The other side of the coin-Customer bad behavior irks servers

[tyler811]

There are two sides to every tale -- and table -- so we also asked servers to share their complaints about customers.

The employees quoted here asked to be identified only by a first name or initial and city of residence, to avoid repercussions at their jobs.
Most concerns came down to tips -- their main source of income. Several noted that few people understand how they are compensated.

http://www.freep.com/article/20100513/ENT08/5130432/1319/



The other side:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2075046

 

[IronWing]

Apply minimum wage laws to restaurant employees.

 

[Cuda1447]

Wait a second, according to that article, if I tip 10% of my check, the waiter won't make any money? But if I tip 20% they will make a bit.... so anything under 10% is a waste? That doesn't make sense. If this is true than thats bullshit how the restaurant industry works and these people shouldn't be working off of tips.

 

[JEDI]

The most detailed explanation came from T in Farmington Hills, who wrote, in part: "I must pay tips and taxes on what you spend, not what you tip. In simple terms, if your bill is $100, I owe Uncle Sam 8% (plus) 5% to the bartender (whether you drink or not) and 10% to 15% to a bus person." Other employees may also get a cut. "If you leave $20 (on a $100 check), I get $12. If you leave $10, I have worked for free."

WHAT?!
8+5+10 = 23%

so for a waiter just to breakeven ($0 income), i should tip 23%?!

 

[Key West]

The most detailed explanation came from T in Farmington Hills, who wrote, in part: "I must pay tips and taxes on what you spend, not what you tip. In simple terms, if your bill is $100, I owe Uncle Sam 8% (plus) 5% to the bartender (whether you drink or not) and 10% to 15% to a bus person." Other employees may also get a cut. "If you leave $20 (on a $100 check), I get $12. If you leave $10, I have worked for free."

WHAT?!
8+5+10 = 23%

so for a waiter just to breakeven ($0 income), i should tip 23%?!

There is a reason why he's a waiter.

 

[pontifex]

The most detailed explanation came from T in Farmington Hills, who wrote, in part: "I must pay tips and taxes on what you spend, not what you tip. In simple terms, if your bill is $100, I owe Uncle Sam 8% (plus) 5% to the bartender (whether you drink or not) and 10% to 15% to a bus person." Other employees may also get a cut. "If you leave $20 (on a $100 check), I get $12. If you leave $10, I have worked for free."

WHAT?!
8+5+10 = 23%

so for a waiter just to breakeven ($0 income), i should tip 23%?!

lmao! i was just going to post this too. Glad I'm not the only one that doesn't understand this line of thinking.

 

[BoomerD]

EDIT: Silly me...I mis-spoke...Servers are presumed to get at least 8% tips for their total, and will most likely be taxed on 8% minimum of their total receipts unless they claim their tips accurately. When a restaurant reports less than 8% total tips, they can be required to allocate tips:

"Many restaurant employers and restaurant employees may have heard the false rumor that tip-earners only need to report tips equal to 8% (or perhaps some other number, such as 10%) of their sales. That's a widespread misconception. The law requires employees to report and pay taxes on 100% of the tips they keep after tip-outs. It's that simple.

The 8% figure is simply a threshold below which many employers must allocate tips and report certain additional information to the IRS. The IRS can use this information to flag restaurants where employees may be underreporting tips."
http://www.hospitalityguild.com/GuidePro/Management/Taxtips.htm#eight


The rest is strictly a restaurant policy.
IMO, there's something wrong when a restaurant can get away with paying its tipped employees $2.13/hr and depending on the customer to make up the balance of the minimum wage.
Fortunately, Kahleeforneeya and a few other states require restaurants to pay the "FULL minimum wage" and tips are "extra income" over and above the minimum wage.

I've travelled a lot in my years working construction and there seemed to be very little difference in price when eating in chain restaurants in the states that allowed sub-minimum wage and in those that don't. Often, the difference might be more attributed to different costs of living, property costs, property taxes, etc., rather than the increase in labor costs.

 

[slayer202]

how do they tax you 8% regardless of tip...that makes no sense at all

tipping is bullshit though anyway so...

 

[Jumpem]

All they do is place your order and carry two plates across a room. That really isn't worth more than $1-2.

 

[Jumpem]

I know that as a rule, servers are taxed 8% on their checks.

I really don't buy this. Have a link?

 

[ShawnD1]

I have an awesome idea for all waiters: go work at McDonalds. They pay a straight wage, you get 50% off everything, and you can steal as much soap and garbage bags as you want because they don't take inventory on those.

That McD degreaser shit is awesome. I soaked some of my tools in it and all of the oil came off like nothing.

 

[JEDI]

I know that as a rule, servers are taxed 8% on their checks.

link?

 

[MikeyIs4Dcats]

I really don't buy this. Have a link?

http://www.irs.gov/publications/p531/ar02.html

 

[Jumpem]

http://www.irs.gov/publications/p531/ar02.html

Looks like that 8% figure is only if the server doesn't claim at least 8% in tips.

 

[freakflag]

I tip 20% every time. If that's not enough for you, go pound salt. Paying $20 for a steak is bad enough.

 

[MikeyIs4Dcats]

Looks like that 8% figure is only if the server doesn't claim at least 8% in tips.

no, it's for places that allocate tips. Not all restaurants let servers keep the tips. Many require they be pooled or are collected by the restaurant via credit card, etc. and then are doled out to the servers.

