The Power of Nightmares and the Noble Lie

[Narmer]

It seems like the noble lie stressed by Kutab and Strauss were eventually believed by those spreading the fear. Either that or they lost control of their grand project. If Al Qaeda and the United States are the boogeymen of the West and Islamic world, respectfully, then this age of fear will ultimately destroy American values and turn us into cynics.


Google Video-just click on next to see the second and third part of the series

archive.org version

 

[palehorse]

I've been face-to-face with Islamic fascism, and its history goes back hundreds upon hundreds of years. Anyone who would deny it's existence, or label it "fantasy," is absolutely nucking futs.

LOL! that video goes wayyyyy beyond tinfoil... please tell me that you dont seriously buy into that garbage... do you?

 

[imported_Shivetya]

lol

I wonder if parts of the world have less oxygen than others?

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Shivetya
lol

I wonder if parts of the world have less oxygen than others?

Perhaps the same people who purposely condemned the blacks to suffer and die in New Orleans are also responsible for the lower levels of oxygen throughout the world's ghettos?

hmm... I think you're on to something!

LOL...

 

[Narmer]

Originally posted by: palehorse74
I've been face-to-face with Islamic fascism, and its history goes back hundreds upon hundreds of years. Anyone who would deny it's existence, or label it "fantasy," is absolutely nucking futs.

LOL! that video goes wayyyyy beyond tinfoil... please tell me that you dont seriously buy into that garbage... do you?

You've seen them and they've seen you. You've both been bamboozeled. Tool vs. Tool.

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: Narmer
It seems like the noble lie stressed by Kutab and Strauss were eventually believed by those spreading the fear. Either that or they lost control of their grand project. If Al Qaeda and the United States are the boogeymen of the West and Islamic world, respectfully, then this age of fear will ultimately destroy American values and turn us into cynics.


Google Video-just click on next to see the second and third part of the series

archive.org version

This is a war, do you just expect the western civilization to lay down and die in order to prove to the world that we?re above killing and being killed? Reality will catch up to you, after the conflict becomes far worse than it is today, past the point of avoiding nuclear war.

Failing to stop the global ideology today will kill vast amounts of people before this century ends. We may even destroy Iran entirely and fail to prevent the rest of the region from following in its path, protected by the UN. Our actions must be firm and brutal, and we have not acted in that manner since WW2.

I see us failing to take the necessary steps, hounded by the dissent of disbelief. From ourselves, to the UN, there is strong action to protect the opposition in this war as they build the necessary arms. They will soon be capable of making good on their sworn oaths of genocide, the only question remains is if they will. You place the course of the future on them being peaceful, even though it contradicts their religion, their schooling from birth, and their proven track record.

I am not so forgiving to those who tell me they?re going to kill me while loading their gun. For the sake of billions of lives, I hope I?m wrong.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: palehorse74
I've been face-to-face with Islamic fascism, and its history goes back hundreds upon hundreds of years. Anyone who would deny it's existence, or label it "fantasy," is absolutely nucking futs.

LOL! that video goes wayyyyy beyond tinfoil... please tell me that you dont seriously buy into that garbage... do you?

You've seen them and they've seen you. You've both been bamboozeled. Tool vs. Tool.

Ya.. ok... I've looked them straight in the eye and asked them "Why did you kill those people?" - and they usually responded with some variation of "It was for Allah. All is for Allah. Peace and blessings be upon him."

And I'm the one who has been "bamboozled"?!?

wow. So let me get this straight... Some guy named Strauss, from Chicago, knew a guy, who knew some other guy, who told some Muslim guy across the world, to tell other Muslim guys, to go out and kill people?

oh... ok... it's all clear to me now... :roll:

 

[Moonbeam]

The hilarious part of that video is that it used fear mongering to condemn the use of fear.

 

[Narmer]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: palehorse74
I've been face-to-face with Islamic fascism, and its history goes back hundreds upon hundreds of years. Anyone who would deny it's existence, or label it "fantasy," is absolutely nucking futs.

LOL! that video goes wayyyyy beyond tinfoil... please tell me that you dont seriously buy into that garbage... do you?

