that, you are an intelligent being on that planet. How many millions of years of evolution did that take? And why you? Out of all the other intelligent beings, and other life forms, why did you become you?

Until life makes sense, I don't really examine an afterlife making sense.

Good observation, I've thought about the creation of the universe as well... how the hell did it come to be, how the hell does the big bang really work? Will it always expand? What if it starts contracting? Is there a limit?

wow, you are too external. Can you remember your childhood or babyhood? No right and You are talking about past life? Give me a break.

If you observe more closely, the universe isn't just a random creation of nature, look at the planets rotating around the sun with precision, look at the seasons on earth- they are spread so evenly, nature is so beautiful, so is the wildlife. All this cannot be done without a intelligent process.

That's kind of my point. If you look at it as a random process, the odds are so ridiculous it's laughable. Then again, who knows what can happen when infinite odds combine with infinite time. I lean toward intelligent design though.

Being uncomfortable with the random and indifferent nature of reality doesn't make it not so.

There is no random- everything has a reason, if you are incapable of explaining something you call it as 'random', it's just that humans lack the capacity to explain the vast complexities of this universe. If an apple falls from a tree, it's not just a random occurence, you have to find the source of the cause, the apple fell because of the wind and the wind is caused by the sun which makes hot air rise up, sun is formed out of big bang- you have to trace it like that.

Why must everything have a reason? I could build you a machine that uses quantum effects to do some random thing. Stop anthropomorphizing the universe.

Why shouldn't it? Whatever machine you build can possibly be based on predetermined patterns, which means it isn't completely random. I know more quantum physics and string theory then you could ever dream of.

 

[DangerAardvark]

This thread is borderline unreadable, but I just want to point out that arguing for the significance of something based on its improbability in hindsight is a logical fallacy. 100 million sperm, 99,999,999 of which would not have created you, all equally and staggeringly improbable. Yet, one of them had to be the one to fertilize the egg. The Roulette ball has to go into a slot, all of them being equally improbable. The coin has to show either heads or tails. Everything is improbable.

Aside from that, presuming that the only alternative to pure chance is conscious design, is a false dichotomy. Life as we know it today is much easier to explain, precisely because it did not happen by chance. There is an element of chance to Evolution, but it is driven by two decidedly nonrandom processes: heredity and differential survival. None of your ancestors died childless. What are the odds? Pretty damn close to 100%, by my reckoning.

 

[Atheus]

Originally posted by: Aberforth

Originally posted by: Atheus

Originally posted by: Aberforth

Originally posted by: Leafy

Originally posted by: Aberforth
Why shouldn't one kill another if he feels good in doing that? why one shouldn't steal? why one shouldn't lie?

Because we're not DICKS.

right...can you tell me why are we like that? in other words 'good nature'.

Because it's good for the survival of the species? Clearly a being which murders its family is not going to pass its genes on. There's nothing wrong in evolutionary terms with murdering your enemies, but people do that all the time, and tend to be very happy about it afterwards.

You are merely repeating the same old thing, why does humans or any other species in general want to survive and prevail? If it's in their nature, why it isn't different, every species in existence is afraid of death......but You are free to argue whatever you want, I personally think you are in for a surprise one day.

"Why does humans"? "If it's in their nature, why it isn't different"? What does that mean, you ignoramus, didn't you ever go to school? That would explain a few things. I can't decypher most of it, but can I assume you are asking, in your own little way, why life tries to preserve itself? Because it's in our genes of course. And why are our genes the way they are? Because we evolved that way; a creature which tries to preserve itself is more likely to pass on it's genes than one which does not. Even the most hardcore anti-darwinists don't deny the whole concept of evolution, they argue within that framework that while micro-evolution is possible, certain things are so complex they must have been created. Perhaps you should read up on your own line of bullshit before you start critisizing other peoples'? While you're at it there's a very good book, which I can only assume you have never heard of, called 'On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection' which you must read before entering these arguments or admit you are totally unaware af what you are arguing against.

 

[Atheus]

Originally posted by: Aberforth
I know more quantum physics and string theory then you could ever dream of.

I seriously doubt that, since you just claimed there is no randomness, while randomness is one of the central concepts of quantum theory...

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: DrPizza

Something can't come from nothing.

According to your intuition. However, that statement has been debunked numerous times. See: virtual particle, Hawking radiation

and regardless to these facts...the matter/particles exist so therefore trying to prove they could not is futile.

The main problem in something like this is most people are just too damn ignorant to the sciences behind it to be able to even grasp the most simple of concepts.

They attempt to explain things the way simple objects work, like atoms as two balls contacting or two pieces of clay. Reactions as something like mixing salt and water...

Same with religion though...the main people debating it are usually those with the least knowledge of the subject.

 

[So]

Originally posted by: Aberforth

Originally posted by: mundane

Originally posted by: Aberforth
...

Let me ask you something? why do we stress on humanity in general? Think about it. Why shouldn't one kill another if he feels good in doing that? why one shouldn't steal? why one shouldn't lie? if they all feel pride in doing that, if that's their purpose of life?. When we were kids we were taught not to lie or steal, but they didn't teach us why we shouldn't so that? because our parents do not know the answer. No scientist or philosopher can give you the right answer for it- they can only give you the superstitious answer or induce fear, but these questions were really put into effect by some intelligence reaction that came from beyond, like pre-programming human beings. All of these questions about morality, humanity, intellect etc cannot be answered because they are beyond the field of reasoning, that which we call afterlife, God or whatever. Human beings cannot be unkind, cruel, untruthful - if they are then they are doing it under pressure of circumstances with sufficient guilt.

Or a species that are predisposed to behave in such a way couldn't coalesce into meaningful civilizations.

That's right, monkeys cannot evolve into intelligent species capable of landing on moon, without a intelligent pattern of evolution.

Yes they can. Proof: Look in the mirror, then click this link

 

[So]

Originally posted by: mxyzptlk
I think it works something like this: The body that you're in now is like a transistor radio. Your "I think, therefor I am" consciousness is like the radio signal.. being "broadcast" from somewhere, I don't know maybe higher dimensions or something. IANAPhysicist. When the body dies, the signal keeps going. It can find a home in another similar configuration of matter anywhere in the universe and at any time too. However, I don't think memory is part of it.. for memory you have to have a set of hardwired neurons in a physical brain. You don't get to keep your memories when you enter a new body.

...why? What reason would you possibly have to posit this massive complication on top of "billions of neurons producing complex but demonstrable behaviors?"

 

[So]

Originally posted by: Aberforth

Why shouldn't it? Whatever machine you build can possibly be based on predetermined patterns, which means it isn't completely random. I know more quantum physics and string theory then you could ever dream of.

I don't care about your fallacious argument from authority.

Why must everything have a reason? You are asserting a positive claim (that everything has a reason) and the onus is on you to demonstrate that is true.