The slow road to destruction... Climate change.

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: Genx87

Is it too late to undo the damage unrestrained capitalism has done?

Do you think Communism and Socialism has done better?

Chernobyl, wonderful example of Communism's donation to nature
China, Their rivers are as dirty as they come.

Our nation has doubled our GDP in the past ~15 years and yet our emissions consumption has gone up a fraction of that.

Go tell it to Katrina. :roll:

Oh so now capitalism is to blame for Katrina and the destruction from it? lmao

No, capitalism isn't to blame. But the major proponent of what is now regarded as capitalism, that guy in The White House who ignores science in favor of "faith based" inititaives, that guy who ignored Kyoto, whose "Clear Skies" legislation is a text book study on how to create dirty skies, that guy is to blame. And what he's supposedly selling America with his feed the rich, starve the poor "capitalist" policies is too.

🙂

This is getting better by the minute.

Tell me more

 

[xolademoness]

Originally posted by: Jmman
Most scientists, even the ones who staunchly believe that manmade emissions are to blame, will admit that there is no practical method to reduce emissions to the point that it will have a visible impact.

Even if it's impossible to stop the runaway train of climate change, we can at least accept that things are going to change a lot and prepare for what's coming... The problem is there's just so much denial and corporate/government PR/propaganda flying around that so many people just don't realise how serious the problem is, and what the consequences are...

 

[Jmman]

Originally posted by: xolademoness

Originally posted by: Jmman
Most scientists, even the ones who staunchly believe that manmade emissions are to blame, will admit that there is no practical method to reduce emissions to the point that it will have a visible impact.

Even if it's impossible to stop the runaway train of climate change, we can at least accept that things are going to change a lot and prepare for what's coming... The problem is there's just so much denial and corporate/government PR/propaganda flying around that so many people just don't realise how serious the problem is, and what the consequences are...

I for one am already getting prepared. I sold my beachhouse and invested in a company that sells suntan lotion.....🙂

 

[Forsythe]

Originally posted by: Jmman
Isn't this really "much ado about nothing?" Most scientists, even the ones who staunchly believe that manmade emissions are to blame, will admit that there is no practical method to reduce emissions to the point that it will have a visible impact.

So?

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: Jmman
Isn't this really "much ado about nothing?" Most scientists, even the ones who staunchly believe that manmade emissions are to blame, will admit that there is no practical method to reduce emissions to the point that it will have a visible impact.

Even though I don't fully support the correlation -> causation of global warming, I do support reducing pollution as much as possible and tracking to see if it does affect it as much.

Short-term thinking and stop gap measures do nothing to improve the future.

 

[Forsythe]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: Forsythe
Dude. We passed the natural high shown by the vostok cores about 60 years ago.
Besides, you are confusing the "stable" age of earth we are living in now with the ages where there were massive volcanoes all around and no oxygen in the atmosphere (well, less anyways).

Wow, so we passed an unpredictable peak! Gee! We diverted from a measurement that had significant standard deviation *BEFORE* mandkind came around. I bet those algae caused that previous high so long ago, them and their dastardly polluting vehicles and coal power plants, darn them!

I'm gonna focus on this part.

The deviation of Co2 in the atmosphere is higher than ever recorded in this era. We are approaching 400ppm while the natural cycle has never shown more than 300.
All this starting since the industrial revolution.
Now. That Co2 heats the atmosphere, is as far as i know not up for debate. It's generally accepted. I've never heard anyone argue anything else before. Take two containers, fill one with air, fill another one with air but add some co2. Now shine a thermal light at them, after 20 minutes shut both off, the one with added co2 will stay warmer, longer than the air one.
Basically, what you can argue with, is that this is not manmade. Well, we release Co2 into the atmosphere, alot. The increase has started since we started releasing Co2 into the atmosphere.

 

[CanOWorms]

Originally posted by: xolademoness
Sources for global warming: Scientific sites, cold hard facts, climatologists.
Sources for global warming denial: Religious sites, oil/car industry corporate PR, government propaganda.

Anyone can see which is more reliable. 😉

It should be "Sources that deny the apocalyptic-like effects of global warming or believe that humans don't have as large of an effect." A simple Google search would result in many scientists and facts that support them, just like the other way around. It's interesting that you mention religion in this because many global warming fundamentalists are intimidating scientists into silence regarding their beliefs of scepticism. It's like global warming has become a new religion/creationism.

Scientists should be allowed to do their research without intimidation from global warming fundamentalists.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: xolademoness
Sources for global warming: Scientific sites, cold hard facts, climatologists.
Sources for global warming denial: Religious sites, oil/car industry corporate PR, government propaganda.

Anyone can see which is more reliable. 😉

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
No such thing as Global Warming, it's in your head.

Ah, denial, first weapon of choice for the discerning religious fundamentalist...

