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The world has never seen such freezing heat

moshquerade

No Lifer
The sky isn't falling after all. 😕
I guess these alarmists exaggerate and lie about their stats to make themselves feel important?


The world has never seen such freezing heat

Last Updated: 12:01am GMT 16/11/2008

A surreal scientific blunder last week raised a huge question mark about the temperature records that underpin the worldwide alarm over global warming. On Monday, Nasa's Goddard Institute for Space Studies (GISS), which is run by Al Gore's chief scientific ally, Dr James Hansen, and is one of four bodies responsible for monitoring global temperatures, announced that last month was the hottest October on record.

This was startling. Across the world there were reports of unseasonal snow and plummeting temperatures last month, from the American Great Plains to China, and from the Alps to New Zealand. China's official news agency reported that Tibet had suffered its "worst snowstorm ever". In the US, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration registered 63 local snowfall records and 115 lowest-ever temperatures for the month, and ranked it as only the 70th-warmest October in 114 years.

So what explained the anomaly? GISS's computerised temperature maps seemed to show readings across a large part of Russia had been up to 10 degrees higher than normal. But when expert readers of the two leading warming-sceptic blogs, Watts Up With That and Climate Audit, began detailed analysis of the GISS data they made an astonishing discovery. The reason for the freak figures was that scores of temperature records from Russia and elsewhere were not based on October readings at all. Figures from the previous month had simply been carried over and repeated two months running.


The error was so glaring that when it was reported on the two blogs - run by the US meteorologist Anthony Watts and Steve McIntyre, the Canadian computer analyst who won fame for his expert debunking of the notorious "hockey stick" graph - GISS began hastily revising its figures. This only made the confusion worse because, to compensate for the lowered temperatures in Russia, GISS claimed to have discovered a new "hotspot" in the Arctic - in a month when satellite images were showing Arctic sea-ice recovering so fast from its summer melt that three weeks ago it was 30 per cent more extensive than at the same time last year.

A GISS spokesman lamely explained that the reason for the error in the Russian figures was that they were obtained from another body, and that GISS did not have resources to exercise proper quality control over the data it was supplied with. This is an astonishing admission: the figures published by Dr Hansen's institute are not only one of the four data sets that the UN's Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) relies on to promote its case for global warming, but they are the most widely quoted, since they consistently show higher temperatures than the others.

If there is one scientist more responsible than any other for the alarm over global warming it is Dr Hansen, who set the whole scare in train back in 1988 with his testimony to a US Senate committee chaired by Al Gore. Again and again, Dr Hansen has been to the fore in making extreme claims over the dangers of climate change. (He was recently in the news here for supporting the Greenpeace activists acquitted of criminally damaging a coal-fired power station in Kent, on the grounds that the harm done to the planet by a new power station would far outweigh any damage they had done themselves.)

Yet last week's latest episode is far from the first time Dr Hansen's methodology has been called in question. In 2007 he was forced by Mr Watts and Mr McIntyre to revise his published figures for US surface temperatures, to show that the hottest decade of the 20th century was not the 1990s, as he had claimed, but the 1930s.

Another of his close allies is Dr Rajendra Pachauri, chairman of the IPCC, who recently startled a university audience in Australia by claiming that global temperatures have recently been rising "very much faster" than ever, in front of a graph showing them rising sharply in the past decade. In fact, as many of his audience were aware, they have not been rising in recent years and since 2007 have dropped.

Dr Pachauri, a former railway engineer with no qualifications in climate science, may believe what Dr Hansen tells him. But whether, on the basis of such evidence, it is wise for the world's governments to embark on some of the most costly economic measures ever proposed, to remedy a problem which may actually not exist, is a question which should give us all pause for thought.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opi.../2008/11/16/do1610.xml
 
The global warmers (TM) are generally full of shit and should be ignored. Actually I don't know what is worse, the people at the top who alter data to make it fit their political agenda or the hoards and legions of warmer lemmings (TM) that troll around the internet fiercely attacking anyone who voices dissent against the hugely biased global warmers (TM).
 
Originally posted by: LS8
The global warmers (TM) are generally full of shit and should be ignored. Actually I don't know what is worse, the people at the top who alter data to make it fit their political agenda or the hoards and legions of warmer lemmings (TM) that troll around the internet fiercely attacking anyone who voices dissent against the hugely biased global warmers (TM).

Right. You know this field better than the vast majority of climate scientists, who spend entire careers working on it. Got it.
 
Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer
Originally posted by: LS8
The global warmers (TM) are generally full of shit and should be ignored. Actually I don't know what is worse, the people at the top who alter data to make it fit their political agenda or the hoards and legions of warmer lemmings (TM) that troll around the internet fiercely attacking anyone who voices dissent against the hugely biased global warmers (TM).

Right. You know this field better than the vast majority of climate scientists, who spend entire careers working on it. Got it.

