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The UN and America: What say you?

cwjerome

Diamond Member
There are those in the United States that just adore the United Nations, with all its ?consensus-building? and ?multilateral initiatives.? Most of all they love how the UN is the only body that can really tell America what to do. This is because in the Liberal Elite?s eyes, the UN is the only legitimate authority in the world, and the eeeevil US is a rogue nation that needs to be brought into line.

To most people, the fairly dysfunctional UN is a moderately useful debating club that can somewhat help problem areas of the world out. But to the elites, the UN?s main and most important function is to control America. You have to understand how the elite?s think: Their veiled anti-Americanism and not-so-implicit bigotry towards ?Joe six-pack? (ie. the unwashed masses, the stupids who live in the ?dumbfvckistan? red states) promotes an ideology that thinks the whole consent-of-the-governed stuff is obsolete. 😕

Most Americans still believe being governed by our own elected officials is a GOOD thing? the fact the we elect them is the source of their legitimacy. The UN is an unelected body full of anti-America international elites and nondemocratic countries. It is not an institution created by ?or for- the American people, it is not recognized by our Constitution, and to most normal people it has no legitimacy in telling America what to do. The Liberal Elite gameplan to subvert U.S. laws and authority to better mesh with the ?more enlightened? views (note: see ?Liberal Elite love of Old Europe?) of other countries, just doesn?t tickle the average American?s fancy.

Remember, the elites know their views aren?t succeeding at the ballot boxes, so besides calling the majority of Americans idiots, they must also do anything they can to go over our heads? namely judicial activism and increasing the role of international agencies like the UN. Foreign policy-wise, the elites are trying to make it so the United States could do little internationally (and even domestically) without first clearing it with our ?partners?? a codeword for our international elite friends.

The day our courts start imposing foreign moods, fads and fashions on Americans is the day America dies, along with the last greatest hope for human civilization on earth. When the decisions of foreign courts and the views of international organizations decide American disputes or determine the constitutionality of our laws comes, the Liberal Elites will have successfully ?reigned? in America?s evilness? and the backwards Anti-American Revolution will be complete. 🙁
 
I drive a 15-year old Ford wagon, used to work in a hardware store, and I still believe the United Nations is a necessary and useful organization. There goes your "elite" theory.
 
I drive a 15-year old Ford wagon, used to work in a hardware store, and I still believe the United Nations is a necessary and useful organization. There goes your "elite" theory.

I didn't realize I stated everyone who supports the UN were elites. BTW, I know people personally who aren't "Liberal Elites" who happen to appreciate the UN... so you're not alone. Obviously, I'm not referring to them (or you).
 
Originally posted by: CubicZirconia
I drive a 15-year old Ford wagon, used to work in a hardware store, and I still believe the United Nations is a necessary and useful organization. There goes your "elite" theory.

The term elite does not only refer to economic status, but sometimes just a nasty state of mind. Like Blue states over Red states!

 
Originally posted by: Condor
Originally posted by: CubicZirconia
I drive a 15-year old Ford wagon, used to work in a hardware store, and I still believe the United Nations is a necessary and useful organization. There goes your "elite" theory.

The term elite does not only refer to economic status, but sometimes just a nasty state of mind. Like Blue states over Red states!

My statement was only meant to point out the highly stereotypical nature of the original post. Like any stereotype, there's only a tiny number of people that it actually applies to in whole. Beyond that you're just throwing around labels and imposing views on groups that don't actual have them. The OP could have simply stated that he hated the democratic party and dropped this whole UN cover. That's what this is really about isn't it?
 
Condor, elite status -as I use it- is definately mainly a state of mind, and has very little to do economic status. The UN is a joke to many people, but because of the elite's love for it as a tool for subordinating American power and ideas, there can be no meaningful structural reform for the failed organization.

The recent bit of elitism, accidentally slipped for all to hear by that sniveling UN bureaucrat from Norway, is just another blade of elitist grass in a prairie of UN arrogance. Instead of uniting and gathering courage and support, the stuffed suit has the gall to criticize the entity that had helped the most up until that point. Instead of helping to spearhead aid and build-up hopes and efforts, he choose to let his elite ideology TEAR-DOWN. The worst part of course is the remark that the United States would have more money to help if it had higher taxes. Thanks for the political scolding on low taxes sir, and I'm sure being the good elite you're extremely magmanimous with other people's money, but try not to use this tragedy to promote your silly little elite ideology.

