The Ultimate SM3.0 Game Thread

[Bar81]

Is SM3.0 a feature you should consider when buying a video card? Well let's take a look.

List of games released and their support for SM3.0:

FarCry - SM2.0b (on X800 cards) does everything SM3.0 can do and using HDR means you can't use AA, which means the return of the jaggies.

Chronicles of Riddick - not truly SM3.0 but uses Soft Shadows in 2.0++ mode. Unfortunately, game performance is crippled by 50%+ drop in framerates using this option

Painkiller - SM3.0 enabled but for what exactly? Game does not look better or play faster than on ATI hardware.

Pitfall Harry - SM3.0 for water effects. Crap game.

Pacific Fighters - SM3.0 for water effects.

Medal of Honor: Pacific Assault - ?

Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines - ?

Driver 3.0 - ?

Grafan - ?

Lord of the Rings, Battle For Middle-earth - ?



Upcoming Games supporting PS3.0

Splinter Cell Chaos Theory - SM3.0 inplemented but reportedly, like Riddick, game performance is crippled by 50%+ drop in framerates using this option

Stalker: Shadows of Chernobyl

Age of Empires

If there's anything missing please lmk. It's also interesting that there's no SM3.0 game list on nvidia's website that I know of.

 

[hans030390]

I think Elder Scrolls 4: Oblivion will be SM3.0 as well as the Unreal 3 engine...

the games today are only 2.0 optimized really. Give it a year, and SM2.0 cards will either play the games really bad, or look like crap.

 

[Bar81]

The problem with the Unreal 3 engine is that's it's a 2006 thing so it's not really upcoming yet. Interesting to hear about Elder Scrolls. Have a link? I don't know, I just can't see developers suddenly giving up on SM2.0 and jumping to SM3.0 when a HUGE portion of cards support the former but not the latter. There probably will be more SM3.0 games in the future but at the same time simply having SM3.0 isn't the point. SM3.0 to be a useful feature needs to add something to a game that is unavailable with earler pixel shader revisions and really makes a difference that you can discern without killing performance or disabling key features like AA.

 

[Tab]

Good Thread. I've been wondering the same myself recently, I almost bought a 6800GT PCI-E becasue of this, being I am a huge Age Of Empires Fan. Someone early posted Splinter Cell Pictures with 3.0 and 2.1. There really wasn't that much of a difference. A 3.0 game will run a 2.0 card, it just won't have the 3.0 futures. Which puts us back at 3.0. What are the visual enhancements this shader models give us? If a 3.0 game runs like crap, is is 3.0 or is the game just that great? Unreal 3 is a long ways off and it seems thats the same case with many other games. Most enthusiasts may even upgrade by this time.

 

[hans030390]

well heres the link to the oblivion website...i dont see anything about SM stuff, but the screens really look like SM3.0 stuff

http://www.elderscrolls.com/games/oblivion_overview.htm

 

[CheesePoofs]

The SM3.0 in pacific fighters is used for water effects only. As far as I can tell, the water looks fine as it is, and you really shouldn't be looking at the pretty water while trying to shoot someone out of the sky.

 

[hans030390]

Well, SM3.0 looks a little better while offering better performance then using SM2.0, so thats awesome

but yeah, if you are gonna upgrade a card every year, dont worry about it yet, but if you're like me, once every 4 years lol, you want the SM3.0

 

[Bar81]

Originally posted by: CheesePoofs
The SM3.0 in pacific fighters is used for water effects only. As far as I can tell, the water looks fine as it is, and you really shouldn't be looking at the pretty water while trying to shoot someone out of the sky.

Thanks for that, I'll update.

 

[Bar81]

Originally posted by: hans030390
Well, SM3.0 looks a little better while offering better performance then using SM2.0, so thats awesome

but yeah, if you are gonna upgrade a card every year, dont worry about it yet, but if you're like me, once every 4 years lol, you want the SM3.0

The problem is that we're still guessing as to if it's going to be useful and to what extent because I don't think we've seen what SM3.0 is all about *yet* But if you're on a four year upgrade cycle you may have a point

Personally, by the time I think SM3.0 will be useful with the Unreal 3.0 engine almost 2 years from now, I'm sure that most of us will upgrade if it makes that much of a difference or upgrade because we were planning on it anyway.