Here we go! That didn't take long.
 
Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer
Originally posted by: LS8
The global warmers (TM) are generally full of shit and should be ignored. Actually I don't know what is worse, the people at the top who alter data to make it fit their political agenda or the hoards and legions of warmer lemmings (TM) that troll around the internet fiercely attacking anyone who voices dissent against the hugely biased global warmers (TM).

Right. You know this field better than the vast majority of climate scientists, who spend entire careers working on it. Got it.
Did you read the article I posted?
 
Originally posted by: LS8
Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer
Originally posted by: LS8
The global warmers (TM) are generally full of shit and should be ignored. Actually I don't know what is worse, the people at the top who alter data to make it fit their political agenda or the hoards and legions of warmer lemmings (TM) that troll around the internet fiercely attacking anyone who voices dissent against the hugely biased global warmers (TM).

Right. You know this field better than the vast majority of climate scientists, who spend entire careers working on it. Got it.

Here we go! That didn't take long.

They needed to be spanked more.
 
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer
Originally posted by: LS8
The global warmers (TM) are generally full of shit and should be ignored. Actually I don't know what is worse, the people at the top who alter data to make it fit their political agenda or the hoards and legions of warmer lemmings (TM) that troll around the internet fiercely attacking anyone who voices dissent against the hugely biased global warmers (TM).

Right. You know this field better than the vast majority of climate scientists, who spend entire careers working on it. Got it.
Did you read the article I posted?

Aside from recent strange events, many more climate scientists than just those from the GISS actually hold the concept of global climate change as truth.
Not to mention, there are trends, and then there are freak occurrences in those trends. We cannot possibly predict what the Earth is going to throw at us next week, let alone next year. We use trends to formulate most likely possibilities, but nothing any prediction says is set in stone.
Who knows. So the ice coverage is expanding right now at an extreme rate, but maybe next year it'll rapidly shrink to levels far lower than they were prior to the expansion? Or maybe it'll continue to expand until 30% of the oceans are covered in ice? We don't know how any of this works, because unlike with most weather prediction - where weather models are created based on past experiences and everything we know - a future trend of the extremity that is global climate change is based solely on data collected from ice... we don't know a damn thing about it and could have it all wrong. Maybe the world will go into an ice age next year? Maybe this whole thing is completely bullshit and the world will stay the same for the next 1000 years?

But the biggest thing people need to drill into their heads: global warming is the worst term, and most wrong, one could use for this future trend. It's global climate change, because we cannot guess what kind of climates each area of the world will have, just that research is pointing to likely change to come. Whether it even happens who knows. We really don't know anything about the Earth, as much as some would like to say.
 
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer
Originally posted by: LS8
The global warmers (TM) are generally full of shit and should be ignored. Actually I don't know what is worse, the people at the top who alter data to make it fit their political agenda or the hoards and legions of warmer lemmings (TM) that troll around the internet fiercely attacking anyone who voices dissent against the hugely biased global warmers (TM).

Right. You know this field better than the vast majority of climate scientists, who spend entire careers working on it. Got it.
Did you read the article I posted?

There's plenty of articles and scientific research that support global warming also.
 
1) That is the Telegraph, AKA the Torygraph, one of the most right wing papers in the UK. They are not un-biased and they have nothing to do with science. Phrases like "set the whole scare in train" should make that obvious.

2) You're talking about scientists. If the data shows it's warming they're gonna say it's warming. If the data shows it's cooling they're gonna say it's cooling. Explosing flaws in measurments or statistics will only produce better data in the future. Even if the global current warming theory was proven completely wrong it's not like this would be some kind of defeat for the climate science community - proving one's self wrong is the whole point of science.

3) I find that a good bullshit indicator is look for the money - who would get paid by lying that the world is warming? Certinaly not the scientists - they're mostly on fixed academic salaries that get paid no matter what they say. Who gets paid by lying the world isn't warming? Oil industry. Coal and gas industry. Car manufacturers. Electricity companies. Billions upon billions ride on not cutting carbon emissions.

Lets all hope they are wrong or we might all be screwed, but one article does not outweigh the piles of evidence in support of the theory.
 
Surface temperatures aren't really the strongest indicator in assessing global warming. The oceans (you know, the things that cover 2/3's of the earth) are filled with water. Water has the highest specific heat of the things that cover the earth. Much much much higher than the specific heat of the air. I haven't seen that part of the issue attacked by the global anti-warming folks.

The anti-global warming crowd, consisting almost entirely of people with little science knowledge, particularly in climate, loves to attack individual pieces of information, and finds every error made that favors global warming to be evidence that global warming isn't real.

Global warming is considered a fact. The only debate is whether or not humans are causing it. Or rather, to what degree human activity is responsible. That human activity is a factor really isn't disputed (except by the there is no global warming nutcases & people who believe them.)

edit:
Oh, and which of these two facts is wrong:
CO2 is a greenhouse gas
There's more CO2 now than prior to the industrial age, due mainly to humans.

