The 'WINDOWS TAX'

[Chosonman]

Why is Windows XP still so expensive while the price of parts and just about everything else is going down? The price of Windows XP hasn't changed since it came out 5 years ago. This "Windows Tax" is a mandatory constraint on the resources of everyone who uses a computer.

If I build a computer right now I could put together a decent one for under $300.00 for the parts. But because I have to purchase Windows for each and every computer that adds $150-$199 to the price of the system.. that's roughly 50% to the cost of the parts alone. So the final cost of my $300 system would be closer to $500.00 because of the "Windows Tax"

People will say: "If you don't like it Get Linux!"

I would and probably will eventually, but the real issue with Linux right now is that I can't run all my software on it. I'm hoping soon Linux will have the support to run fluidly and eventually replace MS:Windows as the world's most popular Operating system.

If this were to ever happen, more software companies would write Linux compatible software, prices of computers would drop dramatically and there would be greater variety of products available in the computer market. And most importantly Microsoft will lose it's grip on the world....

 

[n0cmonkey]

It's not that Linux can't run your software, it's your software can't run on Linux.

 

[spherrod]

If you're building systems, XP Home (OEM) is available for about $90 whilst Pro is $140. XP Home is sufficient for the vast majority of users. Personally, I don't have any problem with $90 for the OS as it's a very good OS IMHO and very easy to use with a wide variety of hardware and software.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: spherrod
If you're building systems, XP Home (OEM) is available for about $90 whilst Pro is $140. XP Home is sufficient for the vast majority of users. Personally, I don't have any problem with $90 for the OS as it's a very good OS IMHO and very easy to use with a wide variety of hardware and software.

Home sucks, and OEM limits your upgrade potential.

 

[spherrod]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
It's not that Linux can't run your software, it's your software can't run on Linux.

Yep, it is worth considering that Linux has many software applications which will do what your existing Windows software does.

 

[spherrod]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: spherrod
If you're building systems, XP Home (OEM) is available for about $90 whilst Pro is $140. XP Home is sufficient for the vast majority of users. Personally, I don't have any problem with $90 for the OS as it's a very good OS IMHO and very easy to use with a wide variety of hardware and software.

Home sucks, and OEM limits your upgrade potential.

Home does not suck if you just use Word, surf the net and email. OEM does limit your upgrade potential, but it depends on the use. If I was building my own PC I would get a retail license as I know I'm likely to upgrade the components at some point. For people unlikely to upgrade, it's a good route

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: spherrod
Home does not suck if you just use Word, surf the net and email.

It makes setting permissions and using a limited user more difficult. It does not offer EFS.

OEM does limit your upgrade potential, but it depends on the use. If I was building my own PC I would get a retail license as I know I'm likely to upgrade the components at some point. For people unlikely to upgrade, it's a good route

I figure if you're building your own there is a better chance you'll be upgrading your motherboard.

 

[spherrod]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: spherrod
Home does not suck if you just use Word, surf the net and email.

It makes setting permissions and using a limited user more difficult. It does not offer EFS.

OEM does limit your upgrade potential, but it depends on the use. If I was building my own PC I would get a retail license as I know I'm likely to upgrade the components at some point. For people unlikely to upgrade, it's a good route

I figure if you're building your own there is a better chance you'll be upgrading your motherboard.

Depends who will be using the PC. Many people do not need EFS or the same ability to set effective permissions as as XP Pro.

As for the OEM question - if you're building PC's for resale, then no need not to purchase the OEM license. If building for personal use then go Retail

 

[Phoenix86]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: spherrod
If you're building systems, XP Home (OEM) is available for about $90 whilst Pro is $140. XP Home is sufficient for the vast majority of users. Personally, I don't have any problem with $90 for the OS as it's a very good OS IMHO and very easy to use with a wide variety of hardware and software.

Home sucks, and OEM limits your upgrade potential.

Home works for most "home" users. In that capacity it's a great OS. I'm with you on the OEM bit, but that's mostly for "people like us", again not the "average home user". XP home OEM will work without issues for many-many people. It's also oversold as we often find out on the boards.

Pro and retail are avaiable for "people like us". What do you drive? Do you expect that vehicle to work for everyone? You are being a bit narrow-minded.

EFS.... On a "home" PC? Please, many corporations don't use it.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Yes, encryption is important. Anyone that doesn't utilize some sort of encrypted protection either doesn't do anything or isn't thinking.

How easy is it to use a limited user in XP Home? I was under the impression that it's difficult, at best.

 

[Megatomic]

It's super easy to set up a limited user account in XP. And for the typical home user, Windows XP Home Edition is perfect. I've never had anyone call me up to tell me that they want to upgrade to XP Pro due to some limitation they've encountered. I support many PCs off the workplace for friends and family.

 

[stash]

Yes, encryption is important. Anyone that doesn't utilize some sort of encrypted protection either doesn't do anything or isn't thinking

lol, shift goal posts much? Sure people who use computers use encryption, usually without realizing it. But your (original) point was about EFS. And many Home users have no need for encrypting their files, and also do not understand how it works and how to use it properly (key recovery, anyone)?