You've seen them and they've seen you. You've both been bamboozeled. Tool vs. Tool.

Ya.. ok... I've looked them straight in the eye and asked them "Why did you kill those people?" - and they usually responded with some variation of "It was for Allah. All is for Allah. Peace and blessings be upon him."

And I'm the one who has been "bamboozled"?!?

wow. So let me get this straight... Some guy named Strauss, from Chicago, knew a guy, who knew some other guy, who told some Muslim guy across the world, to tell other Muslim guys, to go out and kill people?

oh... ok... it's all clear to me now... :roll:

I can see that you never even watched the documentary. Furthermore, unless you're pretending to be something you're not on this message board, I would call you a card-carrying member of the neoconservative shed. You defend their actions as if it was the American thing to do. Wise up a little bit.

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
The hilarious part of that video is that it used fear mongering to condemn the use of fear.

You didn't enjoy the documentary?

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
The hilarious part of that video is that it used fear mongering to condemn the use of fear.

I didn't get that. I thought it was only portraying the fear mongering of the two parties on the Right, not using it as a tool.

I've seen this before, and I thought it was fairly informative.

 

[cwjerome]

The Power of Nightmares and the Noble Lie

There's a mistake, the Global Warming topic is over that way --------->

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: palehorse74
I've been face-to-face with Islamic fascism, and its history goes back hundreds upon hundreds of years. Anyone who would deny it's existence, or label it "fantasy," is absolutely nucking futs.

LOL! that video goes wayyyyy beyond tinfoil... please tell me that you dont seriously buy into that garbage... do you?

You've seen them and they've seen you. You've both been bamboozeled. Tool vs. Tool.

Ya.. ok... I've looked them straight in the eye and asked them "Why did you kill those people?" - and they usually responded with some variation of "It was for Allah. All is for Allah. Peace and blessings be upon him."

And I'm the one who has been "bamboozled"?!?

wow. So let me get this straight... Some guy named Strauss, from Chicago, knew a guy, who knew some other guy, who told some Muslim guy across the world, to tell other Muslim guys, to go out and kill people?

oh... ok... it's all clear to me now... :roll:

I can see that you never even watched the documentary. Furthermore, unless you're pretending to be something you're not on this message board, I would call you a card-carrying member of the neoconservative shed. You defend their actions as if it was the American thing to do. Wise up a little bit.

I'm not even a member of the Republican party, and I've never voted along party lines... ever.

you can point your tinfoil-wrapped fingers somewhere else...

 

[Termagant]

You can see the hysteria in this thread.

Those who need external threats to feel "whole" were at a loss after the fall of the big bad USSR. "Global Radical Islam" out to kill every one of us can fill the void.

And the Neocon view of "Noble Lies" and the accompanying elitism is about as un-American as a philosophy can get. The Neocons would have been very good Soviets.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
The hilarious part of that video is that it used fear mongering to condemn the use of fear.

I didn't get that. I thought it was only portraying the fear mongering of the two parties on the Right, not using it as a tool.

I've seen this before, and I thought it was fairly informative.

Just listen to the music. Thought it was a horror film.

 

[shadow9d9]

Originally posted by: palehorse74
I've been face-to-face with Islamic fascism, and its history goes back hundreds upon hundreds of years. Anyone who would deny it's existence, or label it "fantasy," is absolutely nucking futs.

LOL! that video goes wayyyyy beyond tinfoil... please tell me that you dont seriously buy into that garbage... do you?

How could you have faced islamic fascism when no such thing exists?

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
The hilarious part of that video is that it used fear mongering to condemn the use of fear.

I didn't get that. I thought it was only portraying the fear mongering of the two parties on the Right, not using it as a tool.

I've seen this before, and I thought it was fairly informative.

Just listen to the music. Thought it was a horror film.

:laugh:

Yeah, I know whatcha mean. But after watching the whole thing, I didn't get the idea you did. I thought it did a good job of explaining how the NeoCons and OBL and al-Zwahiri came to power.

 

[Narmer]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: palehorse74
I've been face-to-face with Islamic fascism, and its history goes back hundreds upon hundreds of years. Anyone who would deny it's existence, or label it "fantasy," is absolutely nucking futs.