Go ahead and cough up some bullshit about volcanoes. I suppose that for the last billion years, volcanoes weren't active, and only recently they've become active? Feel free to bring up the fact that Mars seems to also be getting warmer, and use that to support the fact that it's a natural cycle caused by the sun. Never mind that the original research done on the sun's heating effect (where the Mars is warming factoid came from) was actually used to show that while yes, the sun's heating intensity is increasing, it's insufficient to explain the amount of global warming that has occurred.

This is akin to reading: "we measured the amount of dew that formed as a result of the temperature dropping below the dewpoint, and certainly this contributed to some of the moisture found in the house. But, we have shown that the amount of moisture that the dew would have formed in the house cannot explain how wet the interior was, and we are left to conclude that the river flooding its banks & the prethora of evidence that it did so is the primary factor for the water damage caused in the house" and cherry picking one phrase: dewpoint caused the water damage! (Well, except that it wasn't that large a percent difference)
 
God, I hate Sundays on AT. Folks get churched up or laze around watching the Sunday morning talking head shows and then come to AT and blather about the latest nonsense that someone poured into their heads
 
Originally posted by: ironwing
God, I hate Sundays on AT. Folks get churched up or laze around watching the Sunday morning talking head shows and then come to AT and blather about the latest nonsense that someone poured into their heads

And here you are 🙂
 
Originally posted by: KLin
Everyone needs to stop listening to Al Gore and his cronies.


..:thumbsup: but my hat's off to him for generating revenue off the gullible by creating a eco-KOOK doomsday industry.

 
Originally posted by: Atheus
1) That is the Telegraph, AKA the Torygraph, one of the most right wing papers in the UK. They are not un-biased and they have nothing to do with science. Phrases like "set the whole scare in train" should make that obvious.

2) You're talking about scientists. If the data shows it's warming they're gonna say it's warming. If the data shows it's cooling they're gonna say it's cooling. Explosing flaws in measurments or statistics will only produce better data in the future. Even if the global current warming theory was proven completely wrong it's not like this would be some kind of defeat for the climate science community - proving one's self wrong is the whole point of science.

3) I find that a good bullshit indicator is look for the money - who would get paid by lying that the world is warming? Certinaly not the scientists - they're mostly on fixed academic salaries that get paid no matter what they say. Who gets paid by lying the world isn't warming? Oil industry. Coal and gas industry. Car manufacturers. Electricity companies. Billions upon billions ride on not cutting carbon emissions.

Lets all hope they are wrong or we might all be screwed, but one article does not outweigh the piles of evidence in support of the theory.

Yep, one thing you said is correct. Look for the money.......

"Now there's a few modelers around who know something about storms, but they would like to have the possibility open that global warming will make for more and intense storms because there's a lot of money to be made on this. You know, when governments step in and are saying this ? particularly when the Clinton administration was in ? and our Vice President Gore was involved with things there, they were pushing this a lot. You know, most of meteorological research is funded by the federal government. And boy, if you want to get federal funding, you better not come out and say human-induced global warming is a hoax because you stand the chance of not getting funded. "

Interview with Dr. Gray, a renowned climate expert........

Text

 
I'm currently reading State of Fear by Michael Crichton. It has a pretty good description of the current state of "global climate change" research. Of course, I don't take it as Gospel in the field of climate research, but man, does he tear the environmentalists a new one... Apparently, in the field of global climate research, there is SO much fudging of the data on both sides that you don't know who to trust anymore.
 
Why isn't this in P&N? Secondly, why do people on the internet with no knowledge of climate change assume they know more than actual scientists that study it? Thirdly, individual years of warm and cold are not enough to prove or debunk climate change, it takes decades at the very least to see the overall warming and cooling trends. Fourthly I wouldn't be trusting the telegraph for anything beyond cute cat pics.
 
This is horse shit...I was promised Florida like temperatures and ocean front property in the next 10 years and instead I'm back to freezing my ass off.
 
Originally posted by: CrazyLazy
Why isn't this in P&N? Secondly, why do people on the internet with no knowledge of climate change assume they know more than actual scientists that study it? Thirdly, individual years of warm and cold are not enough to prove or debunk climate change, it takes decades at the very least to see the overall warming and cooling trends. Fourthly I wouldn't be trusting the telegraph for anything beyond cute cat pics.


..ya. and billions and billions of C02 tax revenue.

 
I'd wonder what hotter temps in the summer do to affect weather in the winter. It's still amazing what we don't know about how weather works.
 
I don't claim to know, but haven't the 90s, and some of the 00s, and the 1930s coincide with that jet stream shifting? I remember a History Channel show talking about a JS that shifts every 70 or so years, it's presently off coarse like it was in the 30s, which helped cause the Dust Bowl.
 
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