The world doesn't have as many nukes as you might think...

[Schadenfroh]

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
It would be very nice to have a near-zero fallout miniature nuke to use as a burrowing bunker buster to clean out cave / bunker systems.

Do you even know how nuclear weapons work? It's impossible to design a nuclear weapon with no fallout/radiation.

I know that, that is why I stated near-zero fallout rather than none and for the miniature nuke to act as a bunker buster that burrows into the earth before detonation to limit atmospheric fallout. I also said it would be nice, not that that we could pull it off with current technology. A big problem would be getting it to burrow deep enough before detonation (a very big hurdle) and determining the possibility of water table contamination...

 

[Red Irish]

Originally posted by: TheSkinsFan

Originally posted by: Red Irish

Originally posted by: TheSkinsFan
The U.S. does NOT need more nukes, we just need to discover a way to make new ones that are "clean."

It would be nice to see the same levels of destruction possible without all the nasty radioactive fallout afterwards.

We should also be looking to shift funding to rapid-response, long-range, precision, conventional weapons that could be launched and hit pinpoint targets, anywhere on Earth, in 30 minutes or less. This would go a long way in the WOT and other instances when rapid responses are necessary.

Or we could put the funding into cancer research or ensuring that people don't go hungry.

How about we do both and stop giving it away to Private Banks?

It's OK to have a bleeding heart AND carry a big stick ya know.

I would place other things on the shopping list before more nuclear weapons, but each to their own.

 

[JSt0rm]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_2pJeSr1qo

This is what we do already and you want to do more things like this?

 

[TheSkinsFan]

Originally posted by: Red Irish

Originally posted by: TheSkinsFan

Originally posted by: Red Irish

Originally posted by: TheSkinsFan
The U.S. does NOT need more nukes, we just need to discover a way to make new ones that are "clean."

It would be nice to see the same levels of destruction possible without all the nasty radioactive fallout afterwards.

We should also be looking to shift funding to rapid-response, long-range, precision, conventional weapons that could be launched and hit pinpoint targets, anywhere on Earth, in 30 minutes or less. This would go a long way in the WOT and other instances when rapid responses are necessary.

Or we could put the funding into cancer research or ensuring that people don't go hungry.

How about we do both and stop giving it away to Private Banks?

It's OK to have a bleeding heart AND carry a big stick ya know.

I would place other things on the shopping list before more nuclear weapons, but each to their own.

There are other things on my list as well. We just happen to be talking about strategic defense and nukes in this thread.

 

[theflyingpig]

Originally posted by: JSt0rm01
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_2pJeSr1qo

This is what we do already and you want to do more things like this?

Stop posting your worthless propaganda. It's disgusting to think people would use dead children to push their idiotic agendas. Shame on you.

 

[SickBeast]

You know, eventually the world is gonna run out of Uranium due to depletion from nuclear power. Maybe they'll just salvage the Uranium from nuclear weapons one day. :Q

 

[LunarRay]

I suppose I'm being silly, but, IF you are going to make war on a nation why do you worry about the difference between killing with MOABs or Nuclear or some other kind of device(s)?

Unless the objective is selective destruction it sort of makes sense to use the most effective weapon that does the job. Well in any case that would be true, I guess.

I simply can't grasp the difference between those MOABs and a Nuclear device as far as killing goes. I guess the resulting radiation in the earth is a reason but they had Neutron thingi in the works too that just killed, as I recall.

 

[SickBeast]

LunarRay, the radiation from a nuke makes the land completely uninhabitable for thousands of years. That's why.

 

[theflyingpig]

Originally posted by: SickBeast
LunarRay, the radiation from a nuke makes the land completely uninhabitable for thousands of years. That's why.

The Japanese are doing quite well.

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: theflyingpig

Originally posted by: SickBeast
LunarRay, the radiation from a nuke makes the land completely uninhabitable for thousands of years. That's why.

The Japanese are doing quite well.

Maybe the media really is biased in the US. Have you not seen the pictures of the deformed people and all the babies with the birth defects?

 

[theflyingpig]

Originally posted by: SickBeast

Originally posted by: theflyingpig

Originally posted by: SickBeast
LunarRay, the radiation from a nuke makes the land completely uninhabitable for thousands of years. That's why.

The Japanese are doing quite well.

Maybe the media really is biased in the US. Have you not seen the pictures of the deformed people and all the babies with the birth defects?

All in the past. Perhaps you have not seen the beautiful cities they have built over the ruins?