LOL! that video goes wayyyyy beyond tinfoil... please tell me that you dont seriously buy into that garbage... do you?

You've seen them and they've seen you. You've both been bamboozeled. Tool vs. Tool.

Ya.. ok... I've looked them straight in the eye and asked them "Why did you kill those people?" - and they usually responded with some variation of "It was for Allah. All is for Allah. Peace and blessings be upon him."

And I'm the one who has been "bamboozled"?!?

wow. So let me get this straight... Some guy named Strauss, from Chicago, knew a guy, who knew some other guy, who told some Muslim guy across the world, to tell other Muslim guys, to go out and kill people?

oh... ok... it's all clear to me now... :roll:

I can see that you never even watched the documentary. Furthermore, unless you're pretending to be something you're not on this message board, I would call you a card-carrying member of the neoconservative shed. You defend their actions as if it was the American thing to do. Wise up a little bit.

I'm not even a member of the Republican party, and I've never voted along party lines... ever.

you can point your tinfoil-wrapped fingers somewhere else...

You don't have to be a Republican to be a member of this tool-shed. All you need is to fear that great evil, islamic fascism, seek to destroy it in all its forms. Seekth thine Devil and destroy thee.

Originally posted by: shadow9d9

Originally posted by: palehorse74
I've been face-to-face with Islamic fascism, and its history goes back hundreds upon hundreds of years. Anyone who would deny it's existence, or label it "fantasy," is absolutely nucking futs.

LOL! that video goes wayyyyy beyond tinfoil... please tell me that you dont seriously buy into that garbage... do you?

How could you have faced islamic fascism when no such thing exists?

lol, he's a tool alright.

 

[cwjerome]

Originally posted by: Termagant
You can see the hysteria in this thread.

Those who need external threats to feel "whole" were at a loss after the fall of the big bad USSR. "Global Radical Islam" out to kill every one of us can fill the void.

And the Neocon view of "Noble Lies" and the accompanying elitism is about as un-American as a philosophy can get. The Neocons would have been very good Soviets.

You thinking people who see a realistic view of the world need external threats to feel "whole" says a lot more about your state of mind... but I don't expect you to understand that.

After all, the "big bad" USSR's totalitarianism, 30 million dead, and ideological imperialism was excused and minimized, just as the same self-hating blame America first tools today excuse and minimize the current threat.

Talking about "hysteria" and how Islam is "out to kill every one of us" is an immature fantasy people like you have dreamed up to rationalize your crackbrained attitude towards facing radical Islam.

Your post, and the OP, is a wake-up call for rational people. Normal people will vigorously debate and discuss what do do and how to do it. Extremist, almost comical cries that we've all been duped by a conspiracy, and there is NO threat, will be tucked safely into the "delirious fringe" category. Pity.

 

[imported_Shivetya]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Shivetya
lol

I wonder if parts of the world have less oxygen than others?

Perhaps the same people who purposely condemned the blacks to suffer and die in New Orleans are also responsible for the lower levels of oxygen throughout the world's ghettos?

hmm... I think you're on to something!

LOL...

you mean the democrats who condemned them to live in hovels because their incessant social engineering took the will to succeed from the people they claimed to be helping? You mean after years of local democrat rule the systems in place to help people were so corrupt with graft and nepotism that they failed to function?

 

[Narmer]

Originally posted by: cwjerome

Originally posted by: Termagant
You can see the hysteria in this thread.

Those who need external threats to feel "whole" were at a loss after the fall of the big bad USSR. "Global Radical Islam" out to kill every one of us can fill the void.

And the Neocon view of "Noble Lies" and the accompanying elitism is about as un-American as a philosophy can get. The Neocons would have been very good Soviets.

You thinking people who see a realistic view of the world need external threats to feel "whole" says a lot more about your state of mind... but I don't expect you to understand that.

After all, the "big bad" USSR's totalitarianism, 30 million dead, and ideological imperialism was excused and minimized, just as the same self-hating blame America first tools today excuse and minimize the current threat.

