The Peace Process between Israel and Palestine and the US Military

[Narmer]

One of the basic tenets of Al Qaeda is that no American will find safety until Palestine is free. While this has meant that, instead of focusing on the near enemy of Egypt, Israel, Saudi Arabia, the Islamic jihadists turned their sights on America, the far enemy, the words have become very true in every sense. Since 1993 Al Qaeda has been waging war against America. Their big break came in 2001 and now we find ourselves fighting them across the Earth, with two major wars since 2001. It has become obvious that the Palestinian issue and our subsequent invasion of two muslim countries is what makes Al Qaeda's recruitment offices standing-room only, despite the fact that we've decamped from their holiest place, Saudi Arabia. Therefore, it seems logical that we can save American lives by trying extra hard on the Palestinian front and not letting our ally Israel exploit our friendship and continue building more settlements on Palestinian land, including East Jerusalem. I think our job would be easier if we put more pressure on the right-wing Israeli government to make more than a token effort on making peace with their Palestinian neighbors. Of course, it would also help if we put more pressure on our Arab allies to become more democratic. They too are exploiting our friendship. All this makes America looks hypocritical and undermines our long-term strength for a bunch of peccadilloes who would not last without our assistance.

 

[JEDIYoda]

One of the basic tenets of Al Qaeda is that no American will find safety until Palestine is free. While this has meant that, instead of focusing on the near enemy of Egypt, Israel, Saudi Arabia, the Islamic jihadists turned their sights on America, the far enemy, the words have become very true in every sense. Since 1993 Al Qaeda has been waging war against America. Their big break came in 2001 and now we find ourselves fighting them across the Earth, with two major wars since 2001. It has become obvious that the Palestinian issue and our subsequent invasion of two muslim countries is what makes Al Qaeda's recruitment offices standing-room only, despite the fact that we've decamped from their holiest place, Saudi Arabia. Therefore, it seems logical that we can save American lives by trying extra hard on the Palestinian front and not letting our ally Israel exploit our friendship and continue building more settlements on Palestinian land, including East Jerusalem. I think our job would be easier if we put more pressure on the right-wing Israeli government to make more than a token effort on making peace with their Palestinian neighbors. Of course, it would also help if we put more pressure on our Arab allies to become more democratic. They too are exploiting our friendship. All this makes America looks hypocritical and undermines our long-term strength for a bunch of peccadilloes who would not last without our assistance.

your point?

 

[OCGuy]

I'm American. I find a lot of safety.

I don't care what their reasoning is, as long as Obama and the CIA keep killing them.

I have a feeling we feel much more safe here than the goat-shaggers in the caves in Pakistan/Afghanistan feel there.

 

[Sclamoz]

On Jan. 16, two days after a killer earthquake hit Haiti, a team of senior military officers from the U.S. Central Command (responsible for overseeing American security interests in the Middle East), arrived at the Pentagon to brief Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Adm. Michael Mullen on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. The team had been dispatched by CENTCOM commander Gen. David Petraeus to underline his growing worries at the lack of progress in resolving the issue. The 33-slide, 45-minute PowerPoint briefing stunned Mullen. The briefers reported that there was a growing perception among Arab leaders that the U.S. was incapable of standing up to Israel, that CENTCOM's mostly Arab constituency was losing faith in American promises, that Israeli intransigence on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict was jeopardizing U.S. standing in the region, and that Mitchell himself was (as a senior Pentagon officer later bluntly described it) "too old, too slow ... and too late."

The January Mullen briefing was unprecedented. No previous CENTCOM commander had ever expressed himself on what is essentially a political issue; which is why the briefers were careful to tell Mullen that their conclusions followed from a December 2009 tour of the region where, on Petraeus's instructions, they spoke to senior Arab leaders. "Everywhere they went, the message was pretty humbling," a Pentagon officer familiar with the briefing says. "America was not only viewed as weak, but its military posture in the region was eroding."

