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Think we will see actual governance now? I kinda forgot what it looked like

S

Stoneburner

Diamond Member
We all know, even the conservatives, that 6 years of full republican rule have been rather uneventful except for a couple of wars. Even Bush's tax cuts wont last. History may change their mind about bush later, but so far he has been a very ineffective president concentrating more on concentrating power rather than actually using it effectively. Reagan and Clinton had less power but were more effective.

HOwever, as some pundits have said maybe bush will look to his legacy and try to work with the dems now. Granted the history on this point is bad, but nothing is impossible. I think now that his last election is over karl rove will be marginalized allowing bush to actually focus on policy rather than politics. Because the fact is, rove is the reason the bush whitehouse has been all politics rather than policy. With him no longer relevant maybe bush can get together a new team. And I dont mean the same team with a different outlook. Ken Mehlman was looking concilliatory but he's NOT going to cut it. people like Karen Hughes and the rest of his texas delegation will not cut it. These people can't help themselves, they will just go back to screwing the dems at every step.

Also, in the senate, hopefully the republicans will turn more towards Dick Lugar, CHuck Hagel, and the original John Mccain, while the dems with Biden, webb (hopefully), and Levin. The senate has a few effective leaders on both sides and they need to keep it running rather than letting the fringes bicker like usual.

I wont say I have high hopes, but I do have some now.
 
I hope that the dems will take this chance to do some good for our nation. Maybe they can put a fire under George W. and actually get something accomplished. I also hope this is a wake up call to "real" republicans, and that they start moving back towards the center. They have been steadily pushing to the right for six years, and I think the extreme religious right wing scares a lot of your average voters. If the dems work this right I think they can go into the '08 elections, touting some major accomplishments. I just really hope they look over the last 6 years of republican rule and learn what not to do. I suppose only time will tell.
 
Naturally, we're going to run into a ton of "politics as usual". We're dealing with an elected body of people. People who are all pushed, pulled, jabbed, prodded, led, misled etc. by a huge number of forces. I hope that, however things turn out, the overall integrity of the elected officials can be upped a bit. This isn't to say that dem's or repub's are doing that better (or worse). Just hoping folks will "stud up" a bit and do their best to do what's best for their constituents and for the country at large.

I think I'm setting myself up to be disappointed, but I'm optimistic for now.
 
Dems dont even have a plan. They dont have a clue what to do about national security. I am no war hawk, and think this war in Iraq was a total failure from day 1. I dont see how we can approach any war from a gentle point of view. We should have utterly destroyed Iraq till it was all rubble. Why fight a war otherwise. The purpose of war is to utterly destroy the enemy. You can never set a people free that are unwilling to fight for their own freedom.
 
i think people understimate not having a plan. PLans are best formed on the fly. The neocons had a plan. both parties now have to play Iraq by ear with a certain goal in site.


As for politics as usual... I dont know the new crop of dem senators look very promising. Granted they wont get power immediately but it signals a shift to pragmatists. Jim webb is barely partisan. I doubt the dems will do what the republicans did. Dems are a disloyal bunch of individuals. I believe the Biden/hagel types in the senate from both sides will manage to set the table. If you read some of the accounts of the iraq war, the moderate pragmatists, hell the pragmatists in general, were sidelined by their own parties and by the president. I predict a more practical approach to government will result.


 
I don't need governance. Sheep need governance. I need representation. Too bad neither side represents me. This election did nothing but swap one power hungry group for another.
 
like i said in another thread here: Congrats on the very impressive victory in the elections and convincing Rummy to resign. Now, all I ask of the winning team is that they deliver on their "We can do it better" promises. If they do, then they may eventually convince me to support them... if not, then they will only serve to validate my otherwise negative opinion of most of them.

Actually making Pelosi the Speaker was a very bad start... but even so, I'm willing to give them a shot at the title. But they had better not f'n blow it!
 
Originally posted by: palehorse74
like i said in another thread here: Congrats on the very impressive victory in the elections and convincing Rummy to resign. Now, all I ask of the winning team is that they deliver on their "We can do it better" promises. If they do, then they may eventually convince me to support them... if not, then they will only serve to validate my otherwise negative opinion of most of them.

Actually making Pelosi the Speaker was a very bad start... but even so, I'm willing to give them a shot at the title. But they had better not f'n blow it!
Click to expand...

Anybody can do better then what we have now. That is the point. My 2 yo daughter can probably do better.

http://tiger.towson.edu/~hzaidi1/reaction.jpg <----- The republican Reaction......
 
Originally posted by: steppinthrax
Originally posted by: palehorse74
like i said in another thread here: Congrats on the very impressive victory in the elections and convincing Rummy to resign. Now, all I ask of the winning team is that they deliver on their "We can do it better" promises. If they do, then they may eventually convince me to support them... if not, then they will only serve to validate my otherwise negative opinion of most of them.

Actually making Pelosi the Speaker was a very bad start... but even so, I'm willing to give them a shot at the title. But they had better not f'n blow it!
Click to expand...