 

[newnameman]

Looks like that 8% figure is only if the server doesn't claim at least 8% in tips.

And even then, that only applies if the employee doesn't keep a daily tip record.

 

[ShawnD1]

http://www.irs.gov/publications/p531/ar02.html

I'm sorry but I don't think that's what it says. This is what your link says, and I'll try to translate.

Allocated Tips

If your employer allocated tips to you, they are shown separately in box 8 of your Form W-2. They are not included in box 1 with your wages and reported tips. If box 8 is blank, this discussion does not apply to you.
What are allocated tips? These are tips that your employer assigned to you in addition to the tips you reported to your employer for the year.

So for starters, you have regular tips that come from customers. You report this number to your employer. On top of this, your employer can give you "allocated tips" under certain conditions.

Your employer will have done this (allocated tips) only if:

*

You worked in a restaurant, cocktail lounge, or similar business that must allocate tips to employees,
*

The tips you reported to your employer were less than your share of 8% of food and drink sales, and
*

You did not participate in your employer's Attributed Tip Income Program (ATIP).

How were your allocated tips figured? The tips allocated to you are your share of an amount figured by subtracting the reported tips of all employees from 8% (or an approved lower rate) of food and drink sales (other than carryout sales and sales with a service charge of 10% or more). Your share of that amount was figured using either a method provided by an employer-employee agreement or a method provided by IRS regulations based on employees' sales or hours worked. For information about the exact allocation method used, ask your employer.

Um.. so it sounds like tips are pooled together somewhat.
*The expectation is that each individual waiter gets an 8% tip consistently, and you report your tip earnings to your boss.
*If the business sells 1 million dollars worth of food, then 8% of this, or $80,000 is allocated as tips for ALL waiters.
*If the waiters only collectively reported $70,000 in tips, then the employer must pay out $10,000 among the people who did not earn their 8%.
*People who earned more than 8% do not get any allocated tips


The interesting part about this is that most people tip more than 8%. I don't work in the food industry, but I would guess that it's extremely rare that a company would need to pay allocated tips. What this means is that if an individual waiter's tip percentage for the year is less than 8%, too bad so sad since the entire staff collectively beat the 8% and allocated tips are not required. If you stiff the waiter with no tip, he really doesn't get a tip. HE IS NOT REQUIRED TO PAY MONEY TO ANYONE.

 

[SirStev0]

ITT: A bunch of people who have no idea what they are talking about trying to excuse their cheapness.

20% should be the min esp if you plan on coming back often.

I'm 24 years old, still in school (so broke) and I always tip very well. Solely because I know I will get better service with each visit. I can walk into our busiest bar in town and immediately get a drink no matter what. Why? Because the bartenders know I am good to them.

 

[goog40]

8% is reported as taxable income, it doesn't mean they're paying $8 in taxes on a $100 bill. It's probably more like paying 0.8% or 1.2% in taxes on the bill, assuming a 10% or 15% tax bracket (I know many waiters can make enough to be in higher tax brackets, but underreporting of cash tips has to be rampant in the industry).

 

[Triumph]

The problem that I have with tipping, and more specifically, tipping poorly (which I will do if justified), is that the waiter/waitress rarely if ever considers that it may have been because of his/her service. I'm betting that 99% of the time they chalk it up to "yet another asshole customer." I don't really care, though, if you do or do not realize your mistakes or adjust your service. You give me shitty service from my perspective (which is all I care about), then I'm giving you a shitty tip. I don't care about how its taxed or distributed among the employees or whatever.

 

[ahenkel]

Apply minimum wage laws to restaurant employees.

I"m always baffled by the whole we can pay you less because you get tips rule. Living in Oregon its against employment laws to do that. You have to get paid at least minimum wage and the employer can't pay you less if you get tips.

 

[JEDI]

I"m always baffled by the whole we can pay you less because you get tips rule. Living in Oregon its against employment laws to do that. You have to get paid at least minimum wage and the employer can't pay you less if you get tips.

do people still tip in Oregon?

if yes, do they tip less than the rest of the country?

 

[ahenkel]

do people still tip in Oregon?

if yes, do they tip less than the rest of the country?

I haven't taken a formal survey but I do tend to see tips on tables when I go out to eat, and everyone I know are fairly generous tippers.

I like tipping here because I know I'm rewarding someone because their service impressed me. I don't feel like I have to do it because their pay check will be smaller if I don't

 

[waggy]

8% is reported as taxable income, it doesn't mean they're paying $8 in taxes on a $100 bill. It's probably more like paying 0.8% or 1.2% in taxes on the bill, assuming a 10% or 15% tax bracket (I know many waiters can make enough to be in higher tax brackets, but underreporting of cash tips has to be rampant in the industry).

thats what iw as thinking. they aren't paying $8 in taxes on a $100 bill.

anyway. i tip what the person earns. i start at %20 and go down if crappy. i have no trouble leaveing a dollar tip if thats what they ear. I also have no trouble leaving a lot more then%20 if they earn that.

a tip is sopposed to be provided for outstanding service. now its a extra fee that many feel they deserve even for shitty service. some even expect they should get 30-50 tip. fuck that.