The White House's second intern class -----MAWA

[fskimospy]

Ok. I will as soon as you tell me

Do you think we should secure our borders?

Why are you dodging it?

Sorry, you don’t get to make the rules. You made a claim, back it up.

 

[Jhhnn]

First, the Obama administration had the same phrasing on their internship website. So this is a non-starter. From the white house archives:
https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/participate/internships/selection



Second, to show bias in the intern selection process you would need to know the ratio of minorities and gender to white candidates versus who was selected. If it is the same than it is a non-starter.

Third, I would expect more minorities to apply for the Obama internship since they would align with Obama's mission which would explain the lower number in the Trump internship. It's not necessarily that more white candidates applied or were selected, it could be less minorities applied.

I'm not sure why the left is so hysterical over this issue.

What's up with HuffPost using a wall of tweets instead of writing an article.

Fancy dancin', huh? As I pointed out earlier, the GOP is ~89% White, give or take a little. So I figure that the ratio of applicants & acceptance ratio would be a reflection of that. Which means that there should be 8-10 non-white faces in that pic but I can only find two. I could be wrong, of course.

They're not even trying. It falls right in line with he general "screw you" tenor of the Admin entirely. That's right- we don't care what anybody thinks when we have the power to do what we want. Not with anything. Eat shit & die in a fire for all we care.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Right, you’re trying to redefine the question. No thanks.

Redefine the question? I asked you a simple one. Easy. That you won’t answer. Wonder why

 

[fskimospy]

Redefine the question? I asked you a simple one. Easy. That you won’t answer. Wonder why

The only reason is you tried to change the topic. It’s not complicated. If you think I’m wrong go and quote the original question that supports your question.

 

[Jhhnn]

The two of you need to get a room.

 

[Puffnstuff]

The WH sounds like a poorly managed frat party.

 

[HomerJS]

Going from a D to an R administration? Yep

So are you claiming people of color just aren't applying to the most plum intern job in the country?

How much effort to you think the administration put into attracting people of color?

Do you think they care?

Do you think the Trump administrations hiring practices mimic what has gone on in the country for years thereby freezing out people of color?

Do you think like the Trump White House the best jobs should go to almost only white people?

 

[Lanyap]

Fancy dancin', huh? As I pointed out earlier, the GOP is ~89% White, give or take a little. So I figure that the ratio of applicants & acceptance ratio would be a reflection of that. Which means that there should be 8-10 non-white faces in that pic but I can only find two. I could be wrong, of course.

They're not even trying. It falls right in line with he general "screw you" tenor of the Admin entirely. That's right- we don't care what anybody thinks when we have the power to do what we want. Not with anything. Eat shit & die in a fire for all we care.

The only fact about this issue is that there are less non-white people in this intern class versus a previous class. Everthing else is speculation.

 

[esquared]

The only fact about this issue is that there are less non-white people in this intern class versus a previous class. Everthing else is speculation.

That's rich.

Last year's class had 3 brown people, and this year it looks like 2.
https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/the-white-house-virtualy-all-white-summer-intern-class.2512253/
I say that looks like consistency to keep non-whites from these positions.

For one year you could make a very large stretch and say that's an anomaly. Two years in a row?
NFW.

 

[Lanyap]

That's rich.

Last year's class had 3 brown people, and this year it looks like 2.
https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/the-white-house-virtualy-all-white-summer-intern-class.2512253/
I say that looks like consistency to keep non-whites from these positions.

For one year you could make a very large stretch and say that's an anomaly. Two years in a row?
NFW.

Like I said, speculation.

 

[Jhhnn]

The only fact about this issue is that there are less non-white people in this intern class versus a previous class. Everthing else is speculation.

Which indicates that the WH isn't even trying to convince POC to support or join them. Oddly enough showing that disregard is one of the few honest things they've done.

 

[Zorba]

You may find this shocking but new in depth research demonstrates that black women are doing slightly better than white women in the work force. The problem seems to entirely rest on black males. This was not all that surprising to me as it kind of matches my life experience. My son's black friends are not doing well in school and spend their free time smoking pot with him. On the other hand, my daughter's black friends are excelling in school. I see female black professionals all the time but male black professionals are a rarity. This disparity between black males and black females is somewhat of a head scratcher.

Read the attached article. It is one of the best I have read in a long time. Thank god there are still some good journalists out there. I strongly suspect they are going to win some prizes for this one.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/03/19/upshot/race-class-white-and-black-men.html

That is a very interesting article, however, if you look at the second graph (not an image so I can add it to my post) you see that Black Men almost exactly line up with Black Women and White Women. So it isn't just that black men do poorly and everyone else does great. Its that white men have it easier than white women, or either gender of blacks.

Thanks for the link.

Edit: Just noticed this was discussed in the extended FAQ:

Some readers have asked why we didn’t write a story about white male privilege — instead of the obstacles faced by black men — given that black men, white women and black women raised at the same income level have similar incomes. If we pull out and look across the whole data set, Asian-American men have higher adult incomes than white men. Hispanic men fare relatively similarly to white men. And incomes between Hispanics and whites will converge in about two generations if these mobility patterns stay the same. That is simply not true of the gap between African-Americans and whites.

