Originally posted by: flashbacck
Are you guys still arguing about the cause of UT3 mediocre success? I'm going to gently suggest you drop it. No one is ever going to change their mind and jbourne's just going to keep berating people who disagree with him.
		
		
	 
LOL, I'm was thinking the same thing
Look, between the two of you, you guys both have your points that I think are very valid.  I also think that some of the points that you two kept going back and forth on is relative, as in it's relative to what someone thinks is complex such as map making.  
Personally, out of all the UT series, I'm more of a UT2004 player.  When UT3 was coming out, I wanted an evolution of what UT2004 was.  The UI, matchmaking, maps and everything else that was not the game mechanic and actual game play did not matter to me.  The UI was more of an annoyance than anything, which I can get over after jumping through the hoops to get into a game.  
I got it when it first came out, played it, but kept going back to UT2004.  I couldn't stand half the weapons, especially the damn goo that all the noobs just spam everywhere.  I play only DM, so movement is key for me.  Where's the double dodge +jump?  Where's my shield?  The game mechanics, although decent, is not what I wanted.  Yes, I know that they consolised the game so the PS3 and 360 players can play it, and make it more noob friendly, hence the spammy weapons and less emphasis on scan hit weapons like the sniper and shock.  
I still played UT3 before the patch every now and then, but didn't go out of my way to try to play it.  
So personally for me:
Did the little changes to the UI after the patch improved it? No.  Did the new maps make me play more?  No.  How about the gametypes?  No.  I still played it occassionally like I did before.  The only game type that I play now is Betrayal, if they didn't have that I would just play regular DM and TDM.  
I am glad that Epic did try to drum up more interest in the game, and it can only increase the player base, which I am glad it's happening.