 

[Bar81]

Originally posted by: hans030390
I think Elder Scrolls 4: Oblivion will be SM3.0 as well as the Unreal 3 engine...

the games today are only 2.0 optimized really. Give it a year, and SM2.0 cards will either play the games really bad, or look like crap.

I searched their forums and googled it and no mention of SM3.0

 

[sellmen]

Far cry isn't an issue IMO. Far cry is one game that absolutely needs AA to look great, I'll take no jaggies over shiny lights any day.

Chronicles of Riddick hashuge performance problems when using 2.0++ - the only resolution that's reasonably playable is 800x600. Again, not acceptable.

Splinter Cell seems to be the one game that will make use of SM3.0. The new Unreal engine isn't coming out for two years and reportedly stresses even SLI'd 6800 ultras. Buying a card now for that game makes no sense whatsoever.

 

[ZobarStyl]

I'm sorry, I don't quite get the point of this thread other than to steer people away from nVidia cards because they have an extra feature that may or may not be useful yet? The list of upcoming games you put forth plus ES Oblivion are reason enough to get an SM3.0 card, as if the fact that the 6800GT isn't already the best bang for buck AGP card (just explaining my decision to get an nV card). "Unfortunately for nVidia?" Why, because a game is written that can take advantage of their hardware, but it's their fault that HDR in Far Cry disables AA? And why is it "Unfortunate for nVidia" that a game has a high quality NON-SM3.0 mode that drops performance for a visual effect? So your saying that this feature wouldn't effect an ATi card in the exact same way? Unless I'm missing something, this is just pure fanboyism.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Bar81

Originally posted by: hans030390
Well, SM3.0 looks a little better while offering better performance then using SM2.0, so thats awesome

but yeah, if you are gonna upgrade a card every year, dont worry about it yet, but if you're like me, once every 4 years lol, you want the SM3.0

The problem is that we're still guessing as to if it's going to be useful and to what extent because I don't think we've seen what SM3.0 is all about *yet* But if you're on a four year upgrade cycle you may have a point

Personally, by the time I think SM3.0 will be useful with the Unreal 3.0 engine almost 2 years from now, I'm sure that most of us will upgrade if it makes that much of a difference or upgrade because we were planning on it anyway.

LOL

Bar81, you are like the old man yelling "Get a horse!" at the guy driving by in a car when they first came out.

It's really nice you want to defend the X800XT PE with it's 2002 feature set, but it comes down to it's purchasers gain nothing* by having an X800 and the rest of us get to see the new tech.

*X800XT PE runs games at high res, high AA/AF? So does a 6800U, and SLI beats both.

 

[Bar81]

Originally posted by: ZobarStyl
I'm sorry, I don't quite get the point of this thread other than to steer people away from nVidia cards because they have an extra feature that may or may not be useful yet? The list of upcoming games you put forth plus ES Oblivion are reason enough to get an SM3.0 card, as if the fact that the 6800GT isn't already the best bang for buck AGP card (just explaining my decision to get an nV card). "Unfortunately for nVidia?" Why, because a game is written that can take advantage of their hardware, but it's their fault that HDR in Far Cry disables AA? And why is it "Unfortunate for nVidia" that a game has a high quality NON-SM3.0 mode that drops performance for a visual effect? So your saying that this feature wouldn't effect an ATi card in the exact same way? Unless I'm missing something, this is just pure fanboyism.

The point of this thread is to inform people of the facts and to allow them to make an informed decision. Something many people on these boards seem averse to. If you want to buy a 6800 card go right ahead, just don't do it for that magical SM3.0

Again, you're putting forth your opinion on whether SM3.0 has a point. That's fine, but people don't care what you think, they can make up their own mind based upon facts.

 

[Bar81]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: Bar81

Originally posted by: hans030390
Well, SM3.0 looks a little better while offering better performance then using SM2.0, so thats awesome

but yeah, if you are gonna upgrade a card every year, dont worry about it yet, but if you're like me, once every 4 years lol, you want the SM3.0

The problem is that we're still guessing as to if it's going to be useful and to what extent because I don't think we've seen what SM3.0 is all about *yet* But if you're on a four year upgrade cycle you may have a point

Personally, by the time I think SM3.0 will be useful with the Unreal 3.0 engine almost 2 years from now, I'm sure that most of us will upgrade if it makes that much of a difference or upgrade because we were planning on it anyway.