By the way, "Team America" is some funny sh*t... 😉
 
I really wish that you'd drop the "elite" thing. If they were the elite, then they'd have power. If they were elitist, then they'd support policies that raise the elite over the common man. Your terminology makes no sense.

As for the US being a "rogue" state, I will avoid alleging that that is the case today. I will, however, point out that the view that any state is incapable of acting as a rogue state due to some kind moral superiority is, itself, elitist.
 
Ah yes, I was missing cwjerome and his "elite" ranting around here lately.

Look, the problem with the whole argument is that it only applies to a very small portion of the left, and you have no basis whatsoever for using those views to paint all liberals, or anyone who likes the UN for that matter, as a bunch of anti-US, UN loving commies. The fact is that all you have is your narrow view of people who disagree with you, like you can shove them all onto the same shelf simply because YOU don't agree with them. You obviously have a very high opinion of yourself and your own views, and you have no respect for the other side, yet THEY are elitist?

It's been said before, but I guess it needs repeating: unless you have some proof to support your ideas, they rest firmly in the pile with the rest of the overly-broad, negative characterizations of a group you happen to disagree with. There are many levels of supporting the UN, it's not an all or nothing sort of thing. I personally think the whole "fvck the UN" mindset is pretty damn stupid, but I also think the UN has its flaws and, in the end, the US should govern itself. The problem is that some people can't move beyond Bush's "you're either with us or against us" polarization of any issue.

Please, write this down and study it before making any more attacks against anyone: There are more than two sides to every issue. That way, instead of overly broad, pointless ranting, maybe we could discuss things in a useful manner.

Edit: As an example of what I'm talking about, how many people who support the idea of the UN (to whatever degree) do you imagine think that the whole "consent of the goverened stuff is obsolete"? What percentage? Do you have any idea?
 
Originally posted by: Kibbo
I really wish that you'd drop the "elite" thing. If they were the elite, then they'd have power. If they were elitist, then they'd support policies that raise the elite over the common man. Your terminology makes no sense.

As for the US being a "rogue" state, I will avoid alleging that that is the case today. I will, however, point out that the view that any state is incapable of acting as a rogue state due to some kind moral superiority is, itself, elitist.

I suppose we need to ban the title "Elite" here since "Elites" are by nature evil, or so it would seem.

"Nazis and Communists don't like Intellectuals or other Elites either"

True. The first thing governments not worth having do is marginalize them.

Also the concept of the UN running the US is plain silly. It's the job of the UN to influence other countries. Anyone who believes the US is above the suggestions of others is well "elitist" in the negative sense clearly intended.

Last for now is that a great non-Elites are all for spreading "superior" American values at the point of a gun.

Perhaps the problem with intellectuals is that they are less likely to invoke killing as a means of foreign policy. Maybe they are "Elite" because they don't follow the herd mentality and rush to trample others in the name of their own beliefs.
 
Originally posted by: cwjerome
Condor, elite status -as I use it- is definately mainly a state of mind, and has very little to do economic status. The UN is a joke to many people, but because of the elite's love for it as a tool for subordinating American power and ideas, there can be no meaningful structural reform for the failed organization.

The recent bit of elitism, accidentally slipped for all to hear by that sniveling UN bureaucrat from Norway, is just another blade of elitist grass in a prairie of UN arrogance. Instead of uniting and gathering courage and support, the stuffed suit has the gall to criticize the entity that had helped the most up until that point. Instead of helping to spearhead aid and build-up hopes and efforts, he choose to let his elite ideology TEAR-DOWN. The worst part of course is the remark that the United States would have more money to help if it had higher taxes. Thanks for the political scolding on low taxes sir, and I'm sure being the good elite you're extremely magmanimous with other people's money, but try not to use this tragedy to promote your silly little elite ideology.

By the way, "Team America" is some funny sh*t... 😉

Happy New Year! Peace and good health should encompass the world. The forum would go out of business and that would be fitting!

 
Originally posted by: cwjerome
Condor, elite status -as I use it- is definately mainly a state of mind, and has very little to do economic status.
You mean like us in the Blue states calling Texas Dumbfukistan and the other Red States "Jesus Land?"
 