Anybody can do better then what we have now. That is the point. My 2 yo daughter can probably do better.

http://tiger.towson.edu/~hzaidi1/reaction.jpg <----- The republican Reaction......
Click to expand...
my only response: never assume! their "better" performance is certainly not guaranteed.

 
Originally posted by: AutumnRayne
I hope that the dems will take this chance to do some good for our nation. Maybe they can put a fire under George W. and actually get something accomplished. I also hope this is a wake up call to "real" republicans, and that they start moving back towards the center. They have been steadily pushing to the right for six years, and I think the extreme religious right wing scares a lot of your average voters. If the dems work this right I think they can go into the '08 elections, touting some major accomplishments. I just really hope they look over the last 6 years of republican rule and learn what not to do. I suppose only time will tell.
Click to expand...
This is where you Democrat posters are wrong. Outside national security Bush has NOT been pushing the country to the right.

Look at his domestic policy. Huge Medicare drug program, amnesty program for illegals, huge spending increases.
Rush read an exit poll that stated more voters look at the Republican Party as the party of big government. That is just insane! How the Republicans lost the title of being for a small government is a huge sign that Bush is not running the country as someone from the far right.

I think what we will see in the next two years is the party move back towards being a conservative party, with or without Bush, and hopefully we will find and nominate a good conservative for 2008.
 
Originally posted by: palehorse74
But they had better not f'n blow it!
Click to expand...



Hehe, comments like that always make me laugh. After 9/11 the President and repubs had a united nation behind them. They had the support of a whole nation, and managed to screw it up every step of the way. I hope that now the dems will learn from their mistakes and actually start representing the people.

You're right about one thing, saying the dems will do better just because they are not the republicans means nothing. They actually have to step up and show what they can do. In my opinion it won't take much, since the republicans pretty much set the bar very, very low these last 6 years.

I think you will see changes all around, not just within the democrats, but I think you'll see a huge movement of republicans moving towards the center and distancing themselves from this administration. Everyone knows that the next two years will set up the '08 election, for better or worse. So I think you will see both sides stepping up their game.
 
Originally posted by: ProfJohn

This is where you Democrat posters are wrong. Outside national security Bush has NOT been pushing the country to the right.

Look at his domestic policy. Huge Medicare drug program, amnesty program for illegals, huge spending increases.
Rush read an exit poll that stated more voters look at the Republican Party as the party of big government. That is just insane! How the Republicans lost the title of being for a small government is a huge sign that Bush is not running the country as someone from the far right.

I think what we will see in the next two years is the party move back towards being a conservative party, with or without Bush, and hopefully we will find and nominate a good conservative for 2008.
Click to expand...

First of all, I'm not a democrat. I have no party affiliation. In fact, although I voted with a lot of democrats yesterday, I also voted for a couple of republicans. I don't merely judge a candidate only on party affiliation.

As for Bush, maybe his domestic policy is not "far right" as his policies on national security, but look what he has spent most of his time and effort on, national security. Any wonder that he appears to be moving to more and more to the right.

I would love to see the republicans get back to their conservative roots, hopefully this can serve as a wake up call to them.


PS I almost choked on my juice when I read your sig, funny. :laugh: (Awww you changed the botched joke sig)
 
Originally posted by: BoberFett
I don't need governance. Sheep need governance. I need representation. Too bad neither side represents me. This election did nothing but swap one power hungry group for another.
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I'm gonna have to agree on this one. I think it's great that the Republican hold on the government has been split apart by the Dems, but those who naively expect major changes from this election are in for a big surprise.
 
nobody wants major changes, we want alot of little changes that get things working they are supposed to be. Government is about details, bush has been all about the overview. Say what you want about libertarianism, we depend on govt for security, basic services, entertainment. If you were satisifed with Katrina's response, fine, if not, let's hope for basic competence.
 
Originally posted by: Stoneburner
nobody wants major changes, we want alot of little changes that get things working they are supposed to be. Government is about details, bush has been all about the overview. Say what you want about libertarianism, we depend on govt for security, basic services, entertainment. If you were satisifed with Katrina's response, fine, if not, let's hope for basic competence.
Click to expand...
Libertarianism isn't anarchy.
 
Originally posted by: piasabird
Dems dont even have a plan. They dont have a clue what to do about national security. I am no war hawk, and think this war in Iraq was a total failure from day 1. I dont see how we can approach any war from a gentle point of view. We should have utterly destroyed Iraq till it was all rubble. Why fight a war otherwise. The purpose of war is to utterly destroy the enemy. You can never set a people free that are unwilling to fight for their own freedom.
Click to expand...

If you think it was a failure from day 1, sir you dont have a clue.

The military is good at one thing....KILLING.

They did that and do it well.

What they don't do well is being a police force and social worker.
 
We?ll see open borders, blackmail from foreign rogue nations, and communism at its finest before the next Authoritarian takes command of an even bigger and stronger central government. This is, if the Republicans don?t reverse any of this with their remaining authority.

Unfortunately, Bush is for open borders, he is an Authoritarian, and the new secretary of defense was in a committee that thinks Iran can be talked to, ala North Korea. So not even he is going to really oppose any of these coming steps.
 
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