LOL

Bar81, you are like the old man yelling "Get a horse!" at the guy driving by in a car when they first came out.

It's really nice you want to defend the X800XT PE with it's 2002 feature set, but it comes down to it's purchasers gain nothing* by having an X800 and the rest of us get to see the new tech.

*X800XT PE runs games at high res, high AA/AF? So does a 6800U, and SLI beats both.

Wow, Rollo, way to offer all those useful *facts* to this thread. <thread IQ drops two points> We don't need your cheerleading, I'm sure nvidia has enough PR people.

 

[razor2025]

lol, it's okay. Rollo is always just like that. As for SM 3.0 in future, I'm not too sure how many developers will utilize it fully. Current games barely touches SM 3.0 and there aren't THAT many titles that has announced major SM3.0 support.

 

[ZobarStyl]

Again, you're putting forth your opinion on whether SM3.0 has a point. That's fine, but people don't care what you think, they can make up their own mind based upon facts.

So your high and mighty opinion is the word of God, but my lowly interjection is just a smudge on the decision making abilities of good people? And the "facts" you present are just propaganda, making it look like not only is SM3.0 not useful yet, but if you buy a SM3.0 card, the evil shaders will jump out of your monitor and murder your dog. I have yet to turn 3.0 on, but if I choose to, I can, so it does absolutely nothing to hurt my performance if I choose to stay in 2.0 (just like an ATi card), and my purchase is just as valid. I didn't buy a 3.0 card, I bought a 6800GT that performed best at its price point, and 3.0 was just an added bonus.

As much as I can't stand Rollo's constant nVidia PR pushing here, your ATi FUD Dept. is no better.

 

[Bar81]

If it's "propoganda" as you claim please point out how it's inaccurate?

As to your opinion, sorry, it really doesn't matter and neither does mine, that's why nowhere in this thread do I advocate nvidia or ATI because in fact I've owned both a 6800 and X800 card and don't have a problem with either.

Originally posted by: ZobarStyl

I didn't buy a 3.0 card, I bought a 6800GT that performed best at its price point, and 3.0 was just an added bonus.

EXCELLENT, that's EXACTLY what you should do and the point of this thread.

 

[nRollo]

As much as I can't stand Rollo's constant nVidia PR pushing here, your ATi FUD Dept. is no better.

Now wait a minute- I'm not even in a thread like this if it's not full of BS FUD, and I'd be here in the same capacity if it was anti ATI in some inaccurate way.

You've been around long enough to know that I'm first and foremost a hardware nut, and will buy/pimp whatever appeals to my gearhead nature, and usually what doesn't as well.

 

[ZobarStyl]

It's just the wording Bar, the reiterated "Unfortunately for nVidia" thing, as if any card doing 3.0 wouldn't have the same problem. Post the facts, I'm all for it, but watch the wording as it almost makes it out to be negative feature, whereas what I think you're trying to say is that it's not as positive a feature as nV would like you to believe. I think we can both agree that in it's current incarnation, 3.0 is benign at best.

Edit: Fair enough Rollo, you do get very excited about hardware, no matter who makes it :thumbsup: I forget your 5 year old pimps a freaking x800XT PE, which puts my GT to shame in damn near everything.

 

[Bar81]

You definitely have a point there, I've changed the wording to remove any insinuations.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Bar81
Is SM3.0 a feature you should consider when buying a video card? . . .

If there's anything missing please lmk. It's also interesting that there's no SM3.0 game list on nvidia's website that I know of.

ati thinks SM 3.0 is important enough to include it in it's R520 core - this Spring.
:roll:

 

[Bar81]

So, what's your point?

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Bar81
So, what's your point?

look at my edited post . . . it directly answers what you asked [in bold].

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: Bar81
Is SM3.0 a feature you should consider when buying a video card? . . .

If there's anything missing please lmk. It's also interesting that there's no SM3.0 game list on nvidia's website that I know of.

ati thinks SM 3.0 is important enough to include it in it's R520 core - this Spring.

edit . . .. so, 'yes', you should consider SM 3.0 when buying a videocard.

 

[Bar81]

You came to a conclusion without a logical argument in support of SM3.0 being a deciding factor in a purchasing decision. I fail to see how you made a point.