Originally posted by: cwjerome
There are those in the United States that just adore the United Nations, with all its ?consensus-building? and ?multilateral initiatives.? Most of all they love how the UN is the only body that can really tell America what to do. This is because in the Liberal Elite?s eyes, the UN is the only legitimate authority in the world, and the eeeevil US is a rogue nation that needs to be brought into line.

To most people, the fairly dysfunctional UN is a moderately useful debating club that can somewhat help problem areas of the world out. But to the elites, the UN?s main and most important function is to control America. You have to understand how the elite?s think: Their veiled anti-Americanism and not-so-implicit bigotry towards ?Joe six-pack? (ie. the unwashed masses, the stupids who live in the ?dumbfvckistan? red states) promotes an ideology that thinks the whole consent-of-the-governed stuff is obsolete. 😕

Most Americans still believe being governed by our own elected officials is a GOOD thing? the fact the we elect them is the source of their legitimacy. The UN is an unelected body full of anti-America international elites and nondemocratic countries. It is not an institution created by ?or for- the American people, it is not recognized by our Constitution, and to most normal people it has no legitimacy in telling America what to do. The Liberal Elite gameplan to subvert U.S. laws and authority to better mesh with the ?more enlightened? views (note: see ?Liberal Elite love of Old Europe?) of other countries, just doesn?t tickle the average American?s fancy.

Remember, the elites know their views aren?t succeeding at the ballot boxes, so besides calling the majority of Americans idiots, they must also do anything they can to go over our heads? namely judicial activism and increasing the role of international agencies like the UN. Foreign policy-wise, the elites are trying to make it so the United States could do little internationally (and even domestically) without first clearing it with our ?partners?? a codeword for our international elite friends.

The day our courts start imposing foreign moods, fads and fashions on Americans is the day America dies, along with the last greatest hope for human civilization on earth. When the decisions of foreign courts and the views of international organizations decide American disputes or determine the constitutionality of our laws comes, the Liberal Elites will have successfully ?reigned? in America?s evilness? and the backwards Anti-American Revolution will be complete. 🙁

This is interesting bcause its the *real* elites are the ones advocating anti-un crap. You know the people who control our TV and radio stations, financial systams military and most of the government.
 
Originally posted by: Condor
Originally posted by: cwjerome
Condor, elite status -as I use it- is definately mainly a state of mind, and has very little to do economic status. The UN is a joke to many people, but because of the elite's love for it as a tool for subordinating American power and ideas, there can be no meaningful structural reform for the failed organization.

The recent bit of elitism, accidentally slipped for all to hear by that sniveling UN bureaucrat from Norway, is just another blade of elitist grass in a prairie of UN arrogance. Instead of uniting and gathering courage and support, the stuffed suit has the gall to criticize the entity that had helped the most up until that point. Instead of helping to spearhead aid and build-up hopes and efforts, he choose to let his elite ideology TEAR-DOWN. The worst part of course is the remark that the United States would have more money to help if it had higher taxes. Thanks for the political scolding on low taxes sir, and I'm sure being the good elite you're extremely magmanimous with other people's money, but try not to use this tragedy to promote your silly little elite ideology.

By the way, "Team America" is some funny sh*t... 😉

Happy New Year! Peace and good health should encompass the world. The forum would go out of business and that would be fitting!

Don't kid yourself, people find lots to bitch about no matter what...they'll always find something. And no, not just the liberals 😉

Happy New Year anyways! :beer:
 
First "liberal" became a slanderous term, now "elite" is too? Count me as an elite then-I still believe in the dream started by Woodrow Wilson and the League of Nations. In the long run, it's the best hope for humanity.
 
Originally posted by: cwjerome
The day our courts start imposing foreign moods, fads and fashions on Americans is the day America dies, along with the last greatest hope for human civilization on earth. When the decisions of foreign courts and the views of international organizations decide American disputes or determine the constitutionality of our laws comes, the Liberal Elites will have successfully ?reigned? in America?s evilness? and the backwards Anti-American Revolution will be complete. 🙁
The day we start ignoring the way others in the world perceive our actions is the day we start down the road to imperialistic conquest. Oh... Wait a minute... The Bushwhackos have already started. :|

Proud to be a liberal. Other than the title someone hung on me on the forums, I'll leave it for others to determine what constitutes "elite." Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going out to hug a tree. 😎

 
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