 

[LunarRay]

Yes, aside from the radiation that I mentioned.. but gee... deformed babies and cripple folks... Yes, I don't like to see that but IF I'm about killing my enemy that is what I'm doing and if the result is some live but minus limbs or what ever is that not a consequence of my action to kill? Maybe they are lucky and lived or unlucky they did.
I'd like war to be clean and nice but it ain't. I think if I go to war my aim is to terminate the enemy. Ok. non combat folks get caught up in it all. I've heard that is called 'collateral'. I also heard it is ok to nuke a place and kill 80000 enemy civilians to save 1000000 million American soldier lives. Truman, I think, agreed.

To be clear, I'm not too interested in being nice in war. I'm interested in winning or at least breaking the enemy of the habit of doing what ever caused me to go to war.
AND, I do believe that small nations who have nuclear weapons have them to use against big nations who would otherwise win easy without nuclear weapon use. I think we try to keep them from using them against us in the event we go to war with them.

Carl Sagan used to opine that we were destine to terminate life on earth using not only nuclear weapons but cars and all manner of things. Humans are indeed oblivious to the obvious. We consider our strategic goals and needs at the expense of what ever is in the way with out including the notion of our very own extinction.

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: theflyingpig

Originally posted by: SickBeast

Originally posted by: theflyingpig

Originally posted by: SickBeast
LunarRay, the radiation from a nuke makes the land completely uninhabitable for thousands of years. That's why.

The Japanese are doing quite well.

Maybe the media really is biased in the US. Have you not seen the pictures of the deformed people and all the babies with the birth defects?

All in the past. Perhaps you have not seen the beautiful cities they have built over the ruins?

They're stupid then. That radiation doesn't just go away. That soil will be toxic for several millennia.

 

[CitizenKain]

Originally posted by: SickBeast
LunarRay, the radiation from a nuke makes the land completely uninhabitable for thousands of years. That's why.

Not really, the more dangerous the radiation the shorter the half-life and the quicker its gone. It also depends on what type of bomb and where you have it explode as well. Its not a simple thing of firing off a nuke and saying goodbye to the ground for the next 1000 years.

However, this doesn't change the fact that using nukes is a dangerously stupid thing to do. There is no reason to punish the decedents of the people you are currently bombing simply because they had the misfortune of being born somewhere the US wanted to blow up.

 

[DrPizza]

Originally posted by: SickBeast
LunarRay, the radiation from a nuke makes the land completely uninhabitable for thousands of years. That's why.

Hiroshima Memorial Park -right next to ground zero

WWII was what? 2 or 3 thousand years ago?

 

[Elias824]

I may remind everyone here that these evil plant destroying weapons have probably still saved more lives then they have cost. It prevented a probably brutal ground invasion of japan in WW2, and probably prevented the cold war from ever being realized. They should and are used as a simple defensive plan in order to keep the peace. It is probably the reason we haven't had a major conflict in the last 70 years. I mean major as in we change the face of a continent with conventional warfare. Nukes have as much potential to save the world as they do to destroy it.

 

[JSt0rm]

Originally posted by: theflyingpig

Originally posted by: JSt0rm01
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_2pJeSr1qo

This is what we do already and you want to do more things like this?

Stop posting your worthless propaganda. It's disgusting to think people would use dead children to push their idiotic agendas. Shame on you.

you are one weird dude.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

Originally posted by: TheSkinsFan

Originally posted by: JSt0rm01

Originally posted by: SickBeast
Even if nukes are "clean" they are still a WMD that kills millions of people in one shot.

The US does need them as a deterrent, however it's only a matter of time before everyone has them. Really they should focus on how to intercept a nuke or shoot down their delivery systems.

millions of brown people. they dont matter as much. Millions of brown people are worth like 40 americans.

Are the Russians "brown"? No, they're certainly not. Yet, we were essentially at war with them for over 45 years, and they are the single biggest reason we developed and stockpiled so many nuclear weapons. Imagine that.

Grow the fuck up.

You have to come to the realization that a lot of people now are too young to have lived through the cold war. They don't understand what it was like.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

Originally posted by: SickBeast

Originally posted by: theflyingpig

Originally posted by: SickBeast

Originally posted by: theflyingpig

Originally posted by: SickBeast
LunarRay, the radiation from a nuke makes the land completely uninhabitable for thousands of years. That's why.

The Japanese are doing quite well.

Maybe the media really is biased in the US. Have you not seen the pictures of the deformed people and all the babies with the birth defects?

All in the past. Perhaps you have not seen the beautiful cities they have built over the ruins?

They're stupid then. That radiation doesn't just go away. That soil will be toxic for several millennia.