 

[spherrod]

Originally posted by: STaSh

Yes, encryption is important. Anyone that doesn't utilize some sort of encrypted protection either doesn't do anything or isn't thinking

lol, shift goal posts much? Sure people who use computers use encryption, usually without realizing it. But your (original) point was about EFS. And many Home users have no need for encrypting their files, and also do not understand how it works and how to use it properly (key recovery, anyone)?

that reminds me of the post from the guy who had encrypted his files and then reinstalled (without backing up the key IIRC). He tried to blame Microsoft for not providing a solution which would allow him to access his files

 

[JustAnAverageGuy]

If you need a $300 computer, buy a Dell

It'll be better (*shudder*) than anything you could throw together, legally, for $300.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: STaSh

Yes, encryption is important. Anyone that doesn't utilize some sort of encrypted protection either doesn't do anything or isn't thinking

lol, shift goal posts much? Sure people who use computers use encryption, usually without realizing it. But your (original) point was about EFS. And many Home users have no need for encrypting their files, and also do not understand how it works and how to use it properly (key recovery, anyone)?

I meant encrypted filesystems in that post. I didn't think I had to point that out.

 

[JustAnAverageGuy]

n0cmonkey

Your idea of an average user's needs seem far out of place. File encryption and the ability to join a domain isn't needed for your average browse the web and write a letter user.

In our world yes, but not the normal average world.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: JustAnAverageGuy
n0cmonkey

Your idea of an average user's needs seem far out of place. File encryption and the ability to join a domain isn't needed for your average browse the web and write a letter user.

In our world yes, but not the normal average world.

I didn't mention anything about domains. I didn't mention it for a reason.

Sorry, I still think file encryption should be used by everyone. And permissions should be editable. XP home is trash.

 

[Phoenix86]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Yes, encryption is important. Anyone that doesn't utilize some sort of encrypted protection either doesn't do anything or isn't thinking.

How easy is it to use a limited user in XP Home? I was under the impression that it's difficult, at best.

Pfft, please. Not only is EFS not important to a home user, it's straight up dangerous. You think grandma knows to backup her EFS key?

You seriously need to evaluate what the "average" person does with PCs, you are waaaaay too locked into the geek mindset.

Heck you'd have been more valid bringing up domains as opposed to EFS. I think more people are running domains than EFS.

 

[Chosonman]

So you guys think if I migrated to Linux I wouldn't have any problems running my programs? ie.. games

I know there's a Direct-X emulator for Linux around, but that' costs money to.

 

[stash]

I meant encrypted filesystems in that post. I didn't think I had to point that out.

Alrighty then, so Joe User needs to encrypt his porn and vacation pictures?

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: Phoenix86

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Yes, encryption is important. Anyone that doesn't utilize some sort of encrypted protection either doesn't do anything or isn't thinking.

How easy is it to use a limited user in XP Home? I was under the impression that it's difficult, at best.

Pfft, please. Not only is EFS not important to a home user, it's straight up dangerous. You think grandma knows to backup her EFS key?

You seriously need to evaluate what the "average" person does with PCs, you are waaaaay too locked into the geek mindset.

Heck you'd have been more valid bringing up domains as opposed to EFS. I think more people are running domains than EFS.

She should learn if she keeps anything important on her computer.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: STaSh

I meant encrypted filesystems in that post. I didn't think I had to point that out.

Alrighty then, so Joe User needs to encrypt his porn and vacation pictures?

Obviously not, but anything a bit more important than that sure.

 

[lyssword]

dam MS monopoly

 

[phisrow]

While I agree that, in practice, that "doing what average users do" doesn't require advanced features; I think n0cmonkey raises an important point. Computers are complex, sometimes difficult, systems that people generally don't use responsibly enough. And they exist in a hostile environment. A culture of nescient helplessness among users accustomed to useing deliberately crippled tools is really very dangerous. At best, it will mean a lot of people's documents getting nicked, and loads of zombies. At worst, it'll mean the reduction of all systems available to individuals to a level stupid and locked down enough for people who know nothing.

 

[Nothinman]

Why is Windows XP still so expensive while the price of parts and just about everything else is going down?

You're paying for a license to use software that has thousands of people on the development and QA teams and probably millions of man-hours of development into it and you're complaining about $150? Obviously MS isn't hurting for money, but do you have any idea how much money they've dumped into the development of Windows? And on top of it all the license is valid essentially forever, you can spread that $150 across 10 years if you'd like, yes there are people still running Win95, so that's about $15 a year to use Windows XP.

I'm not a huge fan of MS, but you can't really complain about their pricing when you look at someone like Adobe who charges over $500 for Adobe CS 2. Hell even Elements costs nearly $100.

People will say: "If you don't like it Get Linux!" '

If you already know about this why are you complaining? You have alternatives, no one is forcing you to buy Windows (except for PC manufacturers that won't sell you a box without a Windows license) if you really don't want to. Hell get a Mac, they have more frequent releases and they charge you for every one of them.

Alrighty then, so Joe User needs to encrypt his porn and vacation pictures?

Maybe, who are you to say that his porn should be left out in the clear? But it would also be damned nice if he could encrypt his tax documents and other things that might be considered private.