The Mullen briefing and Petraeus's request hit the White House like a bombshell. While Petraeus's request that CENTCOM be expanded to include the Palestinians was denied ("it was dead on arrival," a Pentagon officer confirms), the Obama administration decided it would redouble its efforts -- pressing Israel once again on the settlements issue, sending Mitchell on a visit to a number of Arab capitals and dispatching Mullen for a carefully arranged meeting with the chief of the Israeli General Staff, Lt. General Gabi Ashkenazi. While the American press speculated that Mullen's trip focused on Iran, the JCS Chairman actually carried a blunt, and tough, message on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict: that Israel had to see its conflict with the Palestinians "in a larger, regional, context" -- as having a direct impact on America's status in the region. Certainly, it was thought, Israel would get the message.

Israel didn't. When Vice President Joe Biden was embarrassed by an Israeli announcement that the Netanyahu government was building 1,600 new homes in East Jerusalem, the administration reacted. But no one was more outraged than Biden who, according to the Israeli daily Yedioth Ahronoth, engaged in a private, and angry, exchange with the Israeli Prime Minister. Not surprisingly, what Biden told Netanyahu reflected the importance the administration attached to Petraeus's Mullen briefing: "This is starting to get dangerous for us," Biden reportedly told Netanyahu. "What you're doing here undermines the security of our troops who are fighting in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan. That endangers us and it endangers regional peace." Yedioth Ahronoth went on to report: "The vice president told his Israeli hosts that since many people in the Muslim world perceived a connection between Israel's actions and US policy, any decision about construction that undermines Palestinian rights in East Jerusalem could have an impact on the personal safety of American troops fighting against Islamic terrorism." The message couldn't be plainer: Israel's intransigence could cost American lives.

There are important and powerful lobbies in America: the NRA, the American Medical Association, the lawyers -- and the Israeli lobby. But no lobby is as important, or as powerful, as the U.S. military. While commentators and pundits might reflect that Joe Biden's trip to Israel has forever shifted America's relationship with its erstwhile ally in the region, the real break came in January, when David Petraeus sent a briefing team to the Pentagon with a stark warning: America's relationship with Israel is important, but not as important as the lives of America's soldiers. Maybe Israel gets the message now.

http://mideast.foreignpolicy.com/po..._biden_s_embarrassment_is_not_the_whole_story

I just read this article the other day, it seems relevant to the point I think you're making.

 

[Narmer]

http://mideast.foreignpolicy.com/po..._biden_s_embarrassment_is_not_the_whole_story

I just read this article the other day, it seems relevant to the point I think you're making.

Hey, thanks for that. It's been nearly two decades but I guess America is starting to take the Arab view seriously. And it is a very serious matter wrt our troops and American citizens' safety. Hopefully, gone are the days where we can brush off their concerns. Add the trillions of dollars we've spent chasing these cave dwellers and have gotten no closer to ending this 'war on terror', I think this new focus is warranted. Of course, we should not let the undemocratic arabs off the hook.

 

[Narmer]

your point?

After reading your sig, it seems that you would never accept my point.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Get the Arab sponsors of the Palestinian militants to allow Israel to live without threats from the Gaza, WB and Lebanon.

Get the militants to stop trying to pick a fight with Israel.

When Israel feels safe, then there will be progress to reduce tensions.

While Israel feels that there are forces aligned against it that are determiend to exterminate it, she is not going to cooperate with what the peace lovers want to hand over to the Arabs.

 

[HannibalX]

It's funny to me that the Arab/Persian world makes such a huge deal over Palestine but the truth is that group of people does not want the Palestinians in their countries either. They talk big but when it comes to actually helping them or accepting them as citizens, forget it. They are the black sheep of the middle-eastern family.

 

[woolfe9999]

Get the Arab sponsors of the Palestinian militants to allow Israel to live without threats from the Gaza, WB and Lebanon.

Get the militants to stop trying to pick a fight with Israel.

When Israel feels safe, then there will be progress to reduce tensions.

While Israel feels that there are forces aligned against it that are determiend to exterminate it, she is not going to cooperate with what the peace lovers want to hand over to the Arabs.