Were do you get this? Exactly how is this information known? We haven't been around monitoring these things for thousands of years. The Japanese have rebuilt Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Life has come back to the area around Chernobyl.

Originally posted by: CitizenKainHowever, this doesn't change the fact that using nukes is a dangerously stupid thing to do. There is no reason to punish the decedents of the people you are currently bombing simply because they had the misfortune of being born somewhere the US wanted to blow up.

You can't win a war without destroying your enemy. The reason the Allies won WW1 and 2 is because they were able to bring complete destruction against they enemies. In order to quell a population of it's will to further the war, you have to destroy their moral. Remember, the civilians are the ones that makes the tools of war. Soilders use them. If you want to keep the enemies soilders from killing your soilders, you need to destroy their ability to have supplies.
It's called WAR not BITCH SLAP FEST.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski

Were do you get this? Exactly how is this information known? We haven't been around monitoring these things for thousands of years. The Japanese have rebuilt Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Life has come back to the area around Chernobyl.

Originally posted by: CitizenKainHowever, this doesn't change the fact that using nukes is a dangerously stupid thing to do. There is no reason to punish the decedents of the people you are currently bombing simply because they had the misfortune of being born somewhere the US wanted to blow up.

You can't win a war without destroying your enemy. The reason the Allies won WW1 and 2 is because they were able to bring complete destruction against they enemies. In order to quell a population of it's will to further the war, you have to destroy their moral. Remember, the civilians are the ones that makes the tools of war. Soilders use them. If you want to keep the enemies soilders from killing your soilders, you need to destroy their ability to have supplies.
It's called WAR not BITCH SLAP FEST.

I'm sorry but there's a lot wrong with your post.

Hiroshima and Nagasaki had specific types of nuclear bursts that mitigated fallout, regardless there are still radiation related problems in both of these cities. In addition 'life' may have come back to Chernobyl, but 'human life' sure hasn't, and for good reason. There are some places in the Pripyat area that you could totally set up shop, and some that would cause you to die a rather unpleasent death within a relatively short period of time. It's certainly no longer a place for normal society to function, nor will it be for quite a long time.

Furthermore I have no idea how you think that the allies won WW1 by bringing 'complete destruction' upon their enemies. Virtually none of WW1 was fought on Central Powers soil, and Germany was in no way conquered when it surrendered. (this became a selling point for the Nazis later) In fact in the modern era, WW2 is one of the only examples in which a country bringing 'complete destruction' upon its enemy is the cause for the war ending.

Using nuclear weapons is stupid for the US for so many reasons it's not even funny. Our conventional forces are so strong that nuclear weapons are only a modest increase in damage over what we can do to most adversaries with regular bombs. Becoming an international pariah for such a small gain would be insanity. As for the countries were it WOULD be an upgrade, most of them are nuclear armed themselves... and I shouldn't have to explain why nuking them is a bad idea.

 

[Schadenfroh]

Nevermind, posted the wrong quote

 

[Pens1566]

Quick question for all those saying that the land around nuke sites is fine now ...

Would you move to near any of those sites? Use the groundwater for drinking/cooking/bathing?

 

[Schadenfroh]

Originally posted by: Pens1566
Would you move to near any of those sites? Use the groundwater for drinking/cooking/bathing?

I grew up near a nuclear test site, link.

Two nuclear detonations performed in a subterranean salt dome formation, as part of a 1960's Atomic Energy Commission Test. The first detonation, to form the cavity, code-named Salmon, took place in 1964 using a 5.3 kiloton bomb, placed at the bottom of a sealed 2,710-foot shaft. The second nuclear blast, a relatively small 0.38 kilotons yield shot code-named Sterling, was exploded within Salmon's 110-foot diameter cavity more than two years later.

I imagine the method in which it was tested prevented it from causing much damage. The city has about 50K living there now.

 

[theflyingpig]

Originally posted by: JSt0rm01

Originally posted by: theflyingpig

Originally posted by: JSt0rm01
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_2pJeSr1qo

This is what we do already and you want to do more things like this?

Stop posting your worthless propaganda. It's disgusting to think people would use dead children to push their idiotic agendas. Shame on you.

you are one weird dude.

Stop being such a fool. That link you provided is nothing but propaganda, aimed at the emotions of it's viewers. There are no facts, just propaganda. I can tell that you have done no research into this matter, because if you did, you would know that what I am saying is the truth. Educate yourself.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Originally posted by: Orignal Earl
Heh, saw this video on liveleak this morning

House in the Middle 1945

Always remember folks, a tidy home is a nuke safe zone
Some shit never changes...

That was surreal.