Bahahahaha calling me a "religious fundamentalist". That's funny :laugh:

 

[nCred]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/shared/spl/hi/p...s/04/sci_nat_enl_1092666337/html/1.stm
The temperature reconstruction is based on tree rings, corals, ice cores, historical records.

 

[Forsythe]

Originally posted by: CanOWorms

Originally posted by: xolademoness
Sources for global warming: Scientific sites, cold hard facts, climatologists.
Sources for global warming denial: Religious sites, oil/car industry corporate PR, government propaganda.

Anyone can see which is more reliable. 😉

It should be "Sources that deny the apocalyptic-like effects of global warming or believe that humans don't have as large of an effect." A simple Google search would result in many scientists and facts that support them, just like the other way around. It's interesting that you mention religion in this because many global warming fundamentalists are intimidating scientists into silence regarding their beliefs of scepticism. It's like global warming has become a new religion/creationism.

Scientists should be allowed to do their research without intimidation from global warming fundamentalists.

Heh, a lesson about fundamentalism from you? Amazing.

 

[CanOWorms]

Originally posted by: Forsythe

Originally posted by: CanOWorms

Originally posted by: xolademoness
Sources for global warming: Scientific sites, cold hard facts, climatologists.
Sources for global warming denial: Religious sites, oil/car industry corporate PR, government propaganda.

Anyone can see which is more reliable. 😉

It should be "Sources that deny the apocalyptic-like effects of global warming or believe that humans don't have as large of an effect." A simple Google search would result in many scientists and facts that support them, just like the other way around. It's interesting that you mention religion in this because many global warming fundamentalists are intimidating scientists into silence regarding their beliefs of scepticism. It's like global warming has become a new religion/creationism.

Scientists should be allowed to do their research without intimidation from global warming fundamentalists.

Heh, a lesson about fundamentalism from you? Amazing.

If you're talking about my views against Europe's genocides, then you're the fundamentalist, not me.

 

[Forsythe]

Originally posted by: CanOWorms

Originally posted by: Forsythe

Originally posted by: CanOWorms

Originally posted by: xolademoness
Sources for global warming: Scientific sites, cold hard facts, climatologists.
Sources for global warming denial: Religious sites, oil/car industry corporate PR, government propaganda.

Anyone can see which is more reliable. 😉

It should be "Sources that deny the apocalyptic-like effects of global warming or believe that humans don't have as large of an effect." A simple Google search would result in many scientists and facts that support them, just like the other way around. It's interesting that you mention religion in this because many global warming fundamentalists are intimidating scientists into silence regarding their beliefs of scepticism. It's like global warming has become a new religion/creationism.

Scientists should be allowed to do their research without intimidation from global warming fundamentalists.

Heh, a lesson about fundamentalism from you? Amazing.

If you're talking about my views against Europe's genocides, then you're the fundamentalist, not me.

I'm willing to discuss it but i've seen no evidence to point towards such things. However you are not willing to talk about it. Look up the meaning of fundamentalist.

 

[CanOWorms]

Originally posted by: Forsythe

I'm willing to discuss it but i've seen no evidence to point towards such things. However you are not willing to talk about it. Look up the meaning of fundamentalist.

No, you are not willing to discuss it. You still repeatedly deny France's Rwanda genocide like some sort of Holocaust denier.

Yours is a call for the return to historical European values of the previous centuries. I support the opposite, progressive view.

 

[Forsythe]

Originally posted by: CanOWorms

Originally posted by: Forsythe

I'm willing to discuss it but i've seen no evidence to point towards such things. However you are not willing to talk about it. Look up the meaning of fundamentalist.

No, you are not willing to discuss it. You still repeatedly deny France's Rwanda genocide like some sort of Holocaust denier.

Yours is a call for the return to historical European values of the previous centuries. I support the opposite, progressive view.

I don't want to return to imperialistic egocentrical states no, which is where US is heading and to some degree certain parts of europe (immigration laws are the only major problem in europe, apart from the fact that some countries mainly the bigger have problems with economically adapting to the new ages.)
Ofcourse, america is showing clear signs of modern imperialism and now you're about to do the same thing that has been the falldown of many european immigration laws. Shutting down. Same as denmark is doing, even though sweden has shown good progress with completely opposite treatments of immigrants, stupid leaders in denmark , us, france, germany, italy are screwing it up.

I'm sorry about this offtopic, i just read the topic, i'll stop now. Worms, if you want to continue this discussion whisper me.

 

[CanOWorms]

Originally posted by: Forsythe

I don't want to return to imperialistic egocentrical states no, which is where US is heading and to some degree certain parts of europe (immigration laws are the only major problem in europe, apart from the fact that some countries mainly the bigger have problems with economically adapting to the new ages.)

