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The Trump Tariffs thread

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dank69 said:
Yeah our expiring hardware from the 90s is enough to stop Russia but China, China stands a chance. We only outspend them what? 10 to 1?
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i've been out of the defense world for a bit, but the last i read was china does not need to defeat the US in a head to head war. it merely needs to deter carrier groups - thus the hypersonic missiles. make defending taiwan so horrendously costly that the US wouldn't risk its crown jewels of power projection
 
Fenixgoon said:
i've been out of the defense world for a bit, but the last i read was china does not need to defeat the US in a head to head war. it merely needs to deter carrier groups - thus the hypersonic missiles. make defending taiwan so horrendously costly that the US wouldn't risk its crown jewels of power projection
Click to expand...
I have never been in the defense world but I find it quite difficult to believe China could disable all of our carrier groups in 20 minutes. Russia was supposed to be the 2nd most powerful military in the world before we pantsed them in Ukraine. That means even if China is better than Russia they are close enough to each other to both be an order of magnitude less powerful.
 
dank69 said:
I have never been in the defense world but I find it quite difficult to believe China could disable all of our carrier groups in 20 minutes. Russia was supposed to be the 2nd most powerful military in the world before we pantsed them in Ukraine. That means even if China is better than Russia they are close enough to each other to both be an order of magnitude less powerful.
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I seem to remember reading some news report there was a war games simulation run in early 2000's when the Bush administration wanted to invade Iran.

They wanted to see if they could use carriers in the gulf to support the invasion. However a simple simulation of the Iranians using 30,000 piloted small boats with explosives on board showed.. the carrier force could not shoot down all 30,000 boats. After a while one would actually hit and damage the carrier and it would go downhill from there.

But that was then and this is now.. China can probably use the same strategy with drones and if they have enough.. no way the US carrier force can shoot them down with 100% effect.

Drones have changed the battlefield calcuations dramatically.
 
Indus said:
But that was then and this is now.. China can probably use the same strategy with drones and if they have enough.. no way the US carrier force can shoot them down with 100% effect.

Drones have changed the battlefield calcuations dramatically.
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I don't think the problem is sinking a carrier, I'm fairly certain most countries could do it if they wanted to put that sort of resources into it. The problem, I think, it is what happens after you do? How does America respond? Is it worth the retaliation?
I really think that is what stops China from going after Tiawan, not the fear that they would not be able to take down a carrier fleet, but what happens when they do.
 
dank69 said:
I have never been in the defense world but I find it quite difficult to believe China could disable all of our carrier groups in 20 minutes. Russia was supposed to be the 2nd most powerful military in the world before we pantsed them in Ukraine. That means even if China is better than Russia they are close enough to each other to both be an order of magnitude less powerful.
Click to expand...

Hasn't Ukraine been shooting down their supposed hypersonic missiles with Patriot?
 
Very interesting interview by Ezra Klein on the state of US vs China.

I don't think the US torching its international relations will come as a surprise to any of us here, but what definitely caught me were the "dark factories" that are fully robotic save for periodic maintenance. No humans required. That's some advanced engineering shit. And yeah, they are wayyyyyyyyyy ahead on BEVs

 
lol these monsters are just so fucking stupid. I enjoy every time another country tells them to fuck off on something. I understand they will have to be strategic for things at first, but it's all about mitigating the pain while they decouple from the US as much as possible. And that takes time.

www.irishtimes.com

US to demand EU pulls away from China in return for cutting tariffs

Confidential briefing documents identify what US may seek in talks and point to early move on pharma tariffs
www.irishtimes.com www.irishtimes.com
 
BoomerD said:
Well...dammit...I didn't think the leopards would eat MY face...

www.theguardian.com

‘Shock to the system’: farmers hit by Trump’s tariffs and cuts say they need another bailout

With extreme weather and Trump’s looming trade war, US farmers are reeling and resigned to needing more cash help
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
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Any of those fuckers who suffer that voted for Trump, I'll cheers a beer for every fucknut that loses their farm because of this shit show.

Man I am gonna be drunk a lot with all this delicious schadenfreude.
 
dank69 said:
Yeah our expiring hardware from the 90s is enough to stop Russia but China, China stands a chance. We only outspend them what? 10 to 1?
Click to expand...
It's about 7:2 now but it's most likely closer than that. U.S. MIC is highly inefficient with its spending so we had to do things like cancel the F22 program because it was too expensive. For a long time, we were wasting fuck-tons of money on wars in AF and IQ but at least that had ended.

To some extent, China is trying to copy us with more aircraft carriers and near peer fighter jets so the spending gap is only going to narrow further.


SMOGZINN said:
I don't think the problem is sinking a carrier, I'm fairly certain most countries could do it if they wanted to put that sort of resources into it.
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LOL wut? 🤣
 
MrSquished said:
Any of those fuckers who suffer that voted for Trump, I'll cheers a beer for every fucknut that loses their farm because of this shit show.

Man I am gonna be drunk a lot with all this delicious schadenfreude.
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The issue are the democrat farmers, they are minority and get the worst scenario... even worse with the Russian farmers
 
DZero said:
The issue are the democrat farmers, they are minority and get the worst scenario... even worse with the Russian farmers
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As I said, I take no pleasure in their suffering and I voted and campaigned for the other candidate. This is why I specifically said I will enjoy the suffering of the MAGA voting farmers - it's a very clear case by case scenario.
 
dank69 said:
Yeah our expiring hardware from the 90s is enough to stop Russia but China, China stands a chance. We only outspend them what? 10 to 1?
Click to expand...

Nowhere near that, but if you take into account they are likely getting at least 5x more for their money spent by not getting raked over the coals by the aerospace/defense contractors like the US is, you can see why this is no joke.
 
dank69 said:
I have never been in the defense world but I find it quite difficult to believe China could disable all of our carrier groups in 20 minutes. Russia was supposed to be the 2nd most powerful military in the world before we pantsed them in Ukraine. That means even if China is better than Russia they are close enough to each other to both be an order of magnitude less powerful.
Click to expand...
Russia isnt even in the same ballpark as China, my dude. Their broken down cold war era equipment billowing black smoke is pretty damned sad. Do you remember the opening ceremony for the 2008 Olympics in Bejing? No other ceremony has come even close to that before or since, and for good reason: their seriousness about education and hard work and the way they work together and for the country is incredible. Its quite clear that the only thing the US will have over China in very short order is that we are/were a democracy and they are communists.
 
MrSquished said:
lol Boy everyone is going to rush to do business with the US

www.irishtimes.com

US to demand EU pulls away from China in return for cutting tariffs

Confidential briefing documents identify what US may seek in talks and point to early move on pharma tariffs
www.irishtimes.com www.irishtimes.com
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They really think every other country should just abandon any self preservation and cater to them. They threaten every countries financial health but damn them for trying to do anything to preserve it.

Again, fuck them all as inhumanely as possible.
 
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