Talking about "hysteria" and how Islam is "out to kill every one of us" is an immature fantasy people like you have dreamed up to rationalize your crackbrained attitude towards facing radical Islam.

Your post, and the OP, is a wake-up call for rational people. Normal people will vigorously debate and discuss what do do and how to do it. Extremist, almost comical cries that we've all been duped by a conspiracy, and there is NO threat, will be tucked safely into the "delirious fringe" category. Pity.

If you actually watched the video you would see that the neocons hyped the Soviet threat to fantasy levels in the 1970s and 1980s. When the Soviets wanted to have a graceful pullout of Afghanistan the neocons (Richard Pearle) told them to just leave. As Gorbachev feared, Afghanistan turned into an Islamist state and everybody forgot about it. After the fall of the Soviet Union, the neocons tried to make Clinton the new boogeyman, but failed. They were lost until their ideological "enemy" came around and flew those planes on 9/11.

In simple terms, you can think of the neoconservative movement and the Islamo-fascist as Likud and Hamas. Both need each other to survive. If there was peace, it would be bad for business. Hence, they create their boogeymen.

EDIT: There is a threat, but it takes good, old-fashion common sense and police work to take care of that threat. Not some Global War on Terror. Terrorism can never be defeated with bombs and bullets.

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: cwjerome
The Power of Nightmares and the Noble Lie

There's a mistake, the Global Warming topic is over that way --------->

So is the fear over neo-cons. They have their straw men, it just doesn't happen to include nuclear weapons in foreign hands, they only fear our own hand. That?s the point isn?t it? Got to paint America as an evil that we must fear and defeat, so they can elect liberals to save us from America.

 

[DealMonkey]

Anyone with two brain cells to rub together realizes that you can't fight an asynchronous war with your giant army marching around the globe like a bunch of goons. In that sense, the current "War on Terror" as exercised by our idiot leaders is an example of what not to do when confronted with a terrorist threat. Additionally, there is no (non-political) reason to exaggerate the threat and spread fear - the American people will eventually abandon you once they figure it out (see "Operation Iraqi Freedom" for proof of concept). By the same token, there's no reason to diminish the threat either. Let's deal with reality here people.

 

[conjur]

Wow, look at the Bushbots fall over themselves to attack this excellent BBC documentary with all sorts of ridiculous crap. It's obviously struck a nerve deep in the psyche of the mentally facile.

There's plenty of other places to look for confirmation that the neocons (and even the Clinton administration) helped create the "mystique" of a large, organized "Al Qaeda".

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Jaskalas

Originally posted by: cwjerome
The Power of Nightmares and the Noble Lie

There's a mistake, the Global Warming topic is over that way --------->

So is the fear over neo-cons. They have their straw men, it just doesn't happen to include nuclear weapons in foreign hands, they only fear our own hand. That?s the point isn?t it? Got to paint America as an evil that we must fear and defeat, so they can elect liberals to save us from America.

I don't know about you, but I'd prefer a political group that is all in favor of rationally dealing with problems that come our way without resorting to overly dramatic "Fight for the Free World" speeches at every bump in the road. Some group who respects ALL the parts of the constitution enough to be concerned about expanding government police powers without charging anyone with being worse than Hitler, and a group who understands the need to fight terrorism without making it our one and only national priority and turning what should be a fight against a fairly small group of radicals into a religious war against potentially hundreds of millions of people. Maybe dealing with illegal immigration or changing moral values in society about sex and marriage without suggesting the end our of very way of life is upon us ever five minutes.

Seriously, your morons are wearing me out. This is supposed to be the land of optimism, and instead it's all about who is going to destroy us unless we absolutely do something RIGHT NOW!!! About the only difference between the various sides here is what that agent of destruction is, the idea that we can rationally deal with events in a measured way seems totally alien to the vast majority of people in this country. Maybe it's just that the folks who benefit from the fear are good at manipulating people, I don't know. But I'm worried when comparisons between Bush and Hitler and depictions of fighting terrorism as a "war for the free world" evoke fearful nods of agreement instead of eye rolling and snorts of derision. There is something very fundamentally wrong with us, I just hope we get over it.