In other words, one of the real outliers in this data was black men, not white men. It is no doubt true that the gap between them is driven by both the advantages white men receive and the disadvantages black men face. But where you place the emphasis matters: You wind up with very different policy responses if you define this problem as one of white male privilege instead of one of structural obstacles surrounding black men.

— Emily Badger, Reporter, The Upshot

This is an excellent question. There are certainly gender differences in addition to differences across races (as is well known from prior work). And you are right that black men, white women and black women have similar individual incomes if they grow up in families that make the same amount of money; in contrast, incomes of white men are higher. Put differently, black males make as much as black females, while white males earn more than white females in individual incomes. The reason we focus on black men in particular is that they look distinct on many dimensions when we look beyond simple measures of income. Black men have much lower employment rates, lower high school completion rates and higher incarceration rates than black women and white men or women. This is not to minimize gender equity issues, of course — there is a large body of research studying factors that may lead to pay inequity and differences in career choices, work hours, etc., that we do not speak to in this study. But, in thinking about racial disparities, it does seem like there are a unique set of challenges for black men.

— The Equality of Opportunity Project researchers

 

[UglyCasanova]

The only reason is you tried to change the topic. It’s not complicated. If you think I’m wrong go and quote the original question that supports your question.

And he dodges. Very simple question. Won’t answer. Wonder why.

 

[fskimospy]

And he dodges. Very simple question. Won’t answer. Wonder why.

Yes, the quintessential dodge of ‘go address the question’.

 

[trenchfoot]

First, the Obama administration had the same phrasing on their internship website. So this is a non-starter. From the white house archives:
https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/participate/internships/selection



Second, to show bias in the intern selection process you would need to know the ratio of minorities and gender to white candidates versus who was selected. If it is the same than it is a non-starter.

Third, I would expect more minorities to apply for the Obama internship since they would align with Obama's mission which would explain the lower number in the Trump internship. It's not necessarily that more white candidates applied or were selected, it could be less minorities applied.

I'm not sure why the left is so hysterical over this issue.

What's up with HuffPost using a wall of tweets instead of writing an article.

Let me clarify for your edification: Quite obviously, the mission of the Obama and the Trump administrations were/are worlds apart in intent and purpose. For the fact that Trump has shown beyond doubt that he has racist leanings, that his policies show a dislike for immigrants of color (but Norwegians are OK though, right?) that he favors the very wealthy like himself much more than the middle class and the poor (big tax cuts for himself and his ilk and an expiring smidgin of a tax cut for the rest of us) and on and on and on all of which is the opposite of what Obama had clearly shown he championed.

It's these kinds of things that either attract or repel interns from attempting to and eventually gaining entry into the program. Although the selection process eventually determines who gets picked or not, it's the pool of applicants the administration gets to choose from that more so determines the makeup of the group. Those applicants that made the cut either didn't mind how racist the Trump administration has shown itself to be or actually supports such policies. Those potential applicants that didn't like what the Trump administration's policies are in regards to preference for a certain race or for being heavily in favor of the very wealthy obviously didn't bother to apply.

In other words, the applicant's decisions to apply or not ultimately determined the makeup of the group.

Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[esquared]

Like I said, speculation.

No.

Make America White again.

 

[Ackmed]

The selective outrage over this is silly without more knowledge about how selection was made.

 

[fskimospy]

The selective outrage over this is silly without more knowledge about how selection was made.

What additional knowledge do you require? I mean isn’t it pretty clear?

While Trump himself is undeniably racist I doubt there was much, if any racist intent here, it’s simply a result of the Republican Party having become a white ethnic party. There aren’t many minorities to choose from.

 

[Commodus]

Ok we’ve established that we need open borders.

Next on the list. Betsy Davos is a complete mess. Not sure if that means racism though, if there is any fill me in.

What has Trump done racist regarding healthcare? I work with plenty of POC and their insurance has gotten progressively worse year after year for the past four years or so. The ACA hasn’t helped them one bit, it just makes the insurance we get via our employer worse. So how is Trump racist in this regard.

Pardon not replying to things earlier... Easter with the folks and all that.

It's not so much any conscious racism on DeVos' part as the effect she has: she's not only unqualified, she has clear spite for the public education system that minorities are currently more reliant on by dint of inherited economic status and location. Why would minorities want to support a President whose education pick hurts them directly?

And ACA wasn't perfect, but again, it's not so much overt racism as intentional efforts to hurt lower-income people. Removing a program for affordable health care with no plans to replace it, and endorsing budgets that balloon the deficit when the Republicans fully intend to use that as an excuse to gut programs like Medicaid? Yeah, that's a giant FU to minorities.

It's important to remember that the root cause of this discussion wasn't just about explicit racism -- it's about reasons why minorities wouldn't support Trump (and certainly wouldn't sign up as interns). And in that case, there's no question that many of Trump's policies (or policies he endorses) clearly affect minorities to a disproportionate level. Could you actually name something he's done that would help black or Hispanic Americans?