Some degree? Europe is still organizing genocides, famines, atrocities, etc. France's Rwanda genocide was one of the most hideous acts of imperialism in decades. Kyoto, ICC, and other imperialistic agendas continue to dominate Europe. Economic nationalism, racial purity, historical whitewashing, etc. all are a return to standard European imperialistic egocentrical states.

I see the US increasing in imperialism under Bush, but I think that the future is going to see that decline with all the backlash the administration is now feeling. In Europe, it's the future.

Ofcourse, america is showing clear signs of modern imperialism and now you're about to do the same thing that has been the falldown of many european immigration laws. Shutting down. Same as denmark is doing, even though sweden has shown good progress with completely opposite treatments of immigrants, stupid leaders in denmark , us, france, germany, italy are screwing it up.

The immigration debates are completely different. The US debates are about illegal immigration. The European debates are about immigration (legal, illegal), refugees, race/ethnicity, racism, integration, etc.

 

[xolademoness]

The Kyoto treaty (for reducing pollution) is "imperialistic"? That's major BS

 

[Forsythe]

Originally posted by: xolademoness
The Kyoto treaty (for reducing pollution) is "imperialistic"? That's major BS

It's canoworms.

There are two major criticisms. Either it's imperialistic trying to prevent others from getting progress.
The other is that it will have no major effect, which is true. But you have to recognize that these are polititians aswell, and they just wanted to do something.
Sad but true.

 

[CanOWorms]

Originally posted by: xolademoness
The Kyoto treaty (for reducing pollution) is "imperialistic"? That's major BS

That is one of the aspects of the treaty. It's no secret that European governments and societies are in decline. Kyoto is an attempt to impede the growth of other countries, thus impeding their (Europe's) quick slide into irrelevance.

The other is to placate the own domestic populations into thinking that they are actually doing something while their country declines culturally, economically, militarily, etc. The population likes to think that they are some sort of moral superpower since that is all they have left. The government propaganda is working great.

 

[Forsythe]

Originally posted by: CanOWorms

Originally posted by: xolademoness
The Kyoto treaty (for reducing pollution) is "imperialistic"? That's major BS

That is one of the aspects of the treaty. It's no secret that European governments and societies are in decline. Kyoto is an attempt to impede the growth of other countries, thus impeding their (Europe's) quick slide into irrelevance.

The other is to placate the own domestic populations into thinking that they are actually doing something while their country declines culturally, economically, militarily, etc. The population likes to think that they are some sort of moral superpower since that is all they have left. The government propaganda is working great.

xolademoness you see what i mean when i said "It's canoworms."


(i love quoting myself)

 

[CanOWorms]

Originally posted by: Forsythe

Originally posted by: CanOWorms

Originally posted by: xolademoness
The Kyoto treaty (for reducing pollution) is "imperialistic"? That's major BS

That is one of the aspects of the treaty. It's no secret that European governments and societies are in decline. Kyoto is an attempt to impede the growth of other countries, thus impeding their (Europe's) quick slide into irrelevance.

The other is to placate the own domestic populations into thinking that they are actually doing something while their country declines culturally, economically, militarily, etc. The population likes to think that they are some sort of moral superpower since that is all they have left. The government propaganda is working great.

xolademoness you see what i mean when i said "It's canoworms."


(i love quoting myself)

Yup, I expose the truth, even to holocaust deniers such as yourself.

 

[ericlp]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Is it too late to undo the damage unrestrained capitalism has done?

Do you think Communism and Socialism has done better?

Chernobyl, wonderful example of Communism's donation to nature
China, Their rivers are as dirty as they come.

Our nation has doubled our GDP in the past ~15 years and yet our emissions consumption has gone up a fraction of that.

yeah since other's are screwing up the world why Not Join them?

Damn dude. We use like what 80% of the worlds oil? We are burning like 3 billion gallons per day.... OINK OINK!!! Nothing compairs to the USA and greenhouse gases...

 

[ajf3]

Higher temps mean less heating oil $$$ needed in the northest == money in my pocket 🙂)

 

[Forsythe]

Originally posted by: ajf3
Higher temps mean less heating oil $$$ needed in the northest == money in my pocket 🙂)

Yeah, who cares about africans dying. I mean, screw the 12.75 million, kdis that die of starvation every year.
That's 35.000 each day.

Lets give it another 2 degrees and i'll bet you we can double that number!

 

[xolademoness]

Originally posted by: CanOWorms

Originally posted by: xolademoness
The Kyoto treaty (for reducing pollution) is "imperialistic"? That's major BS

That is one of the aspects of the treaty. It's no secret that European governments and societies are in decline. Kyoto is an attempt to impede the growth of other countries, thus impeding their (Europe's) quick slide into irrelevance.

The other is to placate the own domestic populations into thinking that they are actually doing something while their country declines culturally, economically, militarily, etc. The population likes to think that they are some sort of moral superpower since that is all they have left. The government propaganda is working great.

^^^ rofl tinhatness