I dunno, I'm generally pro-Israel, but I have to call foul on these building projects, particuarly their timing. I think if Israel wants the upper hand here in a political and diplomatic sense, what harm would it do to Israel to totally suspend all these building projects for a period of time? If the Pals keep up their terror rampage in spite of a freeze, and they still can't be credible partners in a peace negotiation, then Israel will have made its point. But they can't even make that point because they just can't seem to stop building, even if only temporarily. Not only is their point undermined by not being put to the true test, but they are also now risking alienation of the U.S. which could be disastrous for them in the long run. I'm afraid the current government in Israel needs a reality check and needs to get its priorities straight, for Israel's own good.

- wolf

 

[Narmer]

Get the Arab sponsors of the Palestinian militants to allow Israel to live without threats from the Gaza, WB and Lebanon.

Get the militants to stop trying to pick a fight with Israel.

When Israel feels safe, then there will be progress to reduce tensions.

While Israel feels that there are forces aligned against it that are determiend to exterminate it, she is not going to cooperate with what the peace lovers want to hand over to the Arabs.

Well, with such a vague goal of Israel feeling 'safe', I think they'll get their wish of turning this into some type of philosophical debate while continuously expanding further into the WB. Useless, if you ask me. Worse, the same could be said of the Palestinians but you wouldn't give them that, would you?

 

[QuantumPion]

I'm pretty sure that even if Israel went to back to the 1949 UN borders and gave the Palestinians their own state with Jerusalem as the capital, they would still use violence and demand even more.

 

[EagleKeeper]

I'm pretty sure that even if Israel went to back to the 1949 UN borders and gave the Palestinians their own state with Jerusalem as the capital, they would still use violence and demand even more.

Remember, the '49 UN borders were not acceptable to the Arabs and the Palestinians.

Those that are sponsoring the militants want it all no matter what the cost is to the Palestinians. After all, the sponsors ar not placing their lives on the line.

 

[Noobtastic]

I dunno, I'm generally pro-Israel, but I have to call foul on these building projects, particuarly their timing. I think if Israel wants the upper hand here in a political and diplomatic sense, what harm would it do to Israel to totally suspend all these building projects for a period of time? If the Pals keep up their terror rampage in spite of a freeze, and they still can't be credible partners in a peace negotiation, then Israel will have made its point. But they can't even make that point because they just can't seem to stop building, even if only temporarily. Not only is their point undermined by not being put to the true test, but they are also now risking alienation of the U.S. which could be disastrous for them in the long run. I'm afraid the current government in Israel needs a reality check and needs to get its priorities straight, for Israel's own good.

- wolf

Yeah, Israel announcing to build homes in an already-Jewish neighborhood that was created 4 years before the bogus peace process began (and the jerusalem is teh capiteel of falestine11!!!) that would be part of Israeli sovereignty regardless.

Every agreement rejected by the Palestians places Ramot Shalom in Israel sovereignty, so who cares? Israel already said it wasn't going to stop Jewish growth in Jerusalem, just as it wasn't going to stop Arab squatters in Jerusalem.

Obama knew this, and knew Israel was going to announce this because it was standard and planned for over a decade. Construction wouldn't begin until 2015 anyways. Probably later.

Palestinians KNEW Israel was going to announce this, and pre-emptively stated they were going to "negotiate" after 1 year of stalling. Then they say Israel torpedoed the peace process, and Obama parrots the PLO narrative because he is ignorant as fuck.

Think about. 1 year of stalling, and then 2 days before the announcement all of the sudden declare their love for negotiation.

bullshit.

Now there are massive riots in Jerusalem. A police officer has been shot and 15 have been wounded. hundreds of Palestinians arrested and West Bank closed for the week.

Good job Barack Obama. Way to fuck over our ally and support our enemies.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704416904575121710380216280.html

Obama has shown his true colors. Everyone knew he was lying when he said Jerusalem is the undivided capital of Israel during his campaign.

Obama is a fuckin liar.

 

[Zebo]

Obama is a POS, it's well established domestically even most liberals agree he's a lair just go to DU for an hour or two but making such a big deal over Ramat Shlomo while same day Fatah honors the terrorist who carried out the massacre on the Coast Road in 1978 proves it was just an excuse to pick a fight with Israel. Israel needs to tell USA to go fuck herself and get busy.