 

[Puffnstuff]

What additional knowledge do you require? I mean isn’t it pretty clear?

While Trump himself is undeniably racist I doubt there was much, if any racist intent here, it’s simply a result of the Republican Party having become a white ethnic party. There aren’t many minorities to choose from.

Trumpettes will defend their orange god to the end no matter what he does.

 

[HomerJS]

The selective outrage over this is silly without more knowledge about how selection was made.

So you would have us believe after 8 years of a diverse White House intern staff it went almost all white right when Trump started for 2 successive years?

Do us all a favor, go find a common sense hat and put it on.

 

[fskimospy]

Pardon not replying to things earlier... Easter with the folks and all that.

It's not so much any conscious racism on DeVos' part as the effect she has: she's not only unqualified, she has clear spite for the public education system that minorities are currently more reliant on by dint of inherited economic status and location. Why would minorities want to support a President whose education pick hurts them directly?

And ACA wasn't perfect, but again, it's not so much overt racism as intentional efforts to hurt lower-income people. Removing a program for affordable health care with no plans to replace it, and endorsing budgets that balloon the deficit when the Republicans fully intend to use that as an excuse to gut programs like Medicaid? Yeah, that's a giant FU to minorities.

It's important to remember that the root cause of this discussion wasn't just about explicit racism -- it's about reasons why minorities wouldn't support Trump (and certainly wouldn't sign up as interns). And in that case, there's no question that many of Trump's policies (or policies he endorses) clearly affect minorities to a disproportionate level. Could you actually name something he's done that would help black or Hispanic Americans?

He already said economic growth caused by banking deregulation. I’m not kidding.

 

[Ackmed]

What additional knowledge do you require? I mean isn’t it pretty clear?

While Trump himself is undeniably racist I doubt there was much, if any racist intent here, it’s simply a result of the Republican Party having become a white ethnic party. There aren’t many minorities to choose from.

How many people applied for this? What percentage were black compared to previous years? Do you think that more black people would apply for an Obama WH or a Trump WH? Do you think that some black conservatives don't like to put themselves out there because they get called traitors and Uncle Toms? There is a lot of additional information I would like to have. And any reasonable person would before casting judgement. I would bet that there was a much smaller pool of black candidates for this over years past. A picture does not tell everything. You can't just make things happen when there aren't enough people. Forced diversity is not a good thing.

If there is proof that a white person was selected over a black person simply because of the color of their skin, then obviously that is wrong. If a black person was passed over for a white person who had a better resume, experience or whatever else they use to select them with, thats wrong. Anyone and everyone in the process of that should be dealt with. Likewise, putting a black person over a white person who is more qualified is also wrong. Yet that is what a lot of people want. Because it sounds like, without any real facts, that you want more black people there just because they are black. No matter if they are more qualified or not. We don't have any numbers, qualifications, or anything else.

Do you think that all employers should be forced to have a certain number of races, or do you think that job performance, resume, experience, school, etc. should factor in also?

 

[fskimospy]

How many people applied for this? What percentage were black compared to previous years? Do you think that more black people would apply for an Obama WH or a Trump WH? Do you think that some black conservatives don't like to put themselves out there because they get called traitors and Uncle Toms? There is a lot of additional information I would like to have. And any reasonable person would before casting judgement. I would bet that there was a much smaller pool of black candidates for this over years past. A picture does not tell everything. You can't just make things happen when there aren't enough people. Forced diversity is not a good thing.

If there is proof that a white person was selected over a black person simply because of the color of their skin, then obviously that is wrong. If a black person was passed over for a white person who had a better resume, experience or whatever else they use to select them with, thats wrong. Anyone and everyone in the process of that should be dealt with. Likewise, putting a black person over a white person who is more qualified is also wrong. Yet that is what a lot of people want. Because it sounds like, without any real facts, that you want more black people there just because they are black. No matter if they are more qualified or not. We don't have any numbers, qualifications, or anything else.

Do you think that all employers should be forced to have a certain number of races, or do you think that job performance, resume, experience, school, etc. should factor in also?

I don't think you read my post very closely as it had nothing to do with selecting for diversity.

There was almost certainly a much smaller pool of nonwhite this year than in years past, my post said as much. This is likely due to the fact that the Republican Party has become a white ethnic party, which was precisely my point. The Republican Party now has such limited appeal to nonwhites that they basically can't hire groups of people that look even remotely like America's actual ethnic makeup. Don't you find that incredibly disturbing?

 

[brycejones]

I don't think you read my post very closely as it had nothing to do with selecting for diversity.

There was almost certainly a much smaller pool of nonwhite this year than in years past, my post said as much. This is likely due to the fact that the Republican Party has become a white ethnic party, which was precisely my point. The Republican Party now has such limited appeal to nonwhites that they basically can't hire groups of people that look even remotely like America's actual ethnic makeup. Don't you find that incredibly disturbing?

You're the